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BraedonAllisB 
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Joined: 16 Feb 2020
Location: Lynden WA
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 Topic: What Kind of implements will my Allis B take?
Posted: 16 Feb 2020 at 4:28pm |
hello, I am new to the Allis Chalmers Forum, the reason i have joined is because just today i bought a 1940 Allis Chalmers B, Im needing some help with a few questions, the B I got is stock with no electric start or anything
Question 1: does the stock B have a PTO, if so will it work for modern day equipment such as bush hogs and manure spreaders
Question 2: how hard is it to install a 3 point conversion on a B? do ya think a stock b will have a hydraulic pump to raise and lower the 3 point.
Question 3: will Allis Chalmers C implements work on my B?
thanks in advance, new member of the AC group, Braedon from Lynden Washington  |
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1940 B
19__ WD
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DiyDave
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Posted: 16 Feb 2020 at 6:02pm |
Post your serial number, its in front of gearshift, has tractor no in raised letters, s# will be stamped in.
1. look and see if it has a pto shaft sticking out the middle. If it does, measure it. newer ones have 1-3/8" 6 spline, older ones are smaller, 1-1/8 X 6 spline, adapters are available.
2. aftermarket 3 points basically just bolt on. As to hydraulics, the pump should be on the RH side, opposite the belt pulley. If it has PTO, should have hyd.
3. some plows will, mowers will, all depends on the hardware you have on hand...
Welcome to the site, post s#, and pics if you have them, and others will be along to reply...  |
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mdm1
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Posted: 16 Feb 2020 at 6:13pm |
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My 39 B doesn't have a pto. Just has a dome cover where the pto would go. I do have a pto to put on it but it is just the pto still no hydraulics.
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Everything is impossible until someone does it! WD45-trip loader 1947 c w/woods belly mower, 1939 B, #3 sickle mower 1944 B, 2 1948 G's. Misc other equipment that my wife calls JUNK!
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BraedonAllisB
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Posted: 16 Feb 2020 at 8:18pm |
  here are the pictures, it is serial #38267 it currently has a belt pully on it (anyone know how to turn it on? Do I pull the round lever under the seat?
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1940 B
19__ WD
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DiyDave
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Posted: 16 Feb 2020 at 8:47pm |
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looks like a 1940...
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BraedonAllisB
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Posted: 16 Feb 2020 at 10:09pm |
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yes, according to tractordata.com it makes it a 1940
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1940 B
19__ WD
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BraedonAllisB
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Posted: 16 Feb 2020 at 10:16pm |
just found out that under the belt pully there still is a normal PTO, not sure, it might need a conversion though, thanks for all the help, glad i found this group!!!
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1940 B
19__ WD
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CrestonM
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Posted: 16 Feb 2020 at 10:58pm |
Dadgum looks like at 21, I'm not the youngest fella on here anymore! Glad to see you have an interest in these old tractors. I got my 1942 B when I was 11 and it's a great machine.
As far as the PTO, yes you pull up on the lever with the round loop under the seat. But have the clutch pressed in when you do it or it'll bark at you when you try to shift it. I have a belly sickle mower like that on mine. Yes, the mower drive sheave is clamped onto the PTO. I'm sure it's the 1 1/8" PTO. You will need an adapter, or preferably an Over Running Coupler (ORC). Both will adapt your PTO to work with newer implements. The ORC is usually suggested because since the PTO is transmission driven (ie-geared to the transmission and rear end) when you get a load on the PTO (think rotary mower) and push in the clutch, the spinning inertia from a rotary mower (for example) will keep turning the PTO and keep pushing the tractor forward. It's not that big of a problem unless you get in a tight corner and need to stop quick. I use one on my tractor when running a combine and rotary mower, and it's kinda nice to have. With a sickle mower this won't be an issue, as they don't have much momentum going.
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CTuckerNWIL
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Posted: 16 Feb 2020 at 11:51pm |
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Shifting the PTO and belt pulley into gear, also engages the cam that runs the hydraulic pump. So, you can't have hydraulic lift pressure without having the PTO running.
Edited by CTuckerNWIL - 21 Feb 2020 at 8:28am
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albrown915
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Posted: 17 Feb 2020 at 9:58am |
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Do not turn on the PTO with the sickle bar mower in transport position! It must be folded down. Keep your fingers away from cutting area when folding cutter bar down because the sickle will move !
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BraedonAllisB
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Posted: 17 Feb 2020 at 10:32am |
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yep, im probably one of the youngest of this group now, thanks for all the tips, it really helps for as i know little to nothing about Allis Chalmers. will definitely take caution with the sickle, what range should i run the throttel when mowing? half, 3/4, full? im assuming i should start the pto in a lower throttle level and slowly bring up RPMs. now what was said, something about the hydralic pump working only when pto on? how will that work if i get a 3 point conversion? will i have to engage pto to lift it up even if i have a brush cutter on the back? thanks again for all the help and fast replys
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1940 B
19__ WD
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mdm1
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Posted: 17 Feb 2020 at 4:59pm |
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You have 2 levers by the right hand side of the seat frame. One will turn on the pto and hydraulic pump. The other is for pump. It should pull in and out. You have to have the clutch in to engage the pto. Let out the clutch and the pto starts. That is why the sickle mower must be down. I have a belly mower on mine and the mower is going in order for the hydraulic lift to work. Someone with more knowledge will chime in. But man be careful with the sickle.
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Everything is impossible until someone does it! WD45-trip loader 1947 c w/woods belly mower, 1939 B, #3 sickle mower 1944 B, 2 1948 G's. Misc other equipment that my wife calls JUNK!
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Dave (Mid-MI)
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Posted: 17 Feb 2020 at 5:17pm |
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The fact that you have a PTO doesn't mean that you have hydraulics. Show us more pics from the rear of the tractor, so we can see what is under the seat.
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BraedonAllisB
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Posted: 17 Feb 2020 at 8:34pm |
i can get some more pictures soon, i dont actually have the tractor yet, payed for it the other day and i am picking it up tommrow, ill take it as that sickel can be a little dangerous   , dont think i will ever get any implements that require belt pully or pto, maybe a disc but no power required. (what would happen if i engaged pto while sickle is up?
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1940 B
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DiyDave
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Posted: 17 Feb 2020 at 9:00pm |
Likely, you'd just bust the wooden pitman arm...
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BraedonAllisB
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Posted: 17 Feb 2020 at 9:32pm |
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ok, just wanted to make sure i shouldent ditch the tractor and run, agaian first time on a tractor like this and trying to learn as much as i can about it
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1940 B
19__ WD
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DaveKamp
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Posted: 17 Feb 2020 at 11:15pm |
Just to clarify, Braedon-
1) You got a GREAT tractor- The first Allis I ever operated, was my grandfather's D17, pulling a hay rake at around 10yrs old. The first Allis I ever owned, was a '48B with hydraulics, and I still have it.
2) I have a '38 hand-start B, looks just like yours, it has a PTO, but no hydraulics. There's a reason why they had hand-start, no lights, and no hydraulics, and there were many (not just Allis, but ALL tractors of this vintage) that were hand-start, but with battery, generator, and lights... and there's historical reasons why they were that way. Learning the socioeconomic and industrial circumstances of the time will open your eyes to things you cannot imagine, so be ready to learn some very fascinating things.
3) Treat the sickle bar like it's an unstable stepchild born from the crossbreeding of an automatic rifle with a samurai sword!!!! Just sitting there, it's downright dangerous, and I know guys that CANNOT COUNT enough reasons to exercise caution, because they lost fingers doin' it. The blade will move when you least expect it, so NEVER EVER EVER allow ANYTHING in that blade, that you don't want swept into a garbage bag, okay?
Lowering the blade changes relative position between the pitman and sickle, hence, the blade will move inside the sickle bar. Bumping the drive will move the bar. Shifting the PTO will move the bar. Passing gas whilst whistling Fur Elise in the wrong key... will move the bar.
Do yourself, and everyone around TWO big favors- First- Cut some planks and plywood, make a nice scabbard that fits over that sickle bar so NOTHING can get in there. it'll protect the bar, and everyone, everything, etc., around. Second- remove the wooden pitman arm, make a pattern of it, paying close attention to the grain direction and wood type... take it to someone who's a good woodworker, and have them work with you to make a couple extras.
-- IF you can make a fixture in your scabbard that will allow you to remove the pitman arm AND use the scabbard to LOCK the sickle blade in position, all the better! -- Put a holder of some type on the scabbard to store the pitman arm, and a couple extra sickle teeth, and some rivets, and a hammer and rivet-set anvil. If you want a super-cool-factor, sand the scabbard, paint a manufacturer's emblem on the wood, Put a good agricultural-coat of varnish on it, then drag it up and down the yard behind your lawnmower to distress it... then clean it up, put it on, and let everyone try to figure out wether it's stock and original.
Your Allis B's 3 point limitation will come first-and-foremost as a function of the amount of weight on the nose. They're powerful, but light little tractors, it won't take much load behind to have you looking at the moon.
They will out-pull some of the meanest mules you'd ever meet. With ballast in the tires, and chains on it, you should worry about the strength of your draft components- shackles, chain, etc., and of course the fasteners holding the drawbar on. I use mine to pull trees, and have surprised many by hooking on things they wouldn't dream it being able.
But realize that the B's function was to bring engine-driven power to farms that were previously done by 1 or 2 strong draft horses. They'd work a field, but what they were REALLY good at, is economical handywork. It will very easily pull an 8-bottom plow...
... down a mile of gravel road to the D21 waiting there...
It's excellent for rounding up a half-dozen empty hay wagons and shuffling 'em down the hill to gather up this morning's bales.
It'll pull a smallish gravity box over good ground to top off a feeder... and it'll run the auger to fill it, too.
It'll run a small plot plow, a small cultivator, pull a pair of 4 foot spike drags, a small disc, or a small planter, and it'll maneuver through narrow trees to get to the feed plot.
Unlike a Ford N, the Allis B is actually strong enough to break things, so keep that in mind when you're feeling a bit over-enthusiastic.
Oh, DO get an overrunning clutch on the PTO- it'll keep you from having to extract yourself from a barbed-wire fence or low-hanging tree branch.
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Wayne180d
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Posted: 18 Feb 2020 at 1:43am |
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Rhoadesy_65
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Posted: 18 Feb 2020 at 6:02am |
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Welcome to the forum Braedon. Good to see more young guys on here to keep the forum going. Like creston said you might be the youngest as both of us are 21, might be a couple other of us here somewhere. Always be thinking one step ahead when using a tractor without live PTO, especially when you have something hooked up like a brush hog. It will push the tractor forward even after you hit the clutch unless you get an overrunning clutch. Our baler has one built in and it makes a huge difference when running it with the D-19 or the H. Also may want to stick to drawn implements as much as possible.
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Farmin' with 1981 7010 PD, Great Grandpas 1947 Farmall H, JD 7000 planter, JD model B drill, NH 316 Baler, NH 1411 Discbine ,JD 100 8 Shank Chisel. Darke County OH
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 18 Feb 2020 at 6:18am |
re: Treat the sickle bar like it's an unstable stepchild born from the crossbreeding of an automatic rifle with a samurai sword!!!
probably the BEST description for it !!!!
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
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BraedonAllisB
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Posted: 18 Feb 2020 at 7:06pm |
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thank you everyone, yes i will be careful with my sickle, or should i say "Rabbid Gun" lol. just picked up the tractor today, having trouble starting it up thought, not sure what i am doing wrong (i will post a video of it on my youtube channel and see if someone can tell me what i am doing wrong, not sure if i will end up getting 3 point for it though, maybe just some pull type implements, i will go shoot some video of it and give the link to the video. yeah ive watched some videos on the videos and they are little beasts.
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1940 B
19__ WD
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BraedonAllisB
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Posted: 18 Feb 2020 at 7:55pm |
https://youtu.be/1oo-X5yKSwA here is the link to the video of it, forgot to mention it has some magneto problems, was told it wont always crank start, was told that can adjust the spark or something
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1940 B
19__ WD
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DiyDave
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Posted: 18 Feb 2020 at 8:13pm |
 BraedonAllisB wrote:
https://youtu.be/1oo-X5yKSwA here is the link to the video of it, forgot to mention it has some magneto problems, was told it wont always crank start, was told that can adjust the spark or something |
Re your questions, in the video, choke is the little lever, on the carb, take the air cleaner hose off, and look inside the carb, to see which way is on or off. Do it this way, once, then take a paint marker and write on where the lever lands, when closed. Next, the fuel shut off should be ccw, to be open, if its a factory fuel bowl. Next, take the fuel line off, and check for positive fuel flow, at the carb. If no fuel flow, take the sediment bowl off, and check if the fuel comes down and out in 2 free flowing streams... If no flow, take the whole sediment bowl assembly off, and see what's caught in the fuel inlet screen...
A word of caution, respect gas for what it is. When possible, work outside, and have buckets for collecting any fuel you drain. Likewise, have a fire extinguisher of the appropriate type handy.
As to starting and running position of the throttle, answer is, have it at the lowest setting that does the job. On a new to me tractor, I always start low, cause it kicks less, on the crank, if it ain't wide open...
Good luck, and let us know how work progresses...
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BraedonAllisB
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Posted: 18 Feb 2020 at 9:06pm |
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will a drainage pipe work just as good to cover the sickel? ive seen setups like it
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1940 B
19__ WD
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CrestonM
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Posted: 18 Feb 2020 at 9:21pm |
I don't want to say they're wrong about a sickle mower being dangerous, because they can be, but unless it's going to shows, I don't see a need for a fancy cover if you just treat it like a loaded gun and be mindful of where you place your hands. When folding my mower up and letting it down, I only place my hands on the skid plate/swath board on the end of the mower. It's about the safest place as it's easy to hold on to and there's no blade very close.
I vouch for sticking to pull type implements or using mounted implements specifically made for the B. The reason for that being the B was not designed for 3pt like the Ford N-series was, and on a B, the design of all the 3pt kits places the ends of the lift arms wayyy far back. That places all the weight far from the tractor, causing the tractor to tip back much more easily. Yes, you can add a bunch of weight to the front end to counteract that. It's all preference I guess.
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BraedonAllisB
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Posted: 18 Feb 2020 at 10:52pm |
Ok thanks, yeah I might use it every now and then (the sickel) but mostly just for going to shows, yeah I like how you put it, treating it as if it were a gun think the cheapest option for me is a drain pipe cover, (saftey reliability at the show, lots of young kids go there and sometimes chase each other round the Tractors 
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1940 B
19__ WD
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mdm1
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Posted: 19 Feb 2020 at 7:54am |
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First I like looks of your tractor. When crank starting never wrap your thumb around the crank. Pull the crank with your fingers only in case it back fires. I have found that they all seem to have a different preference to how they will start. Do you have a kill switch? Spark and good gas flow? Do a search on crank starting a B. Have you had it running at all?
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Everything is impossible until someone does it! WD45-trip loader 1947 c w/woods belly mower, 1939 B, #3 sickle mower 1944 B, 2 1948 G's. Misc other equipment that my wife calls JUNK!
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BraedonAllisB
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Posted: 19 Feb 2020 at 9:47am |
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Yeah I will crank with just fingers, I haven't had it running since I bought it yesterday but Friday the guy who actually drove it will be coming out to hopefully help me, it has some mag problems and doesn't always crank start, it also has a small fuel leak and will hopefully get a new sediment bowl for it today
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1940 B
19__ WD
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Alberta Phil
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Posted: 19 Feb 2020 at 10:02am |
Welcome to the Forum, Braedon. I have a '39 B like yours. The little lever on the carb is the choke, It blocks off most of the air flow to give a much richer mixture for starting, Lever down is full choke and lever up is off. As has been suggested, remove the connecting hose and watch the choke flap as you move the lever to see what we are talking about.
To start mine, I turn on the fuel at the sediment bowl by turning it out to the stop. Give it a minute to fill the carb bowl. Set the throttle about 1/3 way up the quadrant. ( Where you set yours is about right). Set the little choke lever on the carb so it points down. Usually one pull over the top with the crank (thumb on same side as fingers!). Then flip choke lever up level and another pull over the top with the crank and it's usually running. Depending on temperature, it may require a little more choke until it warms up a little.
What you show in your video cranking with the choke on 'til gas leaks out will usually result in flooding. When it gets flooded (far too much gas in the cylinders) it won't start until you clear it. If that happens to mine, I shut off the fuel at the sediment bowl and walk away for a while. Then come back and crank it with the throttle set wide open and NO choke. When it fires and runs, then quickly turn on the fuel at the sediment bowl, then back off on the throttle.
If you need to start it again after it's been running and the engine is warm, you probably don't need to turn the choke lever down, just crank it with the choke open.
Hope this helps to get it started!! Good Luck.
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ac fleet
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Posted: 19 Feb 2020 at 11:49am |
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I have a 38 and the only way it will start is to pull start it. --only time it did start with crank was when I backed it off the truck when I brought it home. Mine has the 1-row cultivator on it.
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