D17D LOSING PRIME?
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=36279
Printed Date: 25 Aug 2025 at 12:06pm
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Topic: D17D LOSING PRIME?
Posted By: Toneman1
Subject: D17D LOSING PRIME?
Date Posted: 28 Aug 2011 at 10:25am
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Once again I am turning to the forum for some help. Recently my D-17D IV would not start. We found the pump was not putting out any pressure. I had the pump rebuilt and once installed it started beautifully. After sitting about two weeks, once again it would not start and a brief investigation we found it had lost prime. Once we primed it, again it starts and runs perfect. My question is what would make it lose prime? There are no apparent leaks anywhere, we replaced the fuel line hose from the filter to the pump as it was apparently original and a little fiddling with it, we did make it leak. Is there anything else I should be looking for? It seems in KNoxville TN, there is a shortage of tractor mechanics and "orange" colored tractors made in the US are somewhat foreign around here.
Anyone have any suggestions?
Thanks again,
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Don't worry about the mule going blind, just load the wagon.
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Replies:
Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 28 Aug 2011 at 10:39am
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I am wondering if you have some foreign material in your tank or lines that is settling over the hole and not letting fuel pass, I cant see how you could lose your prime on an injection system where the fuel tank is higher than the pump, gravity would insure you always having fuel in the pump. Although on second thought I had a freind with a 560 diesel that was having that problem and I found on that one the injector was not seating allowing air into the system back to the pump so everytime he went to start it he had to work the air from the pump out the injector, but the pump itself never lost prime.I would get some new filters, blow air back threw the lines, on my 17 there is a small hyd hose from the filters to the pump its possible that the hose has collapsed internally and not allowing fuel to pass anymore.
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Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 28 Aug 2011 at 10:42am
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After rereading your post you said you replaced the line from the filters to the pump did you use hyd hose or hose made for diesel fuel or did you make something up with fuel line hose. The reason I ask is fuel line hose cannot handle diesel only gas and it will swell up and fall apart internally looking perfect on the outside.
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Posted By: Toneman1
Date Posted: 28 Aug 2011 at 10:56am
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Thanks KC, unfortunately on Saturday night at 10pm, the only hose we had available was regular automotive gas line. I will replace that on Monday with the proper hose as I don't want anything else getting ito the pump I just had rebuilt. We did check the injector seating as best we could at the time. The fuel tank is as clean as a pin (so to speak), although the fuel cap seal is in pretty bad shape and if I can find a new cap I'll replace that or at least the seal if I have to make one. The previous owner had rebuilt the engine and the injectors, but not the pump. I got the fun of having that done shorty after I purchased it.
Thanks Again,
Tony H.
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Don't worry about the mule going blind, just load the wagon.
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Posted By: nsula_country
Date Posted: 29 Aug 2011 at 9:33am
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Interesting.
My 180 diesel will "loose prime" if left for a few days. I have to pump the little primer pump 10-15 times. Then it will hit as soon as the key is turned, otherwise you can crank until the battery dies.
My pump is in need of a rebuild though. If your pump is fresh and we have similar problems, maybe it is not the pump?
CT
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2014 LS P7010C, 1962 Farmall 504 Diesel (1st tractor) w/ 2008 Koyker 220 FEL, 1968 Allis Chalmers 180 Diesel, Komatsu PC38UU-2 Excavator, Various attachments for all!
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Posted By: injpumpEd
Date Posted: 29 Aug 2011 at 10:16am
possibly rolled or cut the fuel side cup seal upon installation, therefore fuel in the pump drains into crankcase. check to see if you're "making oil".
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210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
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Posted By: nsula_country
Date Posted: 29 Aug 2011 at 10:41am
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I have wondered about that. If it was leaking into the crankcase, is it a profuse amount usually. I catch myself checking the oil regularly. I swear it smells like diesel, but it doesn't appear thin... Like a gas motor would. Thought I have less than 25 hours on the oil and I have added a little since.
Thanks,
CT
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2014 LS P7010C, 1962 Farmall 504 Diesel (1st tractor) w/ 2008 Koyker 220 FEL, 1968 Allis Chalmers 180 Diesel, Komatsu PC38UU-2 Excavator, Various attachments for all!
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Posted By: Toneman1
Date Posted: 29 Aug 2011 at 12:32pm
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Thanks for the hints guys, I will start checking the oil regularly (or more than usual), so far after we went through the lines and replaced the fill hose, it has started normally. I sure wish this thing had a little pump to enhance the prime, it's a little bit of a sequence to re-prime, and I hate loosening all those fittings over and over till it fires.
Thanks again for all the help, it is greatly appreciated...
Tony H.
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Don't worry about the mule going blind, just load the wagon.
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Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 29 Aug 2011 at 3:18pm
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If you put a little air pressure to the fuel tank it will prime in no time flat
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Posted By: Toneman1
Date Posted: 30 Aug 2011 at 1:58pm
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Now that's an idea and it also got me to thinking as we have an air compressor that continously lost prime. It has a JD diesel of some vintage and it has a little lever pump that is supposed to help prime. But the pump was worn out when we got it, so we added an electric fuel pump at the tank and we have had no priming issues since. Has anyone ever put a "boost" pump between the tank and the pump on an Allis diesel?
Thanks,
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Don't worry about the mule going blind, just load the wagon.
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Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 31 Aug 2011 at 9:10am
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The latter models had a lift pump, but you dont need that on a 17 with the tank above the inj pump
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Posted By: TedBuiskerN.IL.
Date Posted: 31 Aug 2011 at 10:32am
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Most problems can be solved with the proper application of high explosives.
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Posted By: Toneman1
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2011 at 3:06pm
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Update on the losing prime situation, and thanks to Ed who first suggested looking into the oil to see if I was "makin' Oil". Yup it was making oil so to speak. We pulled the pump back off last night and found one of the seals on the shaft had been nicked just enough to put a samll hole in the seal. We replaced it and re-installed the pump last night. Tongiht is oil & filter change night topped off with a re-prime of the pump and hopefully the problem is solved.
Thanks again for all the help guys.
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Don't worry about the mule going blind, just load the wagon.
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Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2011 at 3:09pm
Did you inspect the sleeve the seal runs in inside the pump? I'm told the seals will wear grooves over time and take the replacement out in short order.
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"Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford
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