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new toy for me

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desertjoe View Drop Down
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    Posted: 23 Sep 2013 at 8:55am

Hello fellow tractor enthusiasts,,
I am looking to buy an older Allis Chalmers backhoe/loader for a rebuild project. It has been parked for several years. It was sold at a government auction and the fellow never did anything with it after dismanteling the engine. It needed a piston/liner/rings and he did not want to spend any money on the tractor so It sat for years. He has since "lost" the oil pan, cylinder head, plus bolts he removed. The backhoe and loader and main frame appear to be low hours and no obvious leaks anywhere.
I have an opportunity to buy it at a good price, but,,,,cannot find where the engine and tractor serial numbers are located. The Guy says he was told it was a "D4 gas" but in searching the web, I only find a D14 but not same tractor. This one looks to have been a kind of orange color. The PO says there are several farm combines etc. that use same engine,,,?
Any help will be appreciated, and THanks.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HD6GTOM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Sep 2013 at 9:02am
Just about need a picture posted to help
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Sep 2013 at 9:08am


OOPS slips,,,I'll post some pics soon as I can catch the Guy at home.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Sep 2013 at 7:41pm

   OK, Guys, finally caught the guy at home. The only number I found on engine was on left side of engine block ( 149-22587R ). It does have a 4 speed with reverse pattern on top of trans housing. The loader had an Allis Chalmers tag with numbers TS-500 1E705AC. The backhoe has a Allis Chalmers tag also but I could not read the numbers. The engine is a 4 cylinder gasoline. The starter was mounted on centerline of engine at the back of engine and under the fuel tank. It has a generator Vs an alternator but could not tell if 6 or 12 volt.
I will attach some pics I got 2day and hopfully some of you tractor Gurus can help me ID the engine. The PO bought this at a gov auction and was told it is a D4 gasoline, but I find no mention of such on the internet. The engine had a bad piston and he dismantled it and has since lost the head, oil pan, pistons and liners,,etc. PO tells me some combines have this similar engine,,,,,??? fingers crossed,,,,,
Many thanks for any help on this.. Joe r
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desertjoe View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Sep 2013 at 8:22pm


   Hey HD6GTOM,,,please tell me how to post pics here.
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RichinWis View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RichinWis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Sep 2013 at 9:08pm
with a TS500 loader on it, it is most likely a D15 industrial tractor with loader and backhoe. D15 industrials should have a solid non adjustable front axle with standard non spinout wheels on the rear. Engine is a 149 cubic inch standard D15 tractor issue which parts are quite easy to come by. HTH
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BackhoeBob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Sep 2013 at 9:14pm
It sounds like my I 400. Wish you were closer to me...I'd like to sell mine...no time to fix it up. It runs and everything works, but needs restored.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RichinWis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Sep 2013 at 9:22pm
The TS500 loader was the loader that was made for the D15 industrial, the I 400 had a different smaller loader.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Oct 2013 at 7:43am

   WOW,!!   Thanks Guys for all the replies. I'm starting to get excited,! I have several pics I took yesterday but can't figure how to post them,,,can somebody help me out?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HD6GTOM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Oct 2013 at 6:33pm
I don't know how to post pictures
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desertjoe View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Oct 2013 at 12:02am
OK,,my thanks to CTuckerNWIL and beaud_250 for filling me in on how to post pics here, so am goin to give it a whirl,,,wish me luck,,
   Man,,,I do not know what the hay happened,,I resized all the pics but some came thru in full size and have screwed up big time.
I will delete these and start all over    SORRY !!!!
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Dean (West MI) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dean (West MI) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Oct 2013 at 12:59am

Originally posted by RichinWis RichinWis wrote:

The TS500 loader was the loader that was made for the D15 industrial, the I 400 had a different smaller loader.

Same loader used on a 615 also? 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JC-WI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Oct 2013 at 7:24am
Desert joe, what are you sorry about, you got the pictures posted didn't you? 
Looks like thats just an old D15 under the loader and backhoe.
He who says there is no evil has already deceived himself
The truth is the truth, sugar coated or not. Trawler II says, "Remember that."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Oct 2013 at 8:41am

    OK,, a D15,??. Now, how do I go about ID'ing the year in order to start trying to locate a used engine somewhere? According to the PO, the engine just needed a piston and he pulled all the pistons/ liners then decided not to mess with it. Now, He cannot find any of the parts so I will have to buy an engine for parts to reassemble this one or R&R complete engine.
    He did tell me that some other farm equipment used the same engine such as combines,,,,?? Any body got a clue? any pics of yours,??
Anybody got a clue of the "designation" of this particular engine? I did read elsewhere that the # on this engine block 149-22587R designates it a 149 cubic inch block,,?? Thanks for any help.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DiyDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Oct 2013 at 7:31pm
D-14, D-15, series 1,  and the same engines, in power units, are the ones you can use as a direct replacement.  Also D-10 and D12, series 3 are 149 cu inch motors.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Oct 2013 at 12:31am

Hey DIYDave,, thanks for the comeback, I appreciate your input.
What do you mean by power units?
How do I go about determining the year of this tractor? When I start asking around, Does "D15 or 149" tell the sellers what I'm looking for?
Do all D15's have same bolt pattern on bellhousing? D10's, D14's?
Sorry bout so many questions but I'm a learner.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JohnCO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Oct 2013 at 1:20am
There should be a serial number on the transmission housing right next to the rear of the engine block on the right side (looking forward from the rear). Starts with D.  Find the number and we can give you the year.  There were thousands of those engines built for running everything from oil pumps to carnival rides.  Pretty much all the same.  I believe all D15's were 12 volt, positive ground, but may be wrong.
What part of New Mexico are you in?  Not a lot of Allis's in that state but lots in the mid west.  Too bad the PO lost the head, etc. How does one do that I wonder?
Good luck with your find.
"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote allismanamp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Oct 2013 at 4:41am
If my dad or grandpa ever seen me take a allis Chalmers tractor apart especially something like a engine!!!!!
And leave it uncovered in the elements he would have wooped me good
Can't believe some people and even worse he lost the parts he took off!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
What is the deal?
Some people should not be aloud to touch tractors
A replacement engine could be pricey tell him 500 as is
Being you are having to find a complete parts engine.
I like the loader on the old girl looks pretty tough
I seen it had spin out rims as well I also assumed they were fixed non adjustable kind of odd
Wonder how much of the parts in her are good yet?
How long has it been sitting?
~AMP~
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DiyDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Oct 2013 at 4:57am
Originally posted by desertjoe desertjoe wrote:


Hey DIYDave,, thanks for the comeback, I appreciate your input.
What do you mean by power units?
How do I go about determining the year of this tractor? When I start asking around, Does "D15 or 149" tell the sellers what I'm looking for?
Do all D15's have same bolt pattern on bellhousing? D10's, D14's?
Sorry bout so many questions but I'm a learner.

Power units are plain engines, used to run generators, pumps, carnival rides, combine engines, corn picker engines, etc.

D15, series 1.  Series 2 is a 160 cu in engine, much pricier. All 149 cubic engines have the same specs, as do the 138 engines.  The difference between the 138 and the 149 is merely the sleeve/pistons/rings.  As for the year, doesn't make much difference, on the engine, they were made from '57-'67, if not longer.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Oct 2013 at 8:37am

    WOW,,,thanks for all the replies, Guys!!
Actually I am goin up this weekend to get the tractor as I had to wait for my friend to get his trailer back from another "borrow Job". My 18 footer was 1" not wide enough.
    JohnCo, I will check out that location you gave me for the SN. I had crawled all over that thing looking for a number, but must have just missed it.
    AllisManamp, that was my concern on "how" does one lose important engine parts. Parts missing are pistons, liners, oil pan, cylinder head, intake/exhaust manifolds and carb. At least he didn't take the crankshaft out!! Fact is, I just had a thought,,,since this is at a wrecking yard, and old cars and trucks all around it,,,,maybe, just maybe the parts are in some of those other vehicles?? You think? Naw,, my luck doesn't run that good. The Backhoe and loader pivot joints look to be very snug with no visible oil leaks on any of the hose joints except for an oil leak at the main pump area. This tractor belonged to a government agency and I doubt it got much use from looks of the pivot joints, and both buckets.
    DiyDave, OK, so now I know maybe what and where to look for a possible donor for an engine. I sure would like to see a pic of a complete D15 engine with the head and manifolds so I know what to look for. I find some Allis Chalmers engines on Ebay but nothing listed as D15 or D14.
    Anybody,,???
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DiyDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Oct 2013 at 8:27pm
Have you tried the photo gallery here, or over at YTmag?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Oct 2013 at 9:47am

Hey DiyDave,, I'm a little slow this morn,,I cannot find the photo gallery you refer to. I looked everywhere it might be but,,,????Is YTmag a web site?   thx
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Oct 2013 at 10:04am
Link to a website showing location of 'Engine Serial Number' and
'Tractor Serial Number'.

Both numbers are on the 'LEFT' side of the Tractor when you are sitting on the seat.

Gary

http://people.clemson.edu/~wsmth/SNLocat/ACSN5.htm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DiyDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Oct 2013 at 7:00pm
Originally posted by desertjoe desertjoe wrote:


Hey DiyDave,, I'm a little slow this morn,,I cannot find the photo gallery you refer to. I looked everywhere it might be but,,,????Is YTmag a web site?   thx


OK, trying again to post pics of the Allis Chalmers Backhoe. Here goes. 



Pictures of a similar thread, over at YTmag appear similar, you mean you didn't post them over there?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Oct 2013 at 8:44am

Well, I'll just be danged,,, YTmag just happens to be Yesterday's Tractors,,,!! doesn't it??
Yes, DiyDave, I did, as a fact of the matter, post those pics at that site as well, ( much better set of pics aren't they?) Just trying to cover all the bases, you understand.
I could not contact the PO to go back again and verify the number for the tractor. I really wanted to look in the adjoining trucks and cars around the tractor as I'm hoping the parts they removed are resting safely inside one of them. Doesn't make much sense to remove the parts and carry them off elsewhere, or at least that's what I'm hoping for.
I still haven't found a pic of a D14 or 15 engine with cylinder head and valve cover so I know what I'm looking for.
I'm supposed to pick the tractor Tues morn and will get a better overall look. Thanks for all the comments.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vooodooo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Oct 2013 at 2:54pm
Not that I claim to be an expert but it's missing so many parts, head, carb etc. With the head gone for who knows how long, that motor is likely screwed..IMO you'd be better off buying a complete unit.
You could be into so much money to repair you'd get a new machine for cheaper.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DiyDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Oct 2013 at 7:06pm
Originally posted by desertjoe desertjoe wrote:


Well, I'll just be danged,,, YTmag just happens to be Yesterday's Tractors,,,!! doesn't it??
Yes, DiyDave, I did, as a fact of the matter, post those pics at that site as well, ( much better set of pics aren't they?) Just trying to cover all the bases, you understand.
I could not contact the PO to go back again and verify the number for the tractor. I really wanted to look in the adjoining trucks and cars around the tractor as I'm hoping the parts they removed are resting safely inside one of them. Doesn't make much sense to remove the parts and carry them off elsewhere, or at least that's what I'm hoping for.
I still haven't found a pic of a D14 or 15 engine with cylinder head and valve cover so I know what I'm looking for.
I'm supposed to pick the tractor Tues morn and will get a better overall look. Thanks for all the comments.

Keep looking, you will find the serial #.  It is really not all that important, the motor you want is a 138, or 149 cubic inch gas motor.  They made thousands of them as tractor engines, and power units.  Search craig's list, too, I see a lot of them there.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2013 at 9:00am

Does anybody here know how to do a search on Craigs list that lists all ads by state? I was going to start with Texas, and then Co, Ok, etc. but so many different cities, or maybe even countrywide then narrow down to states? it would take a while to do by every city listed. Thanks
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http://www.adhuntr.com/

You can narrow the search by region, ebay, kijiji etc.
I've found it useful.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DiyDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2013 at 7:12pm
google craigslist tempest search (someone told me how, but I never followed up, that should get you to the hows and whats)
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