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jaybmiller 
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Greensville,Ont
Points: 21440
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 Posted: 16 Jun 2020 at 8:55am |
re: jib crane please go online and see how much CONCRETE you MUST have as a base !!!! It's a HUGE amount and based on load capacity, reach, and height..... Up here concrete is $150 a yard or more....so the $$ add up fast to fill a big hole.
I have a 24' long, 8" I-beam across the garage,sitting on 2 'jackposts' ( basement posts, ?). It's perfect for splitting tractors, once you get tractor under and paralle to the beam. I also built a rolling gantry crane to split Troy, 20 year ago... 'pre-beam-install'
so please, before you commit, do your 'homework', you could save thosands and get a better 'lifting system'.
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
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tadams(OH)
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Joined: 17 Sep 2009
Location: Jeromesville, O
Points: 9620
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Posted: 16 Jun 2020 at 3:00pm |
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If you don't put insulation under the cement at least put plastic to help with the moister
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Sugarmaker
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Joined: 12 Jul 2013
Location: Albion PA
Points: 8167
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Posted: 16 Jun 2020 at 9:40pm |
Thanks guys! Appreciate the insight and suggestions! On the crane and the cement floor. The insulation cost alone for under the floor would be $2k. Not a cheap date. Nothing is anymore. Current concerns are material availability. Leave it to me to find a time when I want to do something and cant due to lack of materials. Hope to get some things on order this week if possible. Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Joined: 12 Jul 2013
Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 17 Jun 2020 at 6:14am |
Folks, You guys got me scared on the old jib crane idea! Yea big hole and probably a yard of concrete around it would be about right. Getting it plumb could be a small challenge too. Well I have so many moves prior to having a place for it maybe the edge will wear off by then?:) Hope things are good out there in Orange land! Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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DMiller
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Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Location: Hermann, Mo
Points: 29422
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Posted: 17 Jun 2020 at 7:06am |
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Had several jib hoists in one garage I worked, the bases were poured before the floor and the towers bolted to them not embedded into them. Shop floor was then poured around the base piers. Base for a 1t jib structure is far more impressive than one can imagine, three feet across, 6 feet deep and wider at base than top. Was almost three yards in one hole. Half ton structure not much smaller.
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Sugarmaker
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Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 17 Jun 2020 at 11:59am |
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Yes that's about what I would imagine. Thanks for the info.
Regards,
Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Ray54
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Joined: 22 Nov 2009
Location: Paso Robles, Ca
Points: 4340
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Posted: 17 Jun 2020 at 1:08pm |
 Something tells me your not likely going to bring a TD 18 or the really cool HD 19 in to work on it. So a Habor Freight A frame will do most lifting you need. But the fact you don't want to go over 12 feet high is mistake,been there done that. But being poor and cheap I understand.
This is play thing so don't get to stressed out with the whole thing. Start with a shell and fill in the details as you can. I have a pole barn that needs sides real bad but the money tree seems  I just don't know what is wrong  .
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DMiller
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Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Location: Hermann, Mo
Points: 29422
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Posted: 17 Jun 2020 at 3:07pm |
 My A-Frame is Home Made, 8" 21# I Beam on top is on steel PIPE Legs to Channel Iron Feet, stands 12' 4" to underside and close to too short, 12' wide inside. By an engineer's calculations is good for 2 ton, and maybe a few more but best to leave at Two Ton for safety. Is decently level and I have swapped the trans of my 7G three times with it. Trans weight estimated at 1200#.
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Sugarmaker
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Joined: 12 Jul 2013
Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 17 Jun 2020 at 6:13pm |
Folks, Ray and DMiller, Yes I am cheap and poor both. :) If I had all the money I wanted I would go buy a place with some of the things already there. I like the trolley over head crane system, a nice way to go too! I believe the 9 foot OH doors will handle most of the things /toys I have or plan to have?") If its taller than that it will have to set out side. Just got to draw the line somewhere! Maybe the door size will somehow limit the size of the things I bring home! I am planning to have some extra ceiling height in the south end of the shop. Right now things seem to be at a standstill. Thanks for checking on me! I am trying out the space.
Grandson Nic with his two boys and their dog:
Calie:
In front of proposed garage:
Grandson Mike and daughter Chloe trying out the approach:
Regards, Chris
Edited by Sugarmaker - 17 Jun 2020 at 6:14pm
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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allisbred
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Joined: 28 Mar 2015
Location: Hanover Pa
Points: 1011
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Posted: 17 Jun 2020 at 6:31pm |
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Looking good Chris, don’t try too many things in there or you will want it bigger— lol. What ever you do, will be better than you had before.
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Sugarmaker
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Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 17 Jun 2020 at 8:36pm |
allisbred, Folks, Yes I figured I had enough junk and toys to fill it up! I have been collecting for just 8 short years, and try to limit my toy projects, but it is somewhat out of hand already!:) Yes, if we get a shop up by this fall, so I can get my truck in during winter, I will be happy! Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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ac hunter
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Joined: 05 Jan 2011
Location: OHIO
Points: 948
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Posted: 18 Jun 2020 at 11:31pm |
Chris, Would a cherry picker style lift work for what you want to do? They make 2-3 ton capacity ones. I like mine and have pulled engines, lifted loaded rear wheels and many other things. You can move it to where your project is and store it in a corner when not in use and not take up much space and not spend a bunch of money. Looks like most of your tractors are the size I like to work on. Good luck with your shop project. Looks like you are putting a lot of thought into it. Russell.
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Sugarmaker
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Joined: 12 Jul 2013
Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 19 Jun 2020 at 5:35am |
Russ,Folks, Thanks for the support! on my little/ big project. I do use a cherry picker now for engines and lifting some things. So that can be a good option and maybe a lot less work and headache? So still thinking on the jib crane idea. As far as cost my plan was to have less than $500 in the structure. Still thinking on that part of the project.
Have a set down meeting with the builder this morning. The reason it is a set down meeting is because I will need to be setting down when he gives me the quote on all the goodies I want in the building!:)
Wish me luck! Hope we can move forward and maybe get some of the long lead time items like trusses ordered? Sounds like the pressure treated lumber is now like toilet paper. No one has any!
I need to sketch out a vertical wall section to show the details I want in the framing of the sheeting and windows.
Went fishing yesterday on local lake, 17,000 + acres of awesome water. Weather was hot but overcast so I did not bake to bad. Caught one small perch and Jim the boat owner caught a bluegill. Was a nice diversion from the norm. Some pictures:
Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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IBWD MIke
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Joined: 08 Apr 2012
Location: Newton Ia.
Points: 3436
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Posted: 19 Jun 2020 at 8:07am |
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Would that lake be Pymatuning? I have heard about it all the way over here in Iowa. Need to get my boat out one of these days!
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Sugarmaker
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Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 20 Jun 2020 at 3:07am |
Mike, yes thats the reservoir. Here are the pictures that I did not have time to get loaded this morning.
Captain Jim:
couple old farts out for a day on the water:
bluegill:
in a lagoon calm and very warm:
heading home:
A great day. Lucky it was very calm, I get motion sick very easy.
Back on shop talk. I ordered trusses today. Those may be 5 weeks out. One of the largest costs of the project. So I believe we are moving forward. Still tweeking design details for wall cross sections. And yes Pressure treated wood for skirt boards are not currently available these would be 2x10 x 16 foot. Pipeline needs to be refilled. Maybe they will be available when the trusses are ready? Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 21 Jun 2020 at 6:36am |
Folks, I am ready for some one to dig holes and get going! Oh wait we are in the hurry up and wait mode. That's OK! The pad is in. It is very solid, and has dried out good. Most of my big design decisions have been made. Just down to some of the details that will happen as we go. Most of my budget is ear marked for materials and or labor. Looks like the interior will have to wait on funds. My plan is to try to do some of the sweat equity work also. Will see how that works out!:) Current goal is to try to have a building and all exterior complete for winter. The other real big thing is that the wife is still tolerating me, and somewhat on board with the project! Wonderful woman! Regards, Chris
Edited by Sugarmaker - 21 Jun 2020 at 6:38am
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Ted J
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Joined: 05 Jul 2010
Location: La Crosse, WI
Points: 18699
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Posted: 21 Jun 2020 at 2:18pm |
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If Momma's happy, everyone else is happy. Aren't they the best!? You'd think after raising the kids and they left home, she'd be sick of taking care of teenagers. But here we are.....
Life is GREAT Chris. It's looking like it's taking shape for ya.
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"Allis-Express"
19?? WC / 1941 C / 1952 CA / 1956 WD45 / 1957 WD45 / 1958 D-17
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Sugarmaker
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Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 02 Jul 2020 at 8:58am |
Folks, Just a brief update. I have this thing about trying to have a jib crane in the building. I dont know why just another project and toy to monkey with. So anyway I did get some rebar with the intention of having it in the pipe so that I could pour the pipe full of concrete after it is installed. So yesterday was rebar day. sure it was only 90 degrees F. Welded the roads to the bottom foot plate:
Some x bracing to keep them seperated and two 10 foot lenghts overlapped and welded to make up 17' 5" long.
Guiding welded rebar and base plate into the pipe:
Inserted to top of pipe and base plate welded to the pipe. If it never goes in this was a good job to keep my welding and fab skills up to date.
Hope to order material for the rest of the building maybe early next week. Here is the Pressure tread lumber for the skirt boards inside and out side of the building. 2 x 10 Pressure treated. and 2 x 6 PT for the lower cap between them.
Trusses should be here first of August. May have the frame work started for them in a couple weeks? Just finishing up window placement and size and type details. Plus am considering going back to a vinyl for the upper siding. I know I can handle the vinyl install if I need to. Also ordered the hemlock wainscoting. It will be ship lap, 7/8 thick and 10 inches wide. covers 9 inches. That will take some time But I plan to install that myself to try to save some labor costs. We will see how that all goes!:) Thanks for checking in on me! Regards, Chris
Edited by Sugarmaker - 02 Jul 2020 at 9:00am
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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DMiller
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Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Location: Hermann, Mo
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Posted: 02 Jul 2020 at 9:26am |
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A caution on trusses, will have paperwork to sign for them, need to be setting them fairly soon after delivered to reduce twisting and warping. They will have that noted as to the product warranty. Be getting that structure up and braced well!!!
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 02 Jul 2020 at 11:50am |
DMiller, Thanks for the heads up. Yes there is a bunch of moves just to be ready for the trusses. The plan is to rent a material handler to help with some of the heavy lifting. These truss units will be near 400 lb. Will try to get a bunch of pictures as usual. Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Ray54
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Joined: 22 Nov 2009
Location: Paso Robles, Ca
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Posted: 03 Jul 2020 at 10:39am |
If just the trusses add a pole to the bucket of the track loader. That's how I lifted trusses and I just had a little Massey wheel tractor.
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steve(ill)
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: illinois
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Posted: 03 Jul 2020 at 12:57pm |
several years ago i put up a barn and had no help available for the rafters.. I took a dozen 2 x 6 boards and bolted them together to make a triangle base with triangle uprights and a ridge pole... I put a boat winch on it and a few blocks as counter weight if needed... Keep the front "FEET" close to the front of the boom and the rafter will kind of slide up the legs and keep it from spinning.. I would drag the boom around with the B tractor and place it by eye under the rafter location... Set the rafter under it and start winching ... unlike a boom on a tractor, you could stop at any time, reposition, set one end of rafter on sill plate, etc, without worry of hydraulics settling, etc....Rafters only weigh a few hundred pounds so its not much weight for a 2 x 6 ridge pole.
Edited by steve(ill) - 03 Jul 2020 at 12:58pm
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Sugarmaker
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Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 03 Jul 2020 at 3:15pm |
Steve, Folks, Good sketch. My uncle used a WD45 with a bucket and two 2 x 6's tapering to a point to lift his trusses. It worked very well. I had a flash back and remember him building them for his pole barn. I was maybe 12-13 years old. My bucket loader might work but it is having hydraulic issues and is at another site. Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 07 Jul 2020 at 8:54pm |
Folks, Brief update. Getting building materials on order today. Should see some action in two weeks. Maybe get the posts set and framing up for trusses to arrive last week of July. Will try to post some pictures. On a side note I did demo the "vast warehouse" and it has been destroyed. I had no idea you could pack so much stuff in a 10 x 12 shed!:) Most went on the junk pile. Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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DMiller
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Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Location: Hermann, Mo
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Posted: 08 Jul 2020 at 5:58am |
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Can relate, have a 16x16 for the Yard shed, need to wade in there and thin that herd pile of Crap out!!
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Sugarmaker
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Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 08 Jul 2020 at 6:33am |
DMiller, Folks, I found stuff from when I was a kid, had horse items in there, motor cycle parts, Fishing poles, Deer processing equipment, oils, and grease, fertilizer and garden items, battery charger, house siding, and lots of old Allis parts! I think I need a dumpster! I am planning to use the spot to back my trailer on to the old cement pad, to get it out of the way. Regards, Chris
Edited by Sugarmaker - 08 Jul 2020 at 6:34am
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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IBWD MIke
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Posted: 08 Jul 2020 at 8:14am |
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Sounds like a great trip through memory lane.
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Sugarmaker
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Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 09 Jul 2020 at 12:15pm |
D Miller, Folks, Yes I gave my old old tack box to my Granddaughter Marly. She is moving to a new house with a barn so she can use it for some special items in her life. I made it when I was about 13, her age now. Getting things cleaned up and out of the weather for a while. Regards, Chris
Edited by Sugarmaker - 14 Jul 2020 at 7:07am
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 14 Jul 2020 at 7:16am |
Folks, I plan to take a bunch of pictures as we get started with a pole type building next week. Assuming the weather cooperates too. Most of the structure and materials are due here Friday. Maybe we will layout and drill holes and get the pole footer cement in place this weekend and then start to set poles Monday? Have had many opinions on building a structure. From the lower cost steel tubular frame steel covered buildings, to the full concrete block foundation with std wall framing. I guess I have chosen a building that falls in the middle. Had the concrete folks here last night and they are going to quote me the cost of adding 2 inch foam inside under the concrete and also frost barrier with same foam around the building and vertical in front of each door too. Will see what those numbers look like. Starting to look forward to the progress. The options to design and build a custom building are endless! At some point the budget and reality kick in! Want to thank all that have contributed ideas and suggestions! All good!
Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 14 Jul 2020 at 9:40pm |
Folks, Like a dog on a bone I cant seem to let this Jib crane thing go!:) I call it working the low steel! I drug home some steel and will see if I can burn, grind, whack, and weld something that may look like a jib crane together. Really! I drug them from the neighbors woods, with Coopers WZ: 3 wide x 5 inches high I beams:
These will become the pivot joints for the crane structure:
Hole sawed 8 places, then torched out the web to allow tubing to be inserted. 1 inch rod will be the pivot joint.
Trial of the pivot joint, which is under the swing beam. Tubing in place as trial fit up:
The stubs will be welded to the channel then the channel welded to the support tube. My goal is to have all the welding done on the ground then set the pole, cement and then mount the crane boom assembly.
Here is the layout as pieces are cut and fit up. The angled beam is on the top when installed and the crane swings 180 degrees in the high bay area of the shop. At least that's the plan?
Going to try to hook up my old Lincoln 225 amp buzz box to weld this stuff together. I have had it for 10 years and never tried it yet! Good project for stick welder. Now do I have any rod! Humm! Will have at least another day in the fab shop. For fit up, dimension checking, tacking then finish weld. McMaster Carr has a 1 ton trolley that I will probably get to use on the swing beam. Approx $200. Will go cheap and maybe just use a chain falls that I have for a while.
News on the proposed building: Builder is coming Thursday night to lay out for the post holes. Digging holes and setting poles should happen over the weekend.
Ordered another window (3 x 3) for the north gable end to get some natural light in the loft storage room and stairwell. Builder says we can work that in too! Its only money!
Back is a little stiff tonight. Not used to this cheap physical stuff!:) Regards, Chris
Edited by Sugarmaker - 14 Jul 2020 at 9:52pm
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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