Found a B
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=8716
Printed Date: 19 Jan 2025 at 3:55pm
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Topic: Found a B
Posted By: mooboy
Subject: Found a B
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 7:43am
| A local implement company has an AC B for sale, S/N 09345. Would this be a 1939 model? It is in rough shape, non running, most tires flat. It has a magneto, but looks like a previous owner tried to adapt a standard 12V coil to the tractor. Is it possible fire a standard coil using the magneto points? Tractor has a dead 12V battery. Not sure if the engine is free to turn or not. Was it the second generator engine that had the distributor? Not really familiar with the AC B, wondering if I want to try a restoration. Comments, advice, or suggestions? |
Replies:
Posted By: LouSWPA
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 7:52am
| Yes, I was told that ot was not uncommon to "modify" the mag to run with a battery and coil. Down side is if you want to restore to stock you will need another mag because the "modification" puts a hole in the case. According to my book your serial no makes it a '38 |
Posted By: Bob-Maine
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 7:52am
|
Mooboy, C.H. Wendel's book says that this is a '38 B. Can't help you with the coil - mag question, but someone will respond. Sounds to me like a real $ challenge to restore. Be best to see if the engine is free and if it can be started. An engine rebuild, with new tires, maybe new rims, etc. would run into a lot of $.
Bob@allisdowneast |
Posted By: MilesGray (CO/KS)
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 8:19am
|
It's Definitely a 38, I have one that is 94something and it is a 38 too...
------------- Miles Gray (CO/KS) 5 1938 B's, 1940 B, 1944 WF C, 1948 NF C, Gleaner A, White Top Rotobaler, 1957 IH Golden Jubilee... I'm either a collector, or crazy! |
Posted By: MilesGray (CO/KS)
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 8:23am
|
well, I used to know how to do this...
Must be cause I haven't used a tractor all winter
 ------------- Miles Gray (CO/KS) 5 1938 B's, 1940 B, 1944 WF C, 1948 NF C, Gleaner A, White Top Rotobaler, 1957 IH Golden Jubilee... I'm either a collector, or crazy! |
Posted By: Ken in Texas
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 8:39am
|
Restoring any tractor that is in a non running rough condition is a expensive challange. Don't expect to make any money restoring unless someone is paying you by the hour to do a restoration. Collecting and restoring tractors is a hobby like bass fishing.
A real rare tractor may be worth more restored than the cost to restore. A B, unless it is one of the first 96, or a factory asparagus or potato B will not bring a price equal to restoration costs. I should maybe include the IB.
I don't remember any SN's beginning with a 0. Does it look like B751 in a post about 5 or 6 pages back. I will try to bump it up to make it easy to find.
|
Posted By: mooboy
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 8:49am
|
It was getting dark so I could not see the s/n real good. This tractor did have lights, PTO, a hydraulic cylinder on the rear, and a semi-circle draw bar with multiple holes. |
Posted By: mooboy
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 9:03am
Here is a picture of it. It has some interesting levers on the rear. |
Posted By: MilesGray (CO/KS)
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 9:23am
|
Could the 0 on the front of the Serial number be a C? that looks a lot like my wide front C, and it has the C ribbed Fenders... Miles
------------- Miles Gray (CO/KS) 5 1938 B's, 1940 B, 1944 WF C, 1948 NF C, Gleaner A, White Top Rotobaler, 1957 IH Golden Jubilee... I'm either a collector, or crazy! |
Posted By: mooboy
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 9:32am
| It was getting dark and I wondered if it was a 0 or something else. It could well have been a C. The tractor was advertised as a B, but maybe it is not. What is the difference between an AC B and a C tractor? |
Posted By: MilesGray (CO/KS)
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 9:54am
|
don't worry, I bought my C thinking it was a B, so you are not the first... normally the C has a narrow front... The C has a wider rear and can take somewhat larger implements, as well as anything a B can use.. ------------- Miles Gray (CO/KS) 5 1938 B's, 1940 B, 1944 WF C, 1948 NF C, Gleaner A, White Top Rotobaler, 1957 IH Golden Jubilee... I'm either a collector, or crazy! |
Posted By: MilesGray (CO/KS)
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 10:07am
|
Also, if that is a C it is a 1941... ------------- Miles Gray (CO/KS) 5 1938 B's, 1940 B, 1944 WF C, 1948 NF C, Gleaner A, White Top Rotobaler, 1957 IH Golden Jubilee... I'm either a collector, or crazy! |
Posted By: GBACBFan
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 10:14am
|
It looks to me like a B front and a C rear. For some reason there seems to be a lot of those creations out there. ------------- "The trouble with quotes on the Internet is that you can never know if they are genuine." - Mark Twain |
Posted By: MilesGray (CO/KS)
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 10:32am
|
Larry,
Mine looks just like this, including the openings on the hood, the only thing that may not be factory is the wishbone front. Mine even has the Pedestal and Hole in the radiator shroud for the original NF.
But you are right, it might be different front and rear, but my B's have a different engine shroud. ------------- Miles Gray (CO/KS) 5 1938 B's, 1940 B, 1944 WF C, 1948 NF C, Gleaner A, White Top Rotobaler, 1957 IH Golden Jubilee... I'm either a collector, or crazy! |
Posted By: GBACBFan
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 10:51am
|
These little buggers have been morphed every which way, it seems like, but they keep running. I think DickL has a C front with a B rear, making kind of a cool looking little narrow front tractor. If I remember right, I think he said it was a bit tippy, but then anything earlier than this morning's breakfast I don't remember very well. ------------- "The trouble with quotes on the Internet is that you can never know if they are genuine." - Mark Twain |
Posted By: ALinIL
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 11:28am
| MOO - That is a C with the longer axles than a B and the dished rear hubs are for the C. The B had flat rear hubs. If the mag has been modified for use with a battery coil, it can be salvaged. If the cap has hole drilled-in for the wires, it can be repaired. I have repaired caps before. You need to look further into the mag to see what else maybe needed. Neither repairs or a replacement mag is not cheap. - AL |
Posted By: wjohn
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 12:22pm
|
If you can get it cheaply enough, why not just go for it? ------------- 1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45 |
Posted By: ChuckLuedtkeSEWI
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 12:33pm
| Not to criticize things, just to point things out, it looks like the front rims at least the one in the front corner, looks to be a car rim spare, not a B rim. It's missing the generator, or may have had an alternator. If the belt went around the crank, water pump and the generator, then that will have to be addressed to keep the water pump moving at least to get it running. You could always put an old car alternator on it if you're not trying to restore it perfect. You're missing the toolbox cover which is that little hole in front of the battery. You're also missing the top and sides of the battery box. Is the starter still on it? As everyone else says, it is a C with a B wide front. Not a big deal but if you're going to restore it, you'll probably think about going back to original and changing that out. I would say that if the rear tires are usable and the rear rims are not rotted out, and you can get it to crank over by hand, I would say $400-500 tops. You might get it for less then that. With it not running and it's condition, I would not go higher then that. Either way, by the time you're done fixing it and making it a reliable runner, you probably will have too much invested to get your money back on it. That being said, it's still a fun hobby and a fun way to learn about these old machines and once you get it up and running, you'll fall in love with it. I have a B and I love that little thing. In another year or two, my daughter will be old enough to give her a spin around the yard without me anymore. You have definately found the right spot for help. Good luck and keep us posted. |
Posted By: ToddSin NY
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 2:10pm
| Is the block welded under the carb? Can't tell but looks like welding. |
Posted By: mooboy
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 3:10pm
|
ToddSin, Good eye. Yes, that is welding. Do you know if water is behind that part of the block or oil and crankcase? I thought it might be from a thrown rod or something (triangle shape weld). Or I guess it could be from coolant freezing. |
Posted By: Alberta Phil
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 5:05pm
| By the location of the weld I would say that #1 rod tried to escape at some time!! Definitely looks like a restorable tractor and there are a lot of 'B' parts around. A great little tractor when up and running. I have at least two! |
Posted By: steve(ill)
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 7:29pm
|
As the guys said, its not a B , its a C with a B front end. Busted block, not running, flat tires, mag with a hole in it... thats a $250 tractor. A mag has point inside and a coil inside. If the $50. coil goes bad some will take a $15 car coil and mount on the outside and use the drive and point inside the old mag. Will cost something to fix that. It is fixable, but not restorable since it is not a complete B, but basically a C with B parts. ------------- Like them all, but love the "B"s. |
Posted By: David Gantt N.C.
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 7:56pm
| Got to go with Steve on this , its a $250 tractor, you can run it with a car coil long as its wired right and you need a tractor just to use, does not look to bad I have drug them out of the weeds worse looking than that, does look like a C rear end(axle housings) they are longer than the B housings, look on top of transmission beside shifter does the # start with a C- ####, still might make a good little tractor just to use, good luck with it. |
Posted By: Ken in Texas
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 8:58pm
| I have to agree. It may be worth $250 as a parts tractor. To a person who parts ACs out for part of their living. Probably not that much. |
Posted By: DREAM
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 9:18pm
|
From the bellhousing back, it is all C. Not too sure about the front. I know wide front Cs were made, but not sure how many and what years. The levers you are talking about on the back are the depth adjuster levers for the front-mounted 80 series cultivators. The drawbar appears to be for an Athens disc plow. There should be a peice of angle iron all the way across between the final drive housings, with a U-shaped bar attached to that made from round tubing. There should be a linkage arm from the back of the U-shaped peice up to the rockershaft that runs horizontally behind the seat. Should also have a hydraulic pump to the right of the rear PTO shaft. There should be a lever running up to the right side of the seat platform from the pump. That is the control lever for the lift. She looks pretty rough. Rims and tires dont look too good. If engine is seized too, may be more than you want to get into. Does look like she's thrown a rod at some point too from the welding on the block. Just goes to show how tough these little rascals are. Weld up the hole, put in some new or used parts, and go back to work. Find the engine number on the block, that should help ID if the motor is somewhere close to the same year as the tractor. |
Posted By: DREAM
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 9:27pm
|
Moo, just noticed you said the drawbar was semicircular with a lot of holes in it. That is the standard drawbar. I can clearly see the Athens drawbar in the picture, but it looks like I can see part of the standard drawbar also. I wonder how they got both on there. I don't think the Athens drawbar would lift if the other drawbar was bolted on. I think it would hit it. Anyone else know? |
Posted By: steve(ill)
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 9:35pm
|
Thats a B front axle and radiator wrap around. C never had a wishbone alxe, and there would be a cutout for the front pedisol gear box on a C wrap around. Appears to have a B steering box also since the arm points down.... maybe just a C rear end on a B. ------------- Like them all, but love the "B"s. |
Posted By: DREAM
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2010 at 9:48pm
| Could be. Changed from the tranny box back. Left the torque tube and all in front of it B. Maybe someone wanted a wide front two row tractor with hydraulics? |
Posted By: mooboy
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2010 at 7:31am
| Wow! I appreciate everyone's responses. I've learned allot. The equipment dealer web site says he wants $500 for it, and I got the picture from the web site also. I've only seen the tractor once. Now I know more about what to look for if I go back. Honestly, I'm thinking that tractor may be worth $150-$200. Allot of unknowns. It does have a hydraulic pump and one hydraulic cylinder mounted above axle level, pointing horizontally aft on one side only. I couldn't figure out what it could be used for. The cylinder stroke looked to be greater than one foot. |
Posted By: Steve in NJ
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2010 at 7:47am
|
I don't know, but I'd say that ole' bugger from the Battery forward looks all B model to me. The jury is still out on the rear. Looks wider than a normal B from the pic angle, so it could be one of those B/C's folks come across once in a while. That guy looks savable to me. My B was in worst shape than that when I pulled it outta' the woods with a stuck engine. If you have the time and the dough, you can get er' whipped back into shape and put her to work. As for the Mag, the old "hang a automotive coil outside trick" was a commonly used technic in the field when an early tar taped coil failed. When I first dragged my B outta' the woods it had a coil mounted to the outside of the block. Someone drilled two holes right through the side of the block, tapped the holes and hung a coil. When I restored the Tractor, I just installed two fiber washers under two new bolts and plugged the holes. The modified Mags can be repaired. I've done quite a few for folks including my own.... Steve@B&B |
Posted By: steve(ill)
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2010 at 8:07am
|
mooboy, your thinking right on the price. the small 3/4 inch bore cylinder is stock. It was used to lift a plow or cultivator ont he back. normally there is a "rock shaft" which is a 1-1/4 diameter solid steel bar mounted from fender brace to fender brace behind the seat. That shaft has 2-3 different crank arms on it that bolt to the plow/ cultivater, and one arm that the cylinder pushes onto. IT s small but has quite a bit of lift due to being 3200 psi system. Not a bad little tractor, but i dont like the C wide rear personally so its worth less to me from that point. ------------- Like them all, but love the "B"s. |
Posted By: Bob-Maine
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2010 at 8:18am
|
Mooboy, All I ask is that you let us know what you decide to do. If you decide to dicker with the dealer, let us know how you make out. Then, if you get it, keep us posted on how you progress. I agree with the most recent suggestions on value. By now, you have found out how much help can be found here. Never hesitate to ask for some.
Bob@allisdowneast |
Posted By: NCWC
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2010 at 10:38am
|
Looks like a diamond in the rough but no more than 200 dollars! ------------- B,C,CA,RC,WC,Unstyled WC,WD,WD-45,B puller, WC Puller,WD Puller, WD-45 Puller |
Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2010 at 12:21pm
|
I'm in the $200- $250 range. I'd take cash in the form of $20's and stick it under their nose. Fanned out, it looks better than a check book. Cash always seems to talk louder than anything else. I like to see them saved from being junked, even if it is a combination...
------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: Steve in NJ
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2010 at 5:46pm
|
I'm wit' Bri on dat' one. Save it, even though its a little "mixed up"! A Duece should take that puppy home. Fan out 10 $20. dollar bills like Brian said. Money talks.... Steve@B&B |