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CA13414 
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Joined: 25 Feb 2024
Location: Nebraska
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 Topic: Allis CA
Posted: 6 hours 15 minutes ago at 9:09pm |
 Sugarmaker wrote:
Folks,Just a quick up date on the CA. The crank has been modified to improve the thrust dimension. Will pick that up in the morning. I have another project in the works ahead of it so we will have to wait to get back on the CA. Regards, Chris and Cheryl |
So did you modify the crank such that you made a "Stroker CA?" The torque will be good for pulling!!! If so that is awesome. Dan
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Helping the aged survive and thrive! 1953 CA
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Sugarmaker
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Joined: 12 Jul 2013
Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 6 hours 40 minutes ago at 8:44pm |
Folks, Just a quick up date on the CA. The crank has been modified to improve the thrust dimension. Will pick that up in the morning. I have another project in the works ahead of it so we will have to wait to get back on the CA. Regards, Chris and Cheryl
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 16 Sep 2024 at 8:47pm |
Kip, folks, Thanks for checking in. Yes I am looking forward to pulling this CA made from many parts. I think the steering will be much better when I get it back together. Yes I am going to try it with a short and long arm combo. Congratulations on the wins! Awesome! Regards, Chris and Cheryl
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Kip-Utah
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Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Location: Southern Utah
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Posted: 15 Sep 2024 at 10:35pm |
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OKAY, part of the hard steering is because your swapped in front end is from a very early “short arm” C that was used from about 1940-1942. These used a corresponding short arm on the primary steering box as well, so that they went through the same arc. Later model Cs used the same length long arm front & rear as the CA. We love pulling our Cs. Two weeks ago Dad won the 2500 lb class on his single front wheel C and took second at 3000 lbs. Dad was sitting in first by a little over a foot & I had the last hook in the class on my wide front C, and I beat him by about five feet!🤠 So we finished 1-2. We also both won first place trophies on our WCs at 3500 & 4000 lbs. We celebrated Dad’s 90th birthday 3 days later!!
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HANSEN'S OLD ORANGE IRON. Showing, Pulling, & Going!!
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Sugarmaker
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Joined: 12 Jul 2013
Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 15 Sep 2024 at 8:49pm |
Allis guys, I did get the new oil ring for the pistons. If I can get the crank back soon I could get the bottom end of the CA together. Need the head at some point too. We spent most of the week at the Albion fair about 2 miles from home. I took 3 tractors, and a neighbors. All WD series tractors. We pulled Friday on the cement. Neighbor won the 3500 lb class. Grandson Mike pulled the WZ in the 3500 but the right rear spun out way early. I pulled the 45 in 5000 lb and was smoking the clutch when it moved the boat and I spun most of the way to a full pull. More weight and I only pulled 1 inch and then 4 inches. class was won at 8 inches. We pulled on the dirt track Friday night with lots of good competitors. Non of us placed in this "farm Stock pull. Lots of pretty warm tractors! Saturday was antique pulling. I placed 4th in 4000 with the WZ. Friend Matt pulled my 45 and was second out of 19 tractors. Not too bad. Hope things are good. I would like to have the CA ready for next spring pulls. Lots to do! Regards, Chris and Cheryl
Edited by Sugarmaker - 16 Sep 2024 at 8:44pm
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 05 Sep 2024 at 9:05pm |
Steve, it has 'Z' code gleaner engine in it. A little more power to the wheels, which is not always a good thing. Regards, Chris and Cheryl
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 05 Sep 2024 at 9:49am |
Chris...i must have missed one post.. Why do you call the tractor a WZ ? 
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Sugarmaker
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Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 05 Sep 2024 at 9:20am |
Allis team, Took the Allis CA crank to the machine shop for evaluation of the thrust. Both the old and new thrust bearing measured about the same. Thrust was about .010 over spec. So have decided to have him remove the crank gear, clean up the thrust surface on the crank and remove a little from the crank snout. Then re set the gear on the shaft bringing this dimension back to spec.
A few parts:
I did get the new battery charger on the E tank and half of the CA fuel tank has been in since yesterday. This charger has a timer for about 2 hours. Seems to be working OK. small moves.
Tractor pull last night with the WZ. 3500 lb class had more than enough power and spun out well before the 300 foot mark. Well the clutches and governor spring worked fine. Now to find the best weight class. I think the additional weight on the rear (1000 lbs) bring it back to the 4500 lb class. It may be balanced much better??
Regards, Chris and Cheryl
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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dfwallis
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Joined: 09 Mar 2023
Location: DFW
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Posted: 01 Sep 2024 at 10:21pm |
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My vote: save all CAs wherever they are no matter how far gone they are, no matter how much it costs :)
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1952 CA13092
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Sugarmaker
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Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 01 Sep 2024 at 9:33pm |
Allis folks, The little CA project is fighting me every step of the way today. I did get several parts sandblasted. my compressor overheated and kicked off till it cooled down. Also prototyping an area in the shop to finally set up some work benches, tool boxes, and storage areas. This should help get some projects moving along quicker, maybe?:) So I need to build support structures for the 24 feet of new old work benchs. Also brought my old craftsman tool box from the house garage to compliment the larger craftsman box given to me by my grandson Mike. So my cost so far is about zero. I will have to buy some lumber for the legs.
Yesterday I had the sandblaster where the toolboxes were. I had to relocate the dust collector on the sandblaster to the back allow it to go back to the other side of the garage door. Just another minor job to keep moving forward. No I didn't clean the top of the tool boxes off as I moved them! It's my trademark.
My view from the new bench, work area. I plan to wrap around the corner with another 12 feet of bench along the south wall also. Planning for just some shelving under the work surfaces too. Then I should be able to move my 4 x 7 foot work table into this corner as an island. Will this help me move along on the CA? Well its is a good diversion and much needed in the shop. Like any horizontal surface my areas get filled quickly with stuff! All kinds of stuff!
Oh yeah after ice cream with Cheryl we took a ride and looked at another CA. Yes the "Williow" CA tractor, is still sitting in the yard several miles away. Tires bad. water in the pan. Unsure if the engine is free? My guess is it's froze tight. Maybe even broken block? Anyway they are still out there. Do I need another? Not really! But the 4 great grand kids might have some fun at tractor pulls if it could be resurrected. Humm? Happy labor day! Regards, Chris and Cheryl
Edited by Sugarmaker - 01 Sep 2024 at 9:59pm
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 01 Sep 2024 at 1:21am |
Allis folks, We received the new main bearing set for the CA. I measured across the new thrust bearing and got almost the same readings as the old bearing 1.620 inches. When I set the old bearing and cap on the crank I can get about .014 inch of feeler gage between the bearing and crank faces. So I am going to take the crank and bearings to the machine shop and have him inspect them too. I know he can remove the crank gear and remove maybe .010 from the crank shoulder and replace the gear this would bring the thrust back into tolerance of .001 to .005 inches. That's the plan for now. Hoping to turn the corner on this tractor build soon, it's been dragging on for a while! Doesn't feel like I have anything completed on the CA. I did move around a lot of the parts today trying to get a work area set up in the corner of the shop. I sandblasted the band for the gas tank. Hope things are good in orange land! Regards, Chris and Cheryl
Edited by Sugarmaker - 01 Sep 2024 at 1:22am
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 29 Aug 2024 at 1:13am |
Allis folks, A couple minor setbacks in the area of CA parts. The bearings are re- ordered. They came as incorrect components. A new set of rings were ordered as one of the oil rings was only 1/2 there, the broken portion was missing. I still have many moves to make, so this is not going to really hold up the project much. I have several full days of cleaning parts and nuts and bolts! Some cam shots:
Pretty exciting stuff here!:) Regards, Chris and Cheryl
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 27 Aug 2024 at 8:15pm |
Guys, Thanks! Cheryl had a couple good days! She tolerates me and likes to get out to socialize. The tractor pull allowed me to test the old hand clutch in the Allis WZ. I pulled in second gear and should have been in first. Powered out and stalled short of the leaders. But it did not slip at either of the clutches. Back on the CA: The main bearings are on their way from Sandy Lake! Brenda has always helped me with Allis parts and technical information too. Cheryl and I took a ride to the machine shop working on some of the CA parts. I had him remove the old cam gear and install it on the reground cam. So I can start to learn more about degreeing a cam in an old CA engine. So we keep trying to move forward a little bit on the CA (Cheryl Ann) tractor project. Regards, Chris and Cheryl
Edited by Sugarmaker - 27 Aug 2024 at 8:17pm
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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ekjdm14
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Posted: 26 Aug 2024 at 5:17pm |
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Happy birthday to Cheryl, been enjoying reading about this build since joining the forum. These old tractors are addictive, I can tell you that much!
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tadams(OH)
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Posted: 26 Aug 2024 at 2:33pm |
Happy Birthday to Cheryl yes CA is gaining ground
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plummerscarin
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Posted: 26 Aug 2024 at 11:49am |
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Happy birthday to Cheryl
Making good progress on that CA
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 26 Aug 2024 at 9:31am |
Allis folks, I did get the pistons cleaned up and checked the ring areas. Found that piston #2 had some type of minor damage to the top and it tightened the upper ring groove. Got that corrected, so that the ring fits the groove now. About ready to get the new rings in place. The main bearings should be here soon. Will be interesting to see if the thrust is correct back to spec. Oil pan has been through the E tank and looks better. Much to do on this unit. Cheryl's birthday today. Was going tractor pulling tonight but the rain is still heavy here in North West PA. Regards, Chris and Cheryl
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 24 Aug 2024 at 8:34pm |
Folks, I did get the CA cylinders honed, Much better. Also did some cleaning on the block. Cleaning pistons, thinking about cams. I did fire up the E-tank and have the CA oil pan in there for cleaning.
Car shows with the 65 Comet and getting ready for tractor pull Monday night with a test of the WZ. Hope that works out with Cheryl, it is her birthday! Regards, Chris and Cheryl
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 23 Aug 2024 at 8:17am |
Paul, Thanks for the dimension and suggestions on setting the clutch throw out fingers. That will help. I did get the WZ pulling tractor back together and out of the shop. So maybe I can get back on the CA engine refurb project? Hope things are good in Orange land! Regards, Chris and Cheryl
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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PaulB
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Posted: 23 Aug 2024 at 7:10am |
Chris: NO the fingers can NOT be correctly set on the bench. In the service manuals there is a specification that is supposed to work measuring from the clutch disc to the fingers, however if the flywheel has been resurfaced it will not get them right. Take a straight edge and measure back to the throwout bearing from the face of the bellhousing, this should be 5". This gives good thread contact on the clutch rod. I have the tab on the jig set to be 4-7/8" from the block face. This give 1/8" clearance at the throwout bearing. This is a bit tighter than the 1/4" that the service manual calls for, however I've found it allows the pressure plate to release cleaner. After installing the engine, I might need to give the clutch rod a 1/2 turn or so to get 1/2" free travel on the clutch rod (not peddle travel).
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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 22 Aug 2024 at 8:35pm |
Paul, folks, The jig looks like the ticket for setting the adjustable fingers . Can this dimension be set on the bench with the pressure plate not on the tractor? I had not thought much about this, but I do need to set the clutch finger dimension for the CA pressure plate at some point. So more learning about the correct position of these pressure plate fingers. Paul's if you can share the dimensions of your jig I think I could make something like this tool. Regards, Chris and Cheryl
Edited by Sugarmaker - 22 Aug 2024 at 8:37pm
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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PaulB
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Posted: 22 Aug 2024 at 6:14pm |
This is the jig I made to set the fingers of the pressure plate on all the small block engines. This way everything is right the first time.
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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 20 Aug 2024 at 9:13pm |
John, When I get this Allis WZ out of the shop, then parts should be here for the CA. Refreshed cam and lifters, new main bearings. I should be able to start the engine rebuild on the old CA puller project. We will see. Lots of fairs and pulls coming up. This little CA is something I want my Great grand kids to pull in the next few years. Regards, Chris and Cheryl
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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wjohn
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Posted: 17 Aug 2024 at 6:58pm |
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You are moving right along sir. My money is on you having this back together before I get my WD engine back together, and I've had 4 years now. Ha!
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 17 Aug 2024 at 5:48pm |
Allis folks, I owe you some pictures!
I just wanted to show that we are doing a little on the little CA! Yep its still needs a lot of love. But its just nuts and bolts! You guys got to help me get this done! Regards, Chris and Cheryl
Edited by Sugarmaker - 17 Aug 2024 at 6:11pm
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 17 Aug 2024 at 4:37pm |
Af C720Man, folks, I am planning to use the std clutch plate as my Hp will be near stock. We had fun at the dead boat pull today. Not many tractors as the weather was iffy and folks just don't attend if the weatherman says rain. Probably had 30- 40 hooks. I pulled in 3750, 4000 and 4500 lb class with the WZ. The clutchs are not good in this old Allis but I was able to pull the flat boat loaded with dirt a little farther than several other tractors when loaded up for the 4500 lb class. Its wasn't pretty but the old Allis got it done! Thanks to my wife for tolerating me playing in the sandbox with the guys! Regards, Chris and Cheryl
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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AC720Man
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Posted: 16 Aug 2024 at 10:25pm |
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Chris, totally different beast but I put a 6 puck in my 190XT and love it. Rick built it for me. I know he doesn’t do clutches anymore which is a shame but it handles the extra hp Ed dialed in when he rebuilt my pump. Was just curious.
Rob
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1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 16 Aug 2024 at 8:49pm |
Allis folks, Well we have made some small moves to get items to bring this CA engine back to working order sometime in the future. A reworked cam and lifters from Paul will get things started. Some things to learn to get that set up correctly. Lots of measuring of the crank journals and the cylinders and pistons. Sandy Lake (Brenda) has helped figure out some of the other components to refurb this engine. New rings have been checked in the bore and the end gap is within the specs of .007 to .017 inches. pistons are being cleaned up. I will hone the cylinders to get a good surface. A new set of main crank bearings at .010 under should tighten up the thrust. So those are on their way also. The head and flywheel are at the machine shop for improvements. New clutch and pressure plate and complete gasket kit is ready for being included in the assembly. I am going to clean the block or take it to be cleaned. All the tapped holes in the block have been chased and cleaned out. The electrolysis tank needs to get set up again to help clean some of the engine items, like the pan and the front cover. I did get the new stud installed in the front of the engine, replacing the bent one (from when the block fell on the floor). I will try to get some pictures loaded. Yea lots of work to do on this tractor.
Tractor pull tomorrow at local show grounds. If the weather is good we will get to pull a stone boat loaded with dirt as the weight classes increase. I am taking the WZ with a bunch of weights loaded on it. Man the jib crane works great to install these weights. Will try to get some pictures too. Kind of a fun pull to let off steam and earn bragging rights. Regards, Chris and Cheryl
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 11 Aug 2024 at 8:48pm |
Paul, Folks, I am all for trying that option to improve the thrust on this CA engine. The thickness of the front main is approx. 1.620 inches. Not sure what the dimension of a new lower main is? Thanks for the support! Regards, Chris and Cheryl
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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PaulB
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Posted: 11 Aug 2024 at 7:37am |
You could probably get away with just replacing the 1/2 main bearing that is the thrust half. I've done that many times with a NOS bearing that I had on hand. As I mentioned in my clutch synopsis above: A heavy springed pressure plate will quickly ruin the thrust bearing in a BE/CE block. Aftermarket clutch rebuilders will claim that additional spring pressure will be better for the clutch disc, however it has an averse effect on the thrust bearing.
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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY
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