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Plowing thick sod

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Roddo View Drop Down
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    Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 8:53pm
I'm trying to plow some old fallow land that I got to rent for free.  The sod is so thick it rolls back into the furrow.  I cant get a first pass off at all.  I leveled the plow out and that didnt help to get me going for a first pass.  The plow is doing an awesome job, and sometimes goes for a while perfectly.  Then the slice will start to roll back in and its like a domino effect.  It pulls 15 feet of plowed ground back in!

I got a set of moldboard extensions off my parts plow.  Will these help?  If so how to I adjust them to keep that damn sod where it belongs.  I sprayed it with roundup 4 days before I started, now I just need to get it worked!
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AC WD45 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AC WD45 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 9:17pm
I think the correct way to do this would be a tandem offset disk. At least for the first time. A PTO powered tiller would do the trick as well. 


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Roddo View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roddo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 9:21pm
My only option is a plow.  I don't own any equipment other than a 10 ft disk and my plow.
Also I cant hook a tiller to the WD45. Thanks though.  A tiller would be a good solution.
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Tedin NE-OH View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tedin NE-OH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 9:22pm
Try going faster so it flips the sod.
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Eldon (WA) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eldon (WA) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 9:25pm
I'd try the extensions. I assume you have coulters on the plow? Also try plowing not quite as deep. You can always plow it deeper next year.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dipstick In Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 9:30pm
Put your extensions on and run about 8 inches deep, if you have enough horse try running a little bit faster. I do not favor using a disk before plowing sod because sometimes it will create more problems. After plowing try to disk the same direction that you plowed to sorta push the furrow slice over and start the chopping process. Done correctly with easy to plow sod will leave you with a beautiful job. Flip side is; even for us "old timer" plowmen, sod can really try out last Sundays lessons!!!!
You don't really have to be smart if you know who is!
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Dick L View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dick L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 9:36pm
Can you post a picture from behind the plow showing the furrow and plow. How deep are you plowing. I have seen a team of horses pulling a plow in sod doing a very clean job.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CTuckerNWIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 9:38pm
I had the same trouble a couple weks ago when I tied to plow a garden patch in old CRP ground. I was plowing up hill and just drove over the flipped back chunk on the second pass. I wonder if a set of cover boards would help?? I took mine off years ago and hung them in the shed.
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AC WD45 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AC WD45 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 9:38pm
Now that I see you say you have extensions, yes, use them, alo, if you know how to use the traction booster, this helps! I like 3rd gear 3/4-full throttle in corn stubble, but not sure about sod.
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Roddo View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roddo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 10:12pm
Thanks for the tips.
Ive been plowing about 6-7" deep.  I can plow in 3rd and speed seems to make no difference at all.  Ill bolt on the cover boards tomorrow and hope for the best.
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427435 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 427435 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 10:25pm
`If it's old fallow ground, you don't really need to plow very deep.  Good luck with the cover boards.
Mark

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SHAMELESS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 10:41pm
the extensions, and speed up sum. gotta git it to rolling.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wkpoor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jun 2011 at 11:11pm
What plow are you using. I've experienced similar results with plows on smaller tractors both 1 and 2 bottom 12". Just recently got a 3 bottom 16" Oliver trailer plow and I've never done a nicer cleaner job before. No more spots with weeds or grass still showing. Rolls over much nicer. Moral here is maybe its just the plow. High speed Radex bottoms do a nice job.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mnhorseman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 5:15am
i can remember tieing number 9 wire to the landsides about 10 to 15 foot long trailing the plow in each furrow to get sod to stay over it was a old irish man trick (smiles) this was back in the 60,s so memory is a little faint   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roddo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 6:30am
Its my old 3 bottom #73 snap coupler plow.  I had to take the 3rd off because the WD45 won't pull it.  My traction booster doesn't seem to want to co operate and I don't have time to mess with it.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dusty MI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 7:25am
When I was a kid a man I knew told me that when he was a kid he had a job of walking on the freshly turned sod, right behind the plow, to keep it from flipping back over. He said that once in a while he would stumble and fall down, and the sod would flip back over burying his feet.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 8:18am
Ability to flip sod is probably one of the differences of some plow bottoms, particularly those with longer moldboards. For me speed helped, 5 mph was not too fast but that takes real hp.

Gerald J.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote junkman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 8:23am
I always thought it would be nice to have a sod plow for just those occasions when I heed on for I have had the same problem before. My plow had a extra piece welded on top to give it a little extra role but cut them off for they hindered more then they helped.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dick L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 8:29am
We used number 9 wire to fold the tall grass/weeds over so they would cover. Quit using the wire when we put Yetter colters on the plows. The Yetter colters rolled the first two to three  inches over ahead of the mold boards which caused the tall stuff to tuck under. Are the land sides in good shape? If the (rear) land side in bad shape it can let the rear of the plow to not hold the mold board over far enough to do its job of rolling the furrow over.   That is what keeps the plow straight.

Edited by Dick L - 03 Jun 2011 at 8:29am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KC-WD45 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 8:31am
 I just turned over 7 acres this spring that was a brome field for the last 35 years or so. I used my 45 with a 53 3-16 set about four inches deep then hit it with a 10' tandem offset disk. I didn't have any problems getting it to turn over but the field had been cut very short and baled last fall. I plowed another one last fall that was about 3' tall and I went about 8" deep, that was a mess, same type of problem you are having.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote se iowa picker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 12:31pm
Its all in the moldboards.Get them as long as you can and curve down as much as you can dont give the sod a chance to stand on edge got to get it to break center. Speed will help as long as it doesnt stand it on edge.If I read it right one time AC used high speed moldboards that were designed to pulverize the soil rather than cleanly roll it over. I dont know if thats right or not bout thought I had read that in a book. But thats what we did with our plows over the years was run cover boards and extensions.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 1:02pm
The 392 bottoms on my 2000 do a very good job of pulverization when pulled at 5.5 mph. The ground looks like its going straight down when I look back and unless its too wet it leaves a smooth field without ridges and gulleys. It didn't do that at 3.3 mph that my 4020 could pull 4x18s in my soil. 3x18s does much better and I covered more ground at 5.5 than at 3.3 mph.

Gerald J.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wfmurray Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 4:45pm
i READ WITH INTREST  M y  dad bought a D/14 and had a oliver pull type plow he had used with the  WC   and it worked good . Bought  lift plow  for the  14   i am A/ C man but the ac plow in sod just gives it a twist ,oliver pickes it up and lets iit break over. He solved problem by getting two 16 in olivers and mounted on a/c frame . Ansner to problem go borrow an oliver.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roddo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 7:11pm
I had another go at it.  Same results.  The cover boards helped but its just pure roots as far down as the plow goes. Even with the back bottom removed this stuff plows HARD.  I might have to disk the snot out of the mess I made and hope to use that as a softer starting point.

If I could make one pass without the damn furrow rolling back in I'd be golden!  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Don(MO) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 8:31pm
Originally posted by Roddo Roddo wrote:

Its my old 3 bottom #73 snap coupler plow.  I had to take the 3rd off because the WD45 won't pull it.  My traction booster doesn't seem to want to co operate and I don't have time to mess with it.  
 
When you removed the #3 or back bottom did you replace the # two bottom with it?
If you didn't move it up there the you need to switch them or the long land-side off the #3 bottom to the # 2 bottom. Without the long land-side on there then the plow can move over and might be your trouble.
Don
3 WD45's with power steering,G,D15 fork lift,D19, W-Speed Patrol, "A" Gleaner with a 330 corn head,"66" combine,roto-baler, and lots of Snap Coupler implements to make them work for their keep.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roddo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 9:18pm
The rear bottom and 2nd bottom have the same land side length.

This is what it looks like.  Before I beat the hell out of it in this sod....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AaronH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 10:12pm
I just went through some of this myself. For most of the old pasture , I burnt it with roundup and no till. But I bought a 210 this spring so i had to use it. I have a 4-18 2000 mono frame plow pulling behind the 210. Im pretty sure they are 387 bottoms on it and this plow will turn over anything you have. Same situation, 30 years worth of pasture.  High clearance, alfalfa rotation, corn stalks, you name it. You cant tell where one round starts and the next ends. does a nice job. ONCE you get it set up to the tractor. Where were we... oh ya... Speed, depth, .. ya. But im a believer in the right bottoms on the plow. will make all the difference.. Check this out. He posts on here from WI also. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqtxfcTyGrg
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ky wonder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2011 at 10:17pm
i just came in from breaking 5 acres of sod that had not been turned in over twenty years, the fescue was waist high so i put the bush hog on monday and cut it close to the ground, and let the residue dry out so this afternoon i started by plowing a land around the food plot site, then i burnt off the dry grass , this left me with a good 6" inch grass on a 4' thick root  system, the old oliver with a oliver 3x14s plow did a great job
 
i plowed as deep as the plow would go and it was at least 8-10 inches deep, i plowed at about 5mph and when i had to throw the cut up grade i put it in a faster gear and it flip it upside down, but at the slower speed it would try to stand it up.
so tomorrow i will put the disk on and disk it at least twice, with a heavy drag, and then i am going to plant some late corn for my deere popuation
 
i know this is a orange forum but it is hard to beat a oliver plow!


Edited by ky wonder - 03 Jun 2011 at 10:26pm
i like old tractors of all colors
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Teddy (punchie) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jun 2011 at 4:14am
No question about it Oliver radex bottoms are the best. 

Now to help you. I asked about a 4 bottom and a d19 a few weeks ago. I got them to work good to Okay, still not doing a good job on stony ground in sod. I just plowed this spring ground that had trees (small), blackberries, all types of weeds and grass, and wild roses.  Brush hogged down first. Plowed about 5 acres of this stuff. Take hatchet to cut the roots out, that plug the moldboard. Hears what I had SC  80 framed plows with 375 moldboards, moldboard extensions, and what I'll call cover boards and coulters.

 How long are your shares??  Had to cut the oliver shares down to make it work right.  The sod has to have the right hinge to turn over on.

How level is your ground?  I would think any plow should turn over sod on level ground.  How clean are the moldboards, do they need scoured?

Your picture:
 Can you set the coulters a little lower?  Maybe get them closer to the shin,  just a question here, see if it may help.
Do you have two links that adjust? If you have only one you need to switch them. You need to adjust the farrow side.


Edited by Teddy (punchie) - 04 Jun 2011 at 6:47am
Ac D-19, a Number of WD's, One WD45, Two 444 balers, Ac plows and etc.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nella(Pa) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jun 2011 at 5:50am
Have you considered custom notill for those old sod fields for the first year. That would loosen up the ground.
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