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Need WD45 6v wiring diagram |
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Les Kerf
Orange Level Joined: 08 May 2020 Location: Idaho Points: 777 |
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Interesting. I have owned several of these (still do) and never had that problem; it is pretty easy to check parasitic current draw with a good VOM.
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Steve in NJ
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Andover, NJ Points: 11788 |
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The Doc is correct. If anything sits long enough with a one wire Alternator connected directly to the Battery, the Alternator acts as a dynamo and will drain a Battery down to dead. Just depends on the Battery and the electronics in the Alternator. I always preach to my customer's, one of the best things you can invest in is a good Battery shut off switch. If the vehicle sits for long periods of time before its used, its always a good practice to sever the Battery from the vehicle. Doesn't matter what the vehicle is. Its either that, or remove the Battery from the vehicle and put it in an area where you can put a Battery tender on it to keep the Battery "active". You'll get the longevity out of the Battery keeping it active. If it gets pretty cold in your area, remove the Battery and bring it in to a warmer area and put a tender on it. Luke, take your Generator to a local rebuilder and have him throw it on his machine and have him do some load tests on it to see if the unit is working as it should. If it passes all load tests that are put on it, in your mind you know the Gennies good. Then move on to the next item. Make sure the 3 position switch isn't cooked. If it looks okay visually where it doesn't look like it got hot or anything, clean up the instrument box where it bolts to to make sure its grounded correctly. Next would be to inspect the wiring. If any of it is questionable rewire it via the wiring diagram Steve posted for ya. Lastly, have the Battery your using draw tested to make sure your power supply is in tip top shape to use. There's only 3 cells to a 6V Battery, so if you have one cell starting to go away, you've lost a lot of your power source. And a bad cell or low cell can cause the Generator to start a high charge because the low or bad cell in the Battery is putting a load on the system. Once all of that is taken care of, there's no reason in the world why the 6V system won't work correctly. We're not liftin' the space shuttle here. Go to it!...... Steve@B&B
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39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife
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Ed (Ont)
Orange Level Joined: 08 Nov 2009 Location: New Lowell, Ont Points: 1290 |
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What is it that causes those 1 wire to drain battery. Mine will drain battery in couple weeks. I do need to determine for sure if it is the alt tho but pretty sure it is. Problem started when I put the 1 wire on it. This is car I am talking about tho - 70 Camaro. Thx.
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Steve in NJ
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Andover, NJ Points: 11788 |
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There are a couple reasons why an Alternator will drain the Battery. If you have an Alternator that has a diode or trio fail, that would cause a ground in the electronics, close the loop in the unit and draw current from the Battery. If the unit is a one wire, because the unit is hooked directly to the Battery, this keeps the magnetic field "active" in the VR. When the magnetic field is constantly activated, it steals mili-volts from the Battery. Eventually, if sitting long enough it can and will drain the Battery. As I mentioned earlier in a post, it acts as a "dynamo" because its constantly active. When you insert a key switch in the middle and control the current to the VR, when the key is off so is the VR. No magnetic field activation, no drain. The voltage sense circuit (#2) on the Alternator, works great on larger Tractors such as the "D" series on up. This circuit can be run parallel with the heavy output circuit and either run to a junction at the dash area, Voltmeter + or Starter solenoid. The voltage sense circuit now monitors current usage and signals the VR when to ramp up the Alternator when loads are applied to the system. The Battery stays "full" the Alternator keeps 14.2 volts throughout the system keeping components working properly, engine running correctly and makes for a happy system. Three wire system is the bestest! Steve@B&B |
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39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife
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Les Kerf
Orange Level Joined: 08 May 2020 Location: Idaho Points: 777 |
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Disconnect the wire at the alternator and connect an ammeter in series from the wire to the alternator terminal. Draining the battery in two weeks time will probably require a current draw in excess of ~100 mA or so. if the current draw at that location is less-than 10 milliamps then you need to look elsewhere.
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AC WD45
Orange Level Joined: 28 Sep 2009 Location: Mid Michigan Points: 2013 |
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Generator tested OK so I threw it on and began taking another look at the wiring. I replaced the toggle switch with a proper key switch but I am having a tough time figuring out exactly where everything is supposed to wire up with the key switch.. forgive me as I am no genius when it comes to electrical. Something else I noticed, My 3 position switch appears to be missing the resistor all together? Looks like I may be ordering a new switch after all. Would probablyexplain the incorrect operation of the switch aswell. Right now it acts as a switch between no lights, head lights, and all lights, rather than the correct low charge, lights, high charge.
Edited by AC WD45 - 22 Jan 2024 at 7:24pm |
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German Shepherd dad
1957 Allis Chalmers WD45 #WD234847 1951 Allis Chalmers WD #WD88193 |
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Les Kerf
Orange Level Joined: 08 May 2020 Location: Idaho Points: 777 |
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Yup, you need some new parts my friend I recommend a new ammeter as well, also take a close look at those wires with the crimp terminals. Edit: There really is no need for a key switch unless you just want one; all it does is add complexity to a simple system.
Edited by Les Kerf - 22 Jan 2024 at 7:42pm |
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AC WD45
Orange Level Joined: 28 Sep 2009 Location: Mid Michigan Points: 2013 |
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How else would the tractor power off and on? This is a WD45, they had a key switch from the factory to my knowledge, maybe not?
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German Shepherd dad
1957 Allis Chalmers WD45 #WD234847 1951 Allis Chalmers WD #WD88193 |
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Alberta Phil
Orange Level Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Alberta, Canada Points: 3770 |
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Steve at B&B rebuilds those original light switches. He's done a few for me and they come back working like new. That one looks like it needs some attention!
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steve(ill)
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 81065 |
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You can use the KEY for power to the COIL for ignition, and to energize the SOLENOID to start the motor............... or you can have a TOGGLE to get power to the COIL ( ON- OFF).. and just have a START BUTTON that you push to energize the SOLENOID to pull in the starter motor...
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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EPALLIS
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Illinois Points: 1131 |
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When I did my rewire, I just used an on/off switch. Pull out and its on, push in and it is off. That switch is still hard at work and on the job after 31 years....
Had a used a key switch, I would have lost the key 15 times by now. Keep it simple!
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Steve in NJ
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Andover, NJ Points: 11788 |
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The WD45 had a Battery ignition. (Distributor) So a key switch is needed to send power to the Coil. Simple ON/OFF is what was used as OEM. So you did good with a new key switch. If your Tractor was changed over to a Starter solenoid, then you would need either a key crank switch, or pull power off the Ignition switch to power up a start button. Now, looking at that 3 position switch, I can see its all wired incorrectly. Here's what should be on that switch. Jumper wire from the Ammeter minus (-) side to the fuse tower on the H/L switch. Headlight circuit & Tailight circuit (if equipped) to the screw terminal that has the "S" on it. (If you look real close, you'll see letters next to the screws.) Looking at the switch, it looks like the terminal without the screw in it is the "S" terminal that should be used. Generator Field circuit to the resistor leg on the bottom of the switch. Should be no more than 4 wires on that switch. (3 with no Tailight or Work light) There should be a flat resistor on the bottom of that switch. If not, you need one. This is why nothing is working correctly. I have the resistors in stock if interested. As Phil mentioned I do service/rebuild/restore and make parts for those OEM Delco switches. I'm probably the only knuckehead on the planet that does. Take all those wires off and clean up that switch. The only wire that looked correct on that switch was the jumper circuit from the Ammeter to the fuse tower..... Steve@B&B
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39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife
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AC WD45
Orange Level Joined: 28 Sep 2009 Location: Mid Michigan Points: 2013 |
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Steve, what do you get for a new (refurbished) switch? Being that I have gone this far with it I would almost rather just replace the switch, as it's always been finiky. I was able to find some reciepts, the generator was rebuilt in 2008 and probably less than 50 hours total on the tactor since. I knew grandpa had something done but couldn't remember it it was just the starter or not. |
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German Shepherd dad
1957 Allis Chalmers WD45 #WD234847 1951 Allis Chalmers WD #WD88193 |
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Lon(MN)
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Elk River,MN Points: 1966 |
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Looks like the switch resistor is installed on the generator.
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http://lonsallischalmers.com
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mdm1
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Onalaska, WI Points: 2634 |
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Just a thought. Buy a 6v regulator and get rid of the cut out and 3 way switch. Then rewire it. I did that on my wd-45 and it's worked just fine. Still 6v. Used it yesterday in 10 deg weather and it started right up and charged fine after sitting for about a month.
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Everything is impossible until someone does it! WD45-trip loader 1947 c w/woods belly mower, 1939 B, #3 sickle mower 1944 B, 2 1948 G's. Misc other equipment that my wife calls JUNK!
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Les Kerf
Orange Level Joined: 08 May 2020 Location: Idaho Points: 777 |
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Good catch! Seems as though that would leave it stuck on low charge. Somebody really hacked that system up.
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steve(ill)
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 81065 |
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Is that a resistor or just a coil of wire ? Looks more like a spring than a resistor.. and it is connected to the CUT OUT ?? Resistor would go to GROUND from "F".
-------Somebody really hacked that system up.---- and didnt have a CLUE what they were doing.. Edited by steve(ill) - 23 Jan 2024 at 3:50pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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steve(ill)
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 81065 |
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The wire diagram link on the previous page is actually for a B-C-WC type tractor as it is 6v POS ground.. but has a magneto / kill switch / push rod starter..
I looked online and really dont see a WD45 type wire diagram. I marked up the B -C Print to show a COIL- DISTRIBUTOR - STARTER SOLENOID - Key SWITCH in addition to the original 6V POS ground system with the Resistor light switch.. I believe this to be correct. Edited by steve(ill) - 23 Jan 2024 at 6:39pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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AC WD45
Orange Level Joined: 28 Sep 2009 Location: Mid Michigan Points: 2013 |
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That is just a wire with plastic loom around it. |
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German Shepherd dad
1957 Allis Chalmers WD45 #WD234847 1951 Allis Chalmers WD #WD88193 |
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AC WD45
Orange Level Joined: 28 Sep 2009 Location: Mid Michigan Points: 2013 |
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I think I've got it now. I runs great and was charging steady 4v in low charge and 7-8.5 in high charge. Lights are non functional, so I think what happened is someone moved things aroind to get the lights working and didn't take account to the functionality of the switch.
I do still need to replace the switch, but everything including the ammeter save for the lights ins functional. |
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German Shepherd dad
1957 Allis Chalmers WD45 #WD234847 1951 Allis Chalmers WD #WD88193 |
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steve(ill)
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 81065 |
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YEP..... that looks a LOT BETTER... Congrats !!
(and your readings were AMPS on the AMP GAUGE ? ) Edited by steve(ill) - 23 Jan 2024 at 7:27pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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JC-WI
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: wisconsin Points: 33823 |
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Replaced the key switch with a brand new Briggs/Stratton key switch last fall, 70 years of use, been finicky for the last number years of having to set it in a certain position to get it to work. When I changed the this tractor over to the DelcoTron alternator, I put in a new Niehoff lighted ammeter of higher amps and attached the 'on' wire for the regulator to the key switch and rewired the light switch so it was off in the 'IN' position, middle position turned the front headlights on with halogen sealed beams and 32cp bulb in the red tail light on the fender. Third position, all the way out, turned on the FireCracker halogen driving lights bolted ontop of the hood and the rear halogen tail light. Man that tractor had good lights. Was fun cultivating at night with it. With all the lights on it, a generator would not have kept up. Having the alternator was really nice. I had removed the resistor off the light switch too when I had converted it over to 12 volts.
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He who says there is no evil has already deceived himself
The truth is the truth, sugar coated or not. Trawler II says, "Remember that." |
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JC-WI
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: wisconsin Points: 33823 |
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Looks like your needing to ground your Generator there at the battery box. A voltage regulator for the gennie would probably be a better idea, then you won't be overcharging the battery. and won't need to worry about grounding the control panel. Also check your ammeter to see if it has continuity across the lugs. Have had several that failed over the years.
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He who says there is no evil has already deceived himself
The truth is the truth, sugar coated or not. Trawler II says, "Remember that." |
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AC WD45
Orange Level Joined: 28 Sep 2009 Location: Mid Michigan Points: 2013 |
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Yes steve. Forgive me, it has been a long day and I wanted to get this updated before I crash for the night. Thanks again guys. And to Steve at B&B when you see this, I'll send you a PM about a new switch tomorrow.
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German Shepherd dad
1957 Allis Chalmers WD45 #WD234847 1951 Allis Chalmers WD #WD88193 |
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Steve in NJ
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Andover, NJ Points: 11788 |
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Luke, Providing your switch is rebuildable, you can exchange it for one of my switches ready to go. Remove the rod and knob, cause' that sounds like they're not frozen and working and send your switch in. It's $85. bucks exchange without rod n' knob. If you visit our website, our P/N is 1501-02A. You can also email me at customcircuits@gmail.com. JoAnna can send you an invoice to your email address through Paypal if that works for you. Anyway you want to do it. We're easy here......... Steve@B&B
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39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife
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AC WD45
Orange Level Joined: 28 Sep 2009 Location: Mid Michigan Points: 2013 |
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Thank you Steve, the wife and I moved into our new place today after months of renovation. Once we get settled I will get in contact! Thanks again to all of you fine gentlemen for helping out with this little endeavor! I don't think this tractor has been wired right since I was riding on Grandpa's knee.
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German Shepherd dad
1957 Allis Chalmers WD45 #WD234847 1951 Allis Chalmers WD #WD88193 |
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