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CA no oil pressure!

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84 prospector View Drop Down
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Joined: 30 Aug 2022
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    Posted: 30 Aug 2022 at 9:14pm
Hi I just joined this forum because I have been working on an AC. This tractor has been sitting for at least 15 years. I rebuilt the carburetor and rebuilt the distributor and now the tractor is running and starts great and fast. I looked at the gauge though and the pressure gauge doesn’t move. So I took the gauge off the tee and there was oil in the tee, but I decided to pour some down the tee to top it off to try and prime the pump. I started it with the gauge off and the elbow fitting off and it will push oil out of the top of the tee when I start it but after 3 or 4 seconds it will stop pushing oil out. What should be my next step to get some pressure?
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Dakota Dave View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dakota Dave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Aug 2022 at 10:36pm
Take off the fitting going into the back of the block use a pressure oil can an pump it full of heavy oil put the fitting back on if you leave it off it'll never prime. Start it back up if you don't get pressure in 10 seconds do it again. If you don't get pressure now pull the engine take the pump off look and see if the drive pin is still in the back of the cam. Pack it full of light grease. Check the pickup tube for cracks. It dosent take much to crack it when the engine was apart. A tiny crack and it'll suck air instead of oil.
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steve(ill) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Aug 2022 at 10:51pm
you changed the old oil ? ...... Or it looks real good and is FULL ?

Is there a name on the oil filter ?... Remove it and look at the center steel tube that goes up the middle... has a small hole at the top ... tube is in place ?
Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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84 prospector View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 84 prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Aug 2022 at 10:52pm
Is this fitting you are talking about the tee that comes out of the block, up to the gauge or down a tube to the oil filter housing? Should I use 20 50 oil or gear oil to pack down there? Thanks for the help!

Edited by 84 prospector - 30 Aug 2022 at 10:58pm
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84 prospector View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 84 prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Aug 2022 at 10:57pm
The oil looks good and is full. I have not changed the oil yet, I need to weld a nut on the filter to get it off it is stuck pretty well.
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DiyDave View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DiyDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 4:28am
Drop the pan and inspect the oil pickup pipe and screen...Wink
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steve(ill) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 7:24am
this is the fiilter.... the blue circle is the location of the pump inside the bell housing on the end of the cam shaft.... the yellow arrow is the TEE that comes out of the top of the pump and has a steel curved line to the bottom of the filter... take that line off and pump oil down the tube into the TEE, down into the pump... 10w-30 oil is fine... 20w50 is a little thick unless it is plenty warm ambient outside.

I have never had to weld a nut on the filter... just a big strap wrench should take if off.... The tube in the BOTTOM of the filter is the inlet... After the filter is off, you will see a 1/4 inch TUBE up the center of the filter with a small 1/8 inch hole on the top... that is how the oil gets into the filter and then drains to sump... If the tube is gone, or hole is way big, then too much oil goes into the filter and pressure is lost.

this is a BYPASS FILTER.. it filters oil and dumps to sump.. It does NOT filter the oil going to the engine  / bearings.

Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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steve(ill) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 7:29am
as DAVE mentioned, the pump sucks up oil thru a tube/ screen in the bottom of the oil pan.. If you get the oil filter off and prime the pump and still have no pressure, you might try to remove the oil pan and inspect the suction screen... Before doing that, drain the oil and see if there is any CRUD in the bottom.. Sometimes a drain and new oil will help.

Edited by steve(ill) - 31 Aug 2022 at 7:30am
Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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84 prospector View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 84 prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 9:22am
I’m sure there’s sludge in the pan from how long it has been sitting. I will drain the oil and remove the pan and make sure everything is clean if i can get my hands on the right oil filter today.
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Dick L View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dick L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 11:14am
You can prime the pump by removing the filter and poring oil down the tube in the filter cup. Any spilled oil runs into the pan. Most of the time the filter is just hand tight. 

I have a sticky M


Edited by Dick L - 31 Aug 2022 at 11:57am
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84 prospector View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 84 prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 11:30am
This filter has been on there for a long time and I tried taking off by hand but it’s stuck on there. I will use a band wrench and if that don’t work I will weld a nut on the top. Should a 3 3/4 band wrench work?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dick L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 11:51am
I don't have that kind of care of an old oil filter. I drive a large screwdriver thru it and break it loose.  Never thought of saving and old dirty filter. Being 84 might give me a different perspective. 

If you want to check the oil flow you can crank the engine over with the filter off to see oil flow up thru the tube.  The gage could have a plug in it fro setting.


Edited by Dick L - 31 Aug 2022 at 11:56am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TomC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 12:02pm
Cut yourself a strip of sandpaper that just goes around the filter,sand side on the filter,put your filter wrench over the sandpaper, get sandpaper and wrench as close to the threads as possible.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tbone95 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 1:57pm
Originally posted by Dick L Dick L wrote:

I don't have that kind of care of an old oil filter. I drive a large screwdriver thru it and break it loose.  Never thought of saving and old dirty filter. Being 84 might give me a different perspective. 

If you want to check the oil flow you can crank the engine over with the filter off to see oil flow up thru the tube.  The gage could have a plug in it fro setting.
10-4 on the screwdriver.  Made that work, except that 1 time it didn't!  Started reefing on the screwdriver, eventually the metal of the filter gave way, and we opened that filter just like used a can opener!!!  LOL At that point, yer really screwed, you HAVE to do something, as the vehicle can't be ran at all now.  Ended up with a massive Channellock set of pliers on it at the base, squeezing like crazy, and it finally cracked loose.  Crazy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sparky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 2:11pm
When you use the screwdriver filter wrench be careful not to ruin the stand pipe.
It's the color tractor my grandpa had!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Les Kerf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 2:24pm
Originally posted by sparky sparky wrote:

When you use the screwdriver filter wrench be careful not to ruin the stand pipe.


X2
Yup. That stand pipe is right there where the screwdriver would pass through, you have a fair chance of causing some damage to it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 2:35pm
There is no need to use a screw driver unless you bought an old tractor / truck and the original owner put it in  with a breaker bar !!....  Filters that i have put on, i can take off with an 8 inch long filter wrench..

The tractor only puts out about 15 psi max.. You might only have 10 psi on an old motor.. You dont have a lot of flow either... If your careful taking the filter off, you can check the tube and crank to check flow, then reinstall the OLD FILTER.. It really dont do much anyway since it is a BYPASS... you can install NEW at a later date when you do the oil.
Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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84 prospector View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 84 prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 5:39pm
I got a bypass filter, so I went to take the old filter off and it’s a regular filter on the inside like a car. The base plate is like a car too and doesn’t have a tube it had a ac pf6 filter on it. I would put pictures of the filter and base but I don’t know how
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84 prospector View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 84 prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 5:52pm
It’s like a normal filter and the threads are in the middle like a regular filter on a car or truck, and there wasn’t much oil in it when I took it off

Edited by 84 prospector - 31 Aug 2022 at 6:02pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 84 prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 6:54pm
I can’t even find one of these pf6 filters is there any cross references?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 84 prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 8:32pm
I poured oil down the center of where the filter screws on until it was full and filled the tee up and started it and it was steadily streaming oil out of the filter base and didn’t stop like it did on the tee.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sparky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 8:33pm
Someone really cobbled that up. You need to get the correct filter housing,gasket, lines, standpipe and filter and I think then you’ll be back in business.
It's the color tractor my grandpa had!
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84 prospector View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 84 prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 8:38pm
Is that filter system the reason it doesn’t have pressure?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sparky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 8:46pm
Putting it back original is where I’d start to find oil pressure.
It's the color tractor my grandpa had!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 8:58pm
Yes, that is your problem.... The factory TEE  above the bell housing has a tube running to the filter... the OUTLET of your filter goes to the GAUGE and where else ?  I can not tell what the steel pipe / tee / gauge are all connected to.

Lets look at how the system works... The pump pushes oil down a hollow cam shaft. The Shaft has holes it it and oil is sprayed at the piston / rods / bearings for lube...... about 85% of  the oil goes down the hollow cam shaft.... About 15% of the oil comes out of the top TEE on the bell housing and goes to the filter... The original filter cleans that 15%, then DUMPS the oil back to sump thru a hole in the block ( about 1/2 inch diameter), behind the filter.....

You have an automotive filter that cleans the oil, then  "normally" sends the oil to the bearings... Where does the OUTLET of your filter go ???

Look at my photo below.. Right now, you can take the steel tube running from the TEE to the filter inlet and remove it...  Put the gauge on the end of the line so you can see the pressure INSIDE THE PUMP AND CAM SHAFT... You dont need to DUMP OIL BACK TO SUMP thru the filter...  You can run without the filter for now.

Prove the system works, then you can buy the plate that bolts to the motor that has the correct filter mount ... and a new filter... and you will be OK long term..... Just FORGET the filter for now and see what you have..

If the auto motive filter OUTLET pipe is dumping back to sump thru the block, then just remove the filter outlet steel pipe and PLUG IT and reinstall the filter.. You dont want oil going THRU that filter..


Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 9:00pm
again, the big question right now is where does the OIL OUT of the filter ( that 1/4 inch steel pipe) where does it go ( besides the gauge).... is it dumping back to sump thru the 1/2 inch hole in the side of the block ????   Thats where ALL of your oil is going.

Edited by steve(ill) - 31 Aug 2022 at 9:28pm
Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 9:07pm
I looked on e-bay for "allis  oil filter housing" and came up with this.. It mounts to the engine block with two bolts and the oil drains into the block thru the center hole... The guy wants $90.  ........ dont think i would pay that.. Again, you can run quite some time with NO FILTER... just plug the line.... see if you have pressure from the pump to gauge.


Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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84 prospector View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 84 prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Aug 2022 at 9:39pm
So just to be clear I can’t use the filter setup that is on it? Is the system now going to be starving it of oil? I am new to this type of oil system and know nothing of it
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