| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
GregLawlerMinn 
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Lawler, Mn
Points: 1226
|
 Post Options
 Thanks(0)
 Quote  Reply
 Topic: D17D Engine Update
Posted: 05 May 2010 at 5:47pm |
Got the oil pan off and the piston out. Whatever caused the damage to the top of the piston came from above the piston top. Sizable damage to piston. The sleeve also had some dameage, so will be pulling the sleeve and installing a new one.
Pictures of the #4 piston:
|
|
What this country needs is more unemployed politicians-and lawyers.
Currently have: 1 D14 and a D15S2.
With new owners: 2Bs,9CAs,1WD,2 D12s,5D14s,3D15S2s, 2D17SIVs,D17D,1D19D;1 Unstyled WC
|
 |
|
Sponsored Links
|
|
|
GregLawlerMinn
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Lawler, Mn
Points: 1226
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 May 2010 at 5:54pm |
Drated phat phingers; Additional pictures
Measured the liner stickout and piston stickout with a dial indicator. Liner stickout ranged from 0 to .002"; Piston stickout ranged from .015 to .030. The measurements were taken on the 5 undamaged pistons. Still havee not heard from the head rebuilder, but am hoping the the Alum piston absorbed the damage, not the head.
Link to the previous post on this subject is below for those interested:
|
|
What this country needs is more unemployed politicians-and lawyers.
Currently have: 1 D14 and a D15S2.
With new owners: 2Bs,9CAs,1WD,2 D12s,5D14s,3D15S2s, 2D17SIVs,D17D,1D19D;1 Unstyled WC
|
|
Chris/CT
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Niantic, Ct
Points: 1939
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 May 2010 at 6:00pm |
|
I assume the injector was in good shape, nothing fell off it?
|
|
DREAM
Orange Level
Joined: 06 Jan 2010
Location: Elberton,GA
Points: 1828
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 May 2010 at 6:07pm |
Wow, that got beaten to crap! I can't tell what that is, but it kinda looks like a valve stem locking clip. No way that could have gotten in there from where it is supposed to be, unless someone dropped one in the intake manifold or somewhere in the air cleaner when they were working on the tractor. That may have actually been what happenned. I have had screws, nuts, and bolts do that before. i would take all of the intake system apart all the way out to the air intake and see if there's something missing somewhere.
|
|
GregLawlerMinn
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Lawler, Mn
Points: 1226
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 May 2010 at 6:09pm |
|
The injector is complete; and what I could see of the energy cell, it is also complete. I did not notice any damage to the valves when I turned the head upside down. As of right now, I believe the damage resulted from the fire ring in the head gasket sliding into the cylinder and being struck by the valve (note the flat steel fragments that look like pieces of a ring that are embedded in the top of the piston). Expect the head rebuilder will be checking the condition of the energy cell as well as the valves. BTW, the small notch on the bottom of the piston was facing towards the front of the engine.
|
|
What this country needs is more unemployed politicians-and lawyers.
Currently have: 1 D14 and a D15S2.
With new owners: 2Bs,9CAs,1WD,2 D12s,5D14s,3D15S2s, 2D17SIVs,D17D,1D19D;1 Unstyled WC
|
|
Brian Jasper co. Ia
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Prairie City Ia
Points: 10508
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 May 2010 at 6:22pm |
|
Do you still have the old head gasket? If it was the fire ring responsible, it would be obvious. (Missing) Otherwise, like Dream says look the induction over thoroughly. I recently put a new head on a 6.0L Ford diesel in an Excursion. The guy had just had an EGR cooler replaced on it back home in Colorado before heading east on vacation. He made it to Newton Ia before it developed a dead miss. Turns out the tech in Colorado dropped one of the LH heat shield bracket bolts in the intake port on the left head. Fortunately the head of the bolt was large enough that it didn't get past the valve. The threaded end got flattened out between the valve and seat. The head of the bolt wore a groove under the seat ring ruining the head casting.
|
|
"Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford
|
|
mlpankey
Orange Level
Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Location: Vols country
Points: 4580
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 May 2010 at 7:26pm |
|
If I am seeing what I think I am .A crack that goes from the top of the piston to the ring lands and the ring lands are bent as it appears. I would tend to think it ingested something harder than a fire ring at some point and time.
|
|
GregLawlerMinn
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Lawler, Mn
Points: 1226
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 May 2010 at 7:36pm |
I had a loose (bent) pushrod and I thought it went to #3 hole. When I pulled the head several fire rings fell out of the gasket and I was not paying attention which was from what hole. Will be checking out the air cleaner, preheater, etc to determine if something came out and got past the valve. I only know that there were many small steel parts (a magnet picked up the loose pieces) that look like pieces of a ring or a large skinny flat washer (fairly large dia, thin, and circular) either loose on top of the piston or embedded into the piston and head. Have used the tractor with no issues for the past 4 years and was really impressed with its starting and running.
|
|
What this country needs is more unemployed politicians-and lawyers.
Currently have: 1 D14 and a D15S2.
With new owners: 2Bs,9CAs,1WD,2 D12s,5D14s,3D15S2s, 2D17SIVs,D17D,1D19D;1 Unstyled WC
|
|
j.w.freck
Orange Level
Joined: 16 Sep 2009
Location: karnack texas
Points: 1153
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 May 2010 at 8:47pm |
|
i would bet on a valve seat or part of the valve itself,when you tear the head down it will tell you
|
|
EricTn
Silver Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Mid Tenn
Points: 98
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 May 2010 at 8:53pm |
|
Was the bent push rod to the exhaust valve? If so, is it possible that the metal particles could be the exhaust valve seat. I dont know if they are larger diameter than the valve to notice it missing without removing the valve. Just wondering. Eric
JW and I are thinking alike. He's faster than me plus I got interupted before I could hit the send button.
Edited by EricTn - 05 May 2010 at 8:59pm
|
|
GregLawlerMinn
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Lawler, Mn
Points: 1226
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 06 May 2010 at 9:06am |
JW and Eric
After looking at the On-Line Allis Parts manual, I agree with your diagnosis as to the culprit. The Diesel Head section shows a ring shaped exhaust valve insert (item 2) and the bent pushrod is for the #4 hole exhaust valve. The examination of the head by the machine shop will confirm this diagnosis if the insert is gone.
Is it possible that many years of ether starting and shutting down the engine while still hot embrittled the insert enuff to break it loose? I have used ether very sparingly as the tractor starts good in cool weather. I installed 2 12 volt batteries in parallel and a tank heater for cold weather starting. When I brought it home it had a single 12 volt battery and the previous owner(s) may have been more anxious to get it started.
|
|
What this country needs is more unemployed politicians-and lawyers.
Currently have: 1 D14 and a D15S2.
With new owners: 2Bs,9CAs,1WD,2 D12s,5D14s,3D15S2s, 2D17SIVs,D17D,1D19D;1 Unstyled WC
|
|
skipwelte
Orange Level
Joined: 29 Oct 2009
Location: Anthon, Iowa
Points: 723
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 06 May 2010 at 11:40am |
|
Ida bet the shapnel was ring peices. A seat usually doesnt come apart like that, valve peices are usually burned and jaged, beside there is a lot of it on top of the piston. Im real curious as to what the cylinder head looks like. Please let us know. Thanks Skip
|
|
GregLawlerMinn
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Lawler, Mn
Points: 1226
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 06 May 2010 at 4:55pm |
Skip
The top of the piston was not broken down to the point that pieces af a ring could get into the firing chamber. The top three rings were fractured, but all the pices were contained in their ring groves..see pictures above. Maybe a previous owner place a larger piston ring on the gasket to replace a fire ring?? Will post report from the machine shop re: the head examination.
|
|
What this country needs is more unemployed politicians-and lawyers.
Currently have: 1 D14 and a D15S2.
With new owners: 2Bs,9CAs,1WD,2 D12s,5D14s,3D15S2s, 2D17SIVs,D17D,1D19D;1 Unstyled WC
|
|
