Run @ 540 PTO RPM or faster when cutting?
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Topic: Run @ 540 PTO RPM or faster when cutting?
Posted By: Stan IL&TN
Subject: Run @ 540 PTO RPM or faster when cutting?
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 10:54am
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Just wondering if you run faster engine RPM than the indicated 540 PTO speed when bush hogging or do you run her faster? I ask because I was told to run her wide open for the best looking cut and it's easier on the engine not to lug it. Just wondering what others do? ------------- 1957 WD45 dad's first AC 1968 one-seventy 1956 F40 Ferguson |
Replies:
Posted By: Coke-in-MN
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 10:56am
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high engine speed and low ground speed. match fwd speed to cutting to get good results at full throttle ------------- Life lesson: If you’re being chased by a lion, you’re on a horse, to the left of you is a giraffe and on the right is a unicorn, what do you do? You stop drinking and get off the carousel. |
Posted By: Auntwayne
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 2:45pm
| You do not need full throttle if you are not if you are not in any type thick, heavy cover judge accordingly. our nephew, who shall remain anonymous for good reason, would use the brand new Allis riding mower, and when ever he had to get off to move lawn furniture etc. always dismounted with the throttle wide open !!! I always run over and idled it down all the way and would ask him if he would stop at a stop sign with his foot holding the gas pedal to the floor, or if he treated his motorcycles the same way. The next time that I would see him mow, same story all over. I guess you really do treat it like a rented mule when you do not own it !!! |
Posted By: Auntwayne
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 3:22pm
| As a matter of fact, I can not think of any piece of equipment that would require the tractor to be run at full throttle for any amount of time, EXCEPT......MAYBE......If I was pulling a onr row cornpicker with a full wagon attached.....and, I was buried stuck, and, even then, I would unhook from the picker !!! |
Posted By: BStone
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 3:31pm
| I find it does a better job of cutting and has less vibration when mowing by using full throttle.On a yard mower I have best results to leave it running at least at 75% throttle if sitting still but blades are engaged.Runs smoother and has less vibration. |
Posted By: Stan IL&TN
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 4:01pm
This is what I have always done Coke. On my one-seventy I think the 540 RPM is about 1700-1800 RPM but I usually have it in the 2000-2100 range which is just about all the way open.
When helping dad farm with his 7045 disking or plowing I always ran it wide open and only backed off the throttle at the turns.
------------- 1957 WD45 dad's first AC 1968 one-seventy 1956 F40 Ferguson |
Coke-in-MN wrote:Posted By: cougar766
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 4:07pm
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all I can say is when you equipment flies apart I sure hope none of you family or friends are around to get hurt or killed from your stupidity as pto equipment was/is designed to run 540 or a 1000 rpm and the tractors are set on their pto's to that speed. when you run faster than what was designed something will break. but hey what do I know I'm just a dumb ass that was taught to respect his equipment not just drive it. sorry for the rant but stupidity boils my blood
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Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 4:08pm
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Air cooled engines depend on engine speed for cooling. Less than full throttle while mowing is not a good idea since you're reducing the airflow and increasing the engine load by lugging. The Kohler people specifically state run the engine at max rated speed for this reason. I don't pull the throttle back to idle if I'm just hopping off to move a stick or the down spout pipe, just have to stop the deck due to the safety switches. If I'm going to be off for several minutes, I'll slow it down, otherwise no. As far as the tractor is concerned, I've always ran it at rated speed for the PTO. I used to help a neighbor at harvest dump trucks. He had this odd Agri-Power tractor that had a 2 speed PTO. He told me to run it on 1000 rpm for the auger instead of 540. I remember breaking the shear bolt once in a bunch of truck loads. ------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: victoryallis
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 4:18pm
| it blows my mind hearing of people running wide open. To my knowledge none of my tractors have been ran wide open while I have owned them. Drive slower, switch to a bigger tractor, or take the 15 minutes and switch the PTO over to 1000 rpms. If you run wide open you have more money than brains. One reply talked about picking corn and having to run wide open what where you using a garden tractor? I haven't picked much corn in my life (that why gleaner makes combines) but using anything from a D-12 to a 6080 and never went past 3/4 throttle. |
Posted By: Auntwayne
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 4:31pm
| I'm back as I could not resist this conversation !!! We have 5 or 6 tractors, and, I can honestly say, that I have never run one of them PAST 2/3s throttle in my life. I can still hear the old man telling me as a kid "You ever run that throttle up there again, and, I will put the governor back on" And, Victoryallis, if you are taking a swipe at me, you had better reread what I typed !!! |
Posted By: DaveKamp
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 4:37pm
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Mowing blade tip-speed calculations for most mowers fall in between 190 and 230mph. Calculate how fast your blade tips will be moving at 540rpm, you'll probably find that the manufacturer geared it for that range. Overspeeding may help a little, but if you're already pushing 230mph, going faster will result in faster blade erosion, lousy cutting (it'll actually blow the grass 'down') and on a swinging blade, will cause the blades to deflect too much, too often. Typically, your best measure, is looking at the rows. If you're rough-cutting, slowing it down a little for the first pass will save you some wear and tear, perhaps a broken shear-pin if you hammer into a mulberry stump a few times before breakin' it off. |
Posted By: DaveKamp
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 4:44pm
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Remember- the PTO standard speed, is that which tractor AND implement manufacturers use to base their design calculations. The OP wasn't referring to lawn equipment, he was referring to an agricultural PTO-driven rotary. On my Bobcat commercial mower, the instructions are very explicit- "Bring the throttle to 1/3 speed, pull up on PTO engagement knob. Once blade starts, advance to full throttle". Kohler's operating manual for the my CV750: "Do not operate the engine with working loads for extended durations at less than 2/3 governed speed, as overheating will occur". |
Posted By: Gerald J.
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 5:10pm
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When I was a kid my dad built a tractor with side mounted rotary mower, just a frame for four wheels and a spindle in the middle. It spread grass in all directions. House rule instituted before I drove it, "If neighbor kid shows up in the yard, shut it down." Unfortunately it didn't have a way to stop the mower and keep the engine running so we had to get close to the mower while rope starting the engine. If you get off a mower with the deck running, how absolutely certain that you aren't going to slip on the grass as you slow down to get back on, and how certain that you aren't going to stick that sliding foot under the mower? I know from chopping iron pipes and trees with my dad's mower, that a boot, even steel toed, isn't going to save your foot from the modern mower, probably won't even slow it down as it mulches your toes. I've had a couple older relatives lose fingers by reaching under a running mower to pick up a stick or rock. TURN THE MOWER OFF BEFORE DISMOUNTING, EVERY TIME, life with half a foot is not as handy as with all your toes. Gerald J. |
Posted By: Coke-in-MN
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 6:06pm
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Running a 6 ft Ford or a 7' Mott mower behind my IH 460 I bring RPM up to a point where mower has a sound when cutting that says blades are all the way extended and not rattling against the reel. Sorry if this above what the tach says is 540 RPM but it is the sweet spot on mower and tractor , Is it full throttle ? Unsure but might be higher than 540.
On lawn tractor just at or close to full governed throttle is where they are run according to Mfg instructions. And if you get off the tractor , power to ANY implement is shut off. Have a few people who mowed for me forget it ONCE and a stern lecture was metered out. In case of my kids a quick kick in the A was also applied.
If you check on mowers you will find commercial grade mowers use a higher tip speed to blades than residential units. Shows up on ZT mowers in how they cut.
On brush hog type mowers again sound of mower in material cut makes how much speed is needed , so it isn't pull the throttle full on and go but using common sense in operating any power equipment . ------------- Life lesson: If you’re being chased by a lion, you’re on a horse, to the left of you is a giraffe and on the right is a unicorn, what do you do? You stop drinking and get off the carousel. |
Posted By: Stan IL&TN
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 7:31pm
Well I don't know what side of the world Cougar got up on this moring but it looks like it was the wrong side. I for one take good care of what I have. Here's my mowing rig. It has 5600 hours on it and has never been apart. In fact we have never had one fail yet, mower or tractor related. Although dad did pull the 2000 mono-frame plow in two on a hard clay hill one time. I'll say a prayer for you tonight Cougar. ------------- 1957 WD45 dad's first AC 1968 one-seventy 1956 F40 Ferguson |
Posted By: norm[ind]
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 7:50pm
| acombine is to run at 540 when combing not in the banyard should run about 545-550 when empty no materiaif you run it faster it shake the s--- out of the shakers and sievesl benn there done that we ran 2 all the time 60 & 66 |
Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 8:44pm
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If running my equipment properly is stupid, I guess I'm really stupid. On light loads, yes I shift up and throttle back on jobs like running the planter, sprayer or things of that nature. But if you're running a tractor at 2/3 throttle and your plowing, discing, field cultivating or running a baler or a mower you have too small of an implement, too big of a tractor for the implement or you should shift up a gear.
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Posted By: Lars(wi)
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 9:21pm
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the only times we ran full throttle with pto equipment was when using the forage chopper,the silo filler(blower) and the portable feed mill when grinding oats or grinding baled hay for piglet feed.all other we ran at pto speed, haybine, baler, manure spreader, only two things that I can recall running pto real slow was the forage wagons and the pto powered elevator. ------------- I tried to follow the science, but it was not there. I then followed the money, and that’s where I found the science. |
Posted By: bauerd44
Date Posted: 09 Jul 2011 at 9:30pm
| All of my PTO equipment have statements to the effect that 540 is the maximum input rpm. That is what I do. For any non-PTO work, I will go full throttle as needed. |
Posted By: DaveKamp
Date Posted: 10 Jul 2011 at 1:32am
You're absolutely correct, Gerald, in fact, if you're wearing steel toes and wind up with a foot under a walk-behind, it is more likely for you to lose your leg just above the knee, than just a portion of foot. I was lucky- I only lost half a foot, and you are correct that it is rather unhandy. Not unliveable, but one wears out shoes incredibly fast, and the asymmetrical gait is hard on the lower back. You wouldn't believe how often people ask me "Why weren't you wearing shoes"... Yeah... they're that stupid. I don't even try to argue- I ask them for their shoe, and when they say "Why?" I tell 'em I'm gonna throw it on the ground, run a mower over it, and show 'em how tough that shoe is, compared to a 212mph machete. The fact is, there is NO inherantly 'safe' way of doing most things... but I certainly WAS wearing shoes, and I still have that shoe... and unlike most rotary mower accidents, I didn't do anything glaringly wrong... nothing stupid, just slipped and went down. My 9-year-old son and 7 year-old daughter have seen that shoe, and just to make it very, very obvious of what they're dealing with, I placed a rock in the yard at a strategic point, and 4 layers of 5/8" OSB against a tree... then drove over that rock, sending it through all four layers... and out the other side. Rule is, when they hear a mower running, they move to the other side of the house, so the mower is never, ever in view. The only 'safe' lawn mower, is goats and sheep... and they've got their dangers, too... but they're a whole lot better to eat than a Lawn-Boy. |
Posted By: Auntwayne
Date Posted: 10 Jul 2011 at 8:34am
| Cousin Gary got off of the riding mower, and, when he stepped down planted his heel directly into the discharge chute and the blade took off his heel. You should see how he "walks" today!!! |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 10 Jul 2011 at 9:09am
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I run the lawn mower wide open, baler on the 190 at 1,500 to 1,700 rpm (way below 540 PTO), the discbine to get best cut I run at rated speed on the 7050 which is 2,300 rpm and 540 PTO. I have more tractor than implement so I rarely exceed 1,900 engine RPM on the 7050 when doing tillage work. The 190 XT get run at rated speed for most tillage. I think is says in one of my 185 sales brochures to gear up and throttle back for best economy. I have a Case 1896 - 2096 brochure that I believe says the same thing. Pulling the same equipment you did before but with a little bigger tractor gives good economy and better reliability according to these brochures. Now I'll have to dig them out to see if I made myself a liar. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 10 Jul 2011 at 9:16am
X2 ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Posted By: ranger42
Date Posted: 10 Jul 2011 at 2:16pm
| I had a brand new gearbox put in a bush hog. While it was being repaired my grandfather, without me knowing, put the AGCO-Allis 5670 PTO to 1000 rpm. The Bush Hog was a 540 pto. Anyway, after about 4 hours of light brush hogging...gearbox failed. So I know first hand running the implement at a speed for which it was not designed will cause failure. |
Posted By: Russ SCPA
Date Posted: 10 Jul 2011 at 3:10pm
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If you look in the front page of an operators manual for an AC 7020 and/or 7060 in large bold print, DO NOT OPERATE UNDER LOAD AT LESS THAN 2300 ENGINE RPM AS SERIOUS OVERLOAD CAN OCCUR,
PTO driven machines are operated as close to recommended input speeds as possible,
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Posted By: Boogerowen
Date Posted: 10 Jul 2011 at 5:10pm
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Gosh, I have a new Bush Hog Razorback and my operators manual says in plain english to operate it at 540rpm, so I guess that is what I will do, as I don't like to tear equipment up because I do not own a bank. I do however run my air-cooled lawnmower wide-open, just exactly as the manual says. Looks to me like some of you fellers are trying to compare APPLES to ORANGES. My 2 cents....
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Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 10 Jul 2011 at 7:46pm
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Like what Russ says, that is in the owner's manual for my CA and D17D.
Page 16 of the D17D owner's manual says "When working tractor, operate engine at full throttle, or nearly full throttle, and select the desired transmission gear speed to suit the work being done. Severe over loads may be thrown on engine if tractor is operated at reduced engine speeds on heavy loads." ------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 10 Jul 2011 at 7:51pm
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Just so I'm not confusing anybody, 540 rpm on my D17D is like 1650 engine rpm and is what I run my 160 mower at. The governor limits the engine to 2000 rpm max. ------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: Jordan(OH)
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 9:13am
Have you ever done any field work? Because that takes full throttle to make full HP. If full throttle is so terrible for the machine why would the engineers let it go that fast? Look at a combine, they run full throttle 99% of the time out in the field. Our 8030 went 6600 hrs. before needing an overhaul, at least 95% of those hours were full throttle running a chopper or doing tillage. Also have a Ford 5640 with 5700 trouble free hours, 95% of those were put on at PTO speed or full throttle. |
Posted By: Jordan(OH)
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 9:19am
You must have more money than brains as well since you can afford a tractor 50% bigger than your equipment requires. |
Posted By: jeffrey
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 2:47pm
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Try and blow corn silage at 2/3 throttle. |
Posted By: Brian G. NY
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 3:49pm
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Boy, oh boy, oh boy!!
' hard to believe the number of people who don't have any concept of the governor's purpose on a tractor. Opening the throttle lever on a tractor is nothing like "puttin' the pedal to the metal" in an automobile.
Full throttle is not necessarily "wide-open" throttle. For heavy work, the tractor is designed to run at full "governed" throttle. The governor keeps the engine speed at the optimum RPMs which in turn keeps the PTO running at optimum RPMs.
PTO powered equipment is designed to run at either 540 RPM or 1,000 RPM and generally, equipment should be run at either of those recommended speeds in order to operate efficiently.
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Posted By: Dipstick In
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 4:03pm
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Kinda shows how many of our posters have either never farmed/worked an Allis or are just new to tractors. I farmed on my own for 28 years, plus having grown up farming to age 25 or so, and never heard of NOT running equipment at "full throttle" when working it, including sickle mowers, rotary mowers, and various other applications. Granted there were times when we did not run "wide open", but that was choice rather than fear of tearing something up. Of course I would not belittle someone for not running their 60-70 year old equipment fast when there is not a need for it. I had a couple of Olivers, 1850&1855, and they had a shiftable PTO, from 540 to 1000, and when I didn't need power I shifted up and backed off the gas just to save fuel! ------------- You don't really have to be smart if you know who is! |
Posted By: bill2260
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 4:13pm
| When I swiched from baling square bales with wd45 to using 185 on a 14t baler, I noticed the knotters not moving as fast with the 185 as they did with the wd45. I am sure that my wd and wd45 pto runs faster than 540. 185 at 2000 rpms is suppose to be 540 and it just didn't work as fast as with the wd45. Maybe I am just simple, but that is the way it seemed. Bill |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 4:24pm
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Just remember that if you over speed a rotating device by 10%, the forces involved are increased by 21% (including how far something may be thrown). A 20% increase yields a 44% increase in these things. Check the Nebraska test reports for hp at rated PTO speed for your particular tractor-------there usually isn't much drop off and sometimes an increase in hp from rated engine speed. A 175 had 62 hp at rated engine speed and 54 at 540 rpm PTO speed for instance. A 185 was 75 vs 71. A 6060 was 64 at rated engine speed AND 65 at rated PTO speed. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 6:09pm
| wow how such a simple question can piss some people off. Tractor running slower than designed will do more damage than a tractor running faster. Cut the speed of a spinning shaft in half double its size, is a rule of thumb. A faster spinning shaft has less stress than a slow one. When a manufacturer has a 540 or 1000 pto mark on the tack it means to not pull the tractor's rpms to below that point or be prepared for problems.When a tractor is dynoed its is full throttle pulled down under load to its rated speed, which gives the proper reading on the dyno. This is how the dealers or fools think that a tractor is making tons of power, dyno it at full throttle and not pull it down to rated speed (the 540 mark or 1000 mark depending on the pto) and the dyno reads big numbers. Seen a dealer try and convince a customer his 2-105 white was making 200+hp stock, I told the guy there was no way in hell a stock 105 could do that, I got in a huge argument with the dealer because he had no clue how to properly dyno a tractor. The throttle on any brand tractor goes to the end for a reason and if the company didnt think so it wouldnt go that far. To call people names because they are running a tractor wide open, I hate to say this but you are showing your ignorance of the situation.When I was a kid we use to use a gehl 99 recutter to grind high moisture corn from ear corn to the silo it ran 1000 rpm , my uncle had a xt series 3 we filled silo with that thing for years and it would play with that recutter, loaned it to the neighbor because his Case tractor had broke down and he needed 1000 rpm on his recutter, after a couple of days he was complaining that the XT kept boiling over, we couldnt imagine what the deal was because we never had such a problem, went down to see what the trouble was he was running the XT at 3/4 throttle making it labor and not flowing the water properly opened it wide open like we ran it (for years I might add) the tractor cooled right down and played with his recutter. Thus endth the lesson, to steal a phrase. |
Posted By: Ryan Renko
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 10:28pm
| This is getting heated and long. I use my common sense when mowing small sh*t and when I get into bigger stuff I watch my trusty tachometer with the 540 mark adjusting ground speed. Ramming the throttle wide open would be dishonor to what common sense our dad taught us. Ryan |
Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 10:47pm
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Kcgrain has it right. In the Nebraska test the tractor is running at full rated speed and then the PTO is loaded to bring the RPMs down to 540 to simulate field conditions not throttled back till the PTO is running 540 with no load. |
Posted By: Ryan Renko
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 11:02pm
| I think this is why some tractors last many hours and others are beaten like rented mules!! |
Posted By: DaveKamp
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 11:17pm
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PLEASE... Everybody, go back and read the OP question. There is no point in arguing horsepower against appropriate speed. The implement is rated at 540, because the ASME COMPATIBILITY CRITERIA are all based on making equipment interchangeable between machines. The whole purpose, was to establish design criteria so that IMPLEMENT MANUFACTURERS could make a good implement, that would be used between many different machines. The machine was built to operate on a given PTO type, it had a given shaft size and spline count, was expected to be operated at the given RPM (1000 or 540 usually), and was expected to be brought no more than a certain amount of torque (the workload) and not more than a given amount of shock (hence, shear-pins). Tractor manufacturers accomodate ASME PTO categories the same way. They build a tractor, fit it with tires, gearing, and ballast according to the amount of tractive effort they're trying to provide. Once that's all done, they set up the engine governor for however they feel will be most successful under those circumstances. THEN they set up gearing that provides one or more of the common ASME PTO speeds applicable to that category. They put a demarcation band on the tachometer to give a general indication of what engine speed yields the designed ASME PTO speed. Then they put the tractor in your hands. From that point, you pick your implement, and hopefully, you pick something that's a good match... i.e., don't pick a Category II PTO implement requiring 89hp, and put it on a Category II tractor that's only 55hp. Likewise, don't expect a Category 1 540rpm post-hole digger... or your ground-man operator, to survive with it stub-adapted to a Category III 110hp tractor with a 1000rpm PTO. Finally, don't swear by the premise that 'faster is better' or 'slower is better', and don't generalize postulation that stress on a given component at one speed is more, or less than speed at another. Stresses given up in one scenario, are always met, and replaced with stresses from others. Reason: The engineers who designed the machine know more about what they were thinking and doing... than anyone else ever will. As a frequent retrospective engineer, I face challenges left by engineering errors and presumptions, not only from original design, but changes that casually occur in manufacture, but worst, after modification by people who may have had a pretty good grasp for what was happening, but clearly did NOT understand the ramifications of how their modification affected other aspects of the situation. If you want something to yield the safety, performance, longetivity, and durability intended by the original design, then OPERATE it that way. That means, if the tractor's book says "Operate at xx for maximum power"... but the PTO device says "Never operate above xx", you'd better take the more conservative route of the two. Next... Throw fallacy in the trash. When an industrial or agricultural engine is designed, it is 'curved'. That means, it is analyzed on a dyno for fuel consumption, torque, and thermal stability. When they leave the factory, you can rest assured that the Owner's Manual will indicate the acceptable range of operation... and staying within those guidelines will provide the performance indicated in all curves. They didn't 'design' it to be used to drive implements faster than the IMPLEMENT DESIGNER intended. NO engineer would even THINK of doing that. The comment about overheating due to insufficient RPM- Bunk. It MAY have happened, and you may swear by it, but I assure you that the reason has NOTHING to do with the engine being designed that way... it's because there's an UNDERLYING PROBLEM that needed resolution. ALL cause of low-speed overheating on a LIQUID-COOLED engine can be traced to either compression leaks (into the water jacket, typically through cracks, a damaged coolant circulatory pump, a failing gasket, or a missing or stuck thermostat. First condition, is combustion gases being forced into the jacket, and displacing coolant from the top of the cylinder head. Remaining conditions cause overheating because draw pressure at the INLET SIDE of the water pump is too low to prevent cavitation... and coolant therefore is not able to absorb waste heat for extraction. I guarantee that agricultural engine manufacturers DID NOT design and release an engine that would overheat at common ambient ranges when operated below some speed... especially for non-pressurized cooling systems. And finally, the speed at which you set the engine speed lever defines GOVERNED SPEED, not THROTTLE. At just off idle, you can apply a heavy enough brake load to the engine such that the governor will respond by opening the throttle all the way. You may not get maximum engine rated HP, but this is because of the disadvantage indicated in the TORQUE CURVE. Peak Torque occurs at the point where the cylinders fill most completely. Peak horsepower, however, occurs where the coincidence of torque and RPM yield the highest multiplication product. In reality, calculating PTO horsepower is irrelevant, because abiding by the ASME standard means you only need torque... the other variable is FIXED AT 540. That means for every ten foot-pounds of torque you can find at the shaft, that equates to a smidgen past one horsepower. 100ft-lbs = 10hp. 500ft-lbs = 50hp. If your implement is only strong enough to take 350ft-lbs, and you feed it 630, you'll be visiting either the morgue or hospital, and your machine will be in the workshop or scrapyard. Now, as for running machines that indicate higher acceptable input speeds, the manufacturer rated them as such for good reason. Machines like silage blowers NEED to run fast, they're designed and built to do that, and simply will not throw adequately if you don't... but they're RATED accordingly. I suggest, however, that if you have a 1000rpm silage blower, and only a 540rpm-equipped tractor PTO, that you look for some other drive method, as your tractor engine will be hard-pressed to GET there, or if it does, will be screaming bloody murder to swing it's PTO at almost twice it's rated speed... and you'll likely not be able to get the engine to spin there without disabling the engine governor. Finally, there are some machines that you simply CANNOT run outside rated speed. First and most obvious- the AC generator. 540rpm = 60hz line frequency. Try to spin the engine 'faster' to get 'more power', and you'll be burning up electronics, overspeeding electric motors, and generally wrecking stuff. Likewise, running it too SLOW will generate power at too low frequency, causing motors to drag and overheat. Laws of Man, when broken, will frequently get you a slap on the wrist. violating the Laws of Physics and Nature will get you the death penalty, and there ain't no trial-by-jury. |
Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 11:21pm
| you guys have it completely wrong if for some reason you think you are doing some dis service to your tractor by operating it at full RPM.It was designed to do that, combines run wide open 90% of the time, where is the abuse in that? When my uncle bought that XT new in 1970 the dealer told him flat out to run it hard to break it in properly and he did just that , and that tractor which I now own is still running great.You guys are stuck in the 1920's by thinking that operating speed is abuse.Its just that simple.Abuse would be running your bush hog at full RPM and than working the tractor till its ready to die and not giving it some room to breath, but I have an AC bush hog you cant make a tractor beg that hard the clutch slips, or if you have shear bolt type the bolt shears. Does that mean every job for the tractor requires full RPM. .........well by no means are we saying that, common sence dictates speed, and in some applications like baling hay or picking corn you cant run full RPM nor do you need it, but in other jobs like grinding feed, chopping crops, blowers, mold board plowing anything heavy that requires power open it up thats how it was made you will never hurt it. |
Posted By: Ryan Renko
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 11:30pm
| So ignore the factory tachometer and just bury the throttle at all time when using it under a load?? |
Posted By: 7060
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 11:39pm
| The only reason I wouldnt run it wide open with the pto is because whatever your powering may not be capable of anything more than rated speed. In field work I run my tractor wide open and everyone else I know does too. We pull a 15' farmhand brushhog behind my 7050 or 7060 and have been known to cut down up to 3" trees by backing over them. The clutches let you know when its had enough, but if our brushhog was anybetter than it is we wouldnt do it. Its 1000 pto though. |
Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 11 Jul 2011 at 11:44pm
|
Dave,the engine on the XT wasnt over heating beacuse of insufficient RPM or a design flaw by Allis Chalmers that wasnt my statement it was over heating because the engine not being at full throttle was not running at the HP needed to run the recutter, so the engine, laboring was generating more heat than the system was designed to cool. At full throttle the engine was no longer laboring, wasnt generating the extra heat was flowing more water more air etc to remain cool. Also because this engine is turbo charged it proabably wasnt developing full boost to develop full power, at wide open the engine in its design was devloping the hp, boost, cooling capacity etc to handle the load.There was no internal problem with that tractor, none, not a clogged radiator, bad pump loose belt nothing the only difference was the RPMS and the lack of available HP for the job.I still have the tractor if it had some interanl problem it hasnt showed up since 1981 when this happened.which would pretty much rule out any such problems you stated. |
Posted By: DaveKamp
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2011 at 12:18am
KC, please don't take it as insult, but I'm saying that from principle of thermodynamics and power-unit operation, this conclusion is a fallacy. The situation you describe happens in diesel stationaries and railroad locomotives occasionally (I taught troubleshooting on it for many years, and addressed this directly). There IS something wrong, and by increasing speed, you're simply masking the problem. My great-uncle's '68ish XT plows, bales, mows, and throws silage, and we've NEVER had overheating problems under ANY circumstance. Regardless, having cooling concerns does not justify overspeeding a PTO driven implement. Allis never designed it's equipment in such a way that it couldn't be used within ASME compatibility. That would be akin to a car manufacturer designing a car so that it couldn't be operated below posted speed limits, or a variable-speed drill to be operated at any other speed than full-grip. There are many things that cause diesels to suffer light-load overheating. Frequently an injector issue on just one or two cylinders, exhaust valves that aren't seating soon/solid enough, an improperly operating wastegate, or a control rack that isn't equally metering fuel. The most humiliating, is an injector return pathway that is plugged. IN any event, the result is the same. Fastest way to narrow down that problem nowdays, is to start and run up the engine to about half-speed, and then take a walk down each bank (locomotive here) with a video thermography camera and look for one cylinder that is operating COLDER than the rest. Then, find out why. Once they're all running at same temp at half-speed, you'll find it's much happier through the entire band, and has much better manners and more spunk. |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2011 at 6:12am
|
Wow, this topic has taken off. On my 7050 I only pull a 4x18 plow so I usually only run about 1,900 rpm. It has never overheated or poured black smoke or whatnot. I could use the XT but the 7050 is much more comfortable and I like having all that available power. I also have run the XT at less than full rpm pulling a 9 shank Krause chisel plow without problems but the tractor will lug in the tough spots so I normally run at 2,200 rpm. My Dad rarely ever runs a tractor at full throttle unless whatever he's hooked to requires it and he made it through a lifetime of farming without blowing an engine. I tend to run a little faster than Dad and so far after about 30 years of field work never have had any problems either. I think everyone here knows their equipment pretty well so that they know what they can do and can't. Some run fast and some run a little slower. A combine should always be run at full throttle and not allowed to get below a certain rpm or you'll put grain on the ground but I think most people that farm know that. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: JayIN
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2011 at 6:50am
|
Let's all take a chill pill! Good Grief!!!!! ------------- sometimes I walk out to my shop and look around and think "Who's the idiot that owns this place?" |
Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2011 at 9:14am
| Dave, you dont have to worry abot me taking it personally, am always willing to learn something new, but I do know the XT has or had no problems in that sitation, other than it was not making full hp on a continuous bassis. If you ever ran a recutter its a heavy pto load like a dyno but it lasts for hours on end, rather than intermitant, like a hard spot in the field etc, so once the load starts its there for as long as you were grinding, which back than we would start it at 7 am shut down for lunch and start back up till about 4 so other than a small breather as the next wagon pulled in it was pretty much full load . The only difference between the 2 setups was one was full throttle and playing with the recutter, and 3/4 throttle and laboring on it. Now the out line you have decribed may have had something to do with it, but we have had no heating problems with that tractor in any situation other than a recutter at lowered rpms. Again not to beat a dead horse here, but I am not saying that every situation requires full rpms, but in a heavy load, the engine and implements were designed for full speed and you are not doing any damage to either by running it there. Nor is the engine or implements being damaged by a slower setting, a little common sence will go along way in this, every condition requires a different approach, but on the recutter full rpm was required . Its much like a semi tractor taking a hill if your pulling the hill in too high a gear the engine begins to labor the heat starts to rise, shift down a gear, bring the rpms up lower the load and the temp goes right back down. By some of your guys comments about full throttle settings hurting engines or being abusive is just so out in left field, if that was so there would be a million dead semis blown up on the side of any grade, becasue every trucker I know is going to have there foot in it for full power to take a hill. My last point here on this matter is again, if damage or abuse was occurring in full RPM the manufacture would not let the throttle go that far. Peace everyone. |
Posted By: ranger42
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2011 at 9:16am
| Great explanation Dave!....I appreciate the explanation from an enginerring perspective and common sense. From my experience I agree with you on every front. Also, I think we all can agree that there are instances where engines are "de-tuned" for longevity. One I know that has been discussed on this site in the past is the 426 in the N-6 combine. Where RPM's were dropped most often by private owners or AC mechanics who have them in for service and they had much more luck for durabilty stand point. |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2011 at 10:42am
I don't know what the OEM rpm setting for the N-6 was, but the 426 wasn't happy at the 2550 rpm setting of the 7080. The engine was much happier at the 2400 rpm setting of the 8070. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2011 at 12:33pm
|
Dave, I'm going to disagree with you on the reduced speed overheating scenario on the XT. Like KCG is saying, opened the throttle and no more heating. 1. Fan speed and air flow across the radiator.
2. Coolant flow through the engine and radiator.
3. On a Roosa Master pump, when you load the engine down, there is a point that the metering valve is no longer limiting engine torque via the torque screw. The design of the rotor allows for torque backup. When the rotor slows, the charging ports are in register for a longer period of time so the leaf spring that limits the maximum travel of the plungers is what limits maximum fuel. This gives more fuel than what is controlled by the metering valve.
4. Timing. The injection timing advances with RPM's. Late timing makes any engine labor and run hot.
5. Turbo boost. Maximum boost requires exhaust flow from engine speed. Black smoke is not just unburned fuel out the exhaust, it's also heat. With more engine speed comes more air flow through the engine's combustion chamber.
------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2011 at 12:57pm
|
In the case of your Loco with a cylinder not producing as much as the others, one dead or low cyl is reducing the maximum output from the engine, the operator then leans on the throttle more for a longer time. Fuel useage is up/economy is down. There again, pushing more fuel into it, more heat developed. Same load, engine not producing full power, RPM's down, more heat, taxing the cooling system.... ------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: Pat the Plumber CIL
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2011 at 2:12pm
|
WOW !!!!!!! ------------- You only need to know 3 things to be a plumber;Crap rolls down hill,Hot is on the left and Don't bite your fingernails 1964 D-17 SIV 3 Pt.WF,1964 D-15 Ser II 3pt.WF ,1960 D-17 SI NF,1956 WD 45 WF. |
Posted By: michaelwis
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2011 at 2:18pm
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Always run all my blower tractors wide open , cause i hate unplugging pipes from an 80 foot silo .. ------------- WD WD45 DIESEL D 14 D-15 SERIES 2 190XT TERRA TIGER ac allcrop 60 GLEANER F 6060 7040.and attachments for all Proud to be an active farmer |
Posted By: Matt (NEIA)
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 1:00am
|
I try to run my tractors at 2/3 throttle, lawn mowers always at full throttle but that comparing apples to oranges as stated above. When run at 2/3 throttle you always have that spare throttle to play with but latley i'm guility of buying oversized equipment in the name of getting more done faster or so i think! lol ------------- 1955 WD-45 with factory PS |
Posted By: D17JIM
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 6:59am
I keep seeing all of the discussion and remember 2 things Dad would kick my  for (not the only 2 by the way) Running pto equipment over pto speed and not running full throttle on heavy tillage loads. It worked for him on every tractor from a square back WC to the 8070 and many in between.
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Posted By: KGood
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 7:29am
| We put tachs on our wd's so as to run right on the money for pto. My NH haybine just got a $1000 wobblebox and that is the weak point on my machine plus it's not fun to change. I'am not putting more stress on it by running it faster than that I'll drop a gear first. And on our 45year old Massy baler says all over in the book to not run more than 540. Balers running faster have more momentum to do more damage. Now a bush hog or silage blower etc. would be a different story. I wouldn't be worried bumping them up a little. Thats just our practice. |
Posted By: BStone
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 7:57am
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Posted By: ranger42
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 8:46am
| BStone...that's about as clear as it can get...I think the original question got changed a litte from PTO work to tillage work and your statment covers both! |
Posted By: Eldon (WA)
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 9:08am
|
Well to answer the original question, I run my 175D with the brushhog at the 540 rpm mark on the tach, throttle up as needed in the tough stuff, throttle back going down hills. I have done this for the last 7 years and probably could run the tractor without a tach as I can "feel" the correct range just by the sound and vibration. I've tried running faster, but I think it actually makes the cut worse and my fuel consumption just goes up. In rough conditions (rocks, rough ground) I throttle way back and the quality of cut doesn't change...and I stay more relaxed and in control. Running wide open is just stressful to me.
Like others have said, there is a reason the manual states "540" rpm. It was designed for that speed! As for running full throttle, under load, speed is your friend...bearings can take a bigger load at a faster speed....as long as they don't overheat! I have no problem running non-pto jobs wide open as long as I am under load and need the power. ------------- ALLIS EXPRESS! This year: |
Posted By: victoryallis
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 9:44am
|
As much of a allis person as I am the ignornce of some of the posters on here is about ruining the appeal of this site for me not to mention how far from allis equipment some of the topics are is crazy. Match the rpm's to the task. Full throttle on a silo blower would be a must but that is more of a excption than the rule. My 6080 has 9000 plus hours on it without a overhaul those didn't come from me rodding on it. Why didn't the higher horse power 426's last? To many rpm's that's why. I learned from my grandfather who used his C daily from the day it was new till he stepped aside in the mid 90's how to take care of equipment. He also has a D-17 with 11,000 plus hours on it. Something must have been done right there. He made a living with those tractors not just tractor shows a living. I also doubt most combines run full tilt 90% of the time unless you have a cart running with them try more like 70% of the time and that is like the silo blower stuation where you need the rpm's. Go ahead run full tilt it just makes for more organ donors in the salvage yard.
So long
victoryallis
|
Posted By: Ryan Renko
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 9:54am
| Amen Victoryallis!!! |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 10:20am
|
I agree with you victory except on the combine issue. You have to run them wide open and load them down to rated speed in order to get full efficiency and not leave crop in the field. On a gasoline engined combine the governor can't hold a constant speed very well unless you open it up. This topic for some reason has hit some nerves and I can't figure out why. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 3:33pm
X2 plus the walkers and sieves are designed to work best at full rated engine speed. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 3:38pm
My dad would have done the same thing to me. He wanted the field done and didn't want the tractor lugging. That's also how the experimental tractors on field test were run. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 4:22pm
| Just so everyone understands how lame this argument of PTO speed is I took my hand held tack that came with a 72 all crop combine my uncle bought years ago and checked some pto speeds in relation to the tach on 2 tractors. I only have 2 540 tractors one is on the mower so I took the 720 JD diesel at the 540 PTO mark on the tach which is roughly 3/4 throttle the pto speed is 600 and full throttle the pto speed is 620. On the second tractor a 210 with the famous high hp 426 that doesnt last, yet this one has run 200 hp and we have never had a problem with it( but I digress) at the 1000 rpm mark on the tach the pto speed is 1100 which is roughly 3/4 throttle again, and at wide open the speed was just under 1200 about 1175. So this argument about running PTO speed, or not, who is taking care of there tractor and who isnt, what your dad taught you, and I dont mean any disrespect to your parents at all, in fact my Grandpa was a slow runner and his fits about a wide open tractor, which lead to other problems I wont get into here are advise given based on nothing . The pto speeds arent even correct on the tach its over running on both tractors immediatly, and wide open didnt change the speeds hardly at all, less than 10%. You guys must think that wide open on your pto is like doubling the speed. I have another 9 tractors here I can test if you like the rest are all 1000 except the 8050 which I can swith but my guess is the out come is going to be the same.If someone has a tractor they want to know the speed tell me if there is one here or close by I can test I will. Heres another point what did they do when they chopped corn, baled or did other pto work with a WD45 there is no tach, so what were your parents grandparents etc baseing an over run on? |
Posted By: DanD
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 7:20pm
|
I find it amazing the controversy this post has caused. I couldn't imagine doing some jobs like blowing silage. chopping, or grinding feed at anything but wide open throttle. On the other hand other jobs like running a square baler or pulling a corn planter call for a slower engine speed. I'll post some links to videos. You'll see my father baling hay with a 630 John Deere with a pto rpm near 540, but that same tractor in a mounted corn picker running full throttle (this isn't much different in those old two cylinder Deeres). Then there's a vide of him grinding feed with a 1963 Series III D17 at wide open throttle with over 10,000 hours on it grinding corn with a Gehl feed mill that's been used twice a week since February of 1968. Apparently no great harm is being done. Then there's video of him combining with a Gleaner E, of course at wide open throttle which is goverened I think at a little less RPM than a D17 tractor. Finally there's video of him plowing with a 185...usually around 2200 RPM, not at the full wide open 2500 RPM. Of course I'm sure everyone realizes that wide open throttle on a tractor means the high idle goverened top speed. It's not like having your car in park and putting the gas pedal clear to the floor. [TUBE]VVWS9gdaY3A[/TUBE] [TUBE]E-hCT0yVaRc[/TUBE] [TUBE]TtFeeF6XM9o[/TUBE] [TUBE]4u1s7ZD5ZS0[/TUBE] [TUBE]xQqC_Vcmx9c[/TUBE] Tell me what I'm doing wrong?! |
Posted By: Ryan Renko
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2011 at 8:05pm
| Lets all put a fork in this topic!! |
Posted By: Jordan(OH)
Date Posted: 15 Jul 2011 at 1:14am
| JD combines and maybe others don't really have a throttle. It is more like a switch, they are either idle or wide open. There is no in between. |
Posted By: DaveKamp
Date Posted: 15 Jul 2011 at 7:33am
This is Stan's original post:
All comments regarding combines, silage blowers, lawn mowers, recutters, bailers... they're all irrelevant to Stan's posting. His was about a 540rpm PTO-driven rotary mower. As was posted earlier, comparing engine speeds of for-purpose engine-driven machinery (combines, lawn-mowers, etc) is irrelevant to the 540rpm implement. The answer to the question of WHY is found in history, and engineering design and economics. References to 'wide open' are improper terminology. Throttles and injection pumps have 'wide open' positions of 'full fueling'. These are GOVERNED engines, which by nature, are intended not only to limit engine speed, but hold it constant at a given speed. Governors modulate throttle position to maintain governed speed. A goverened engine will run at the desired speed with practically no throttle, when there is no load. As load is applied, engine speed will drop off slightly, and the governor will BEGIN to increase throttle opening (technically referred by governor and engine-management engineers as 'sag')... the engine will only see 'full throttle' from a governor when the load is substantial enough to require all that the engine is capable of providing. Once full throttle is reached, any additional load applied will slow the motor down BELOW the goverened speed, which is usually referred to by engineers as 'overload fall-off'. Running an engines of for-purpose machines is irrelevant, because the machine is designed only for that purpose, and the engine governance, and all driven loads, are appropriately ratioed to their optimal speeds by drive mechanisms therin. Engineers determine proper speed of all those pieces, assemble the drivetrain ratios, and then calculate the proper final drive ratio by comparing the prime mover's fuel and power curves, calculate performance lifespan and durability, and then apply the appropriate drive ratio, and set (now program) the engine speed governor accordingly. 540rpm PTO output systems on tractors have been well-standardized since the late 1950's. Prior to that time, manufacturers made implements intended to be driven by their OWN tractors. They Generally worked within the realm of ASAE standards of the mid '30's, wherin the common 540RPM PTO shaft operated at 540rpm +/- 10rpm, in a clockwise direction (when viewed at the output of the driving machine). Through the late '50's, the expiration of Harry Ferguson's 3-point patents (there were many) gave the ASAE the ability to publish a 'standard' of hitching geometry, and they 'categorized' hitching sizes to tractor size. At the same time, they published the PTO standards. Once that occured, agricultural manufacturers both on the tractor end, and in the implement business, went to manufacturing implements to allow compatibility with other manufacturers. Prior to the 60's, belt-driven implements were very common. Belt-driven implements fell in their own neighborhood based on belt speed (in feet-per-minute), and the operator had to calculate a reasonable speed based on knowledge of the prior drive machine (oftentimes a steamer). It isn't unusual, particularly after the late '30's for full-goverened speed to be bumped up... manufacturers did this as part of the 'horsepower wars' to improve package performance. When doing so, the 540rpm PTO's final gearing either had to be altered (to accomodate the resulting higher speed), or the engine had to be slowed-down, and the PTO output tested (think Nebraska Tests) at less than full-goverened speed. Manufacturers knew this would be a loss of performance-point (if the engine didn't create higher torque without the governed speed increase), however, it was a small price to pay vs. cost of tooling for lower PTO gear ratio. Manufacturers also had to contend with belt hp performance, but towards the middle '60's. the importance of belt HP to the agricultural market fell off- most belt-driven implements were designed around lower-power tractors, hence, high belt-hp wasn't an incredible selling point. That being the case, manufacturers didn't invest the engineering or production resources to alter belt-drive ratios, instead, they just left it as-was, and entrusted the operator to use due caution. As time went on, and power demands increased, and PTO implements got big and mean, full-governed-speeds increased, manufacturers finally started revisiting rearend designs, PTO drive concepts (Cockshutt's live-PTO!), and PTO drive ratios to optimize PTO output power, especially on the Category II and III machines. Agricultural engineers were constantly working to provide the highest PTO output numbers at the lowest fuel consumption and longest lifespan, it was not possible to make a drive ratio that yielded the desired output combination. After the '60's, ROAD SPEED was also a consideration, and tractors were made with gearing and maximum governed speed to provide faster transit times between fields. Amidst all this, was the implement manufacturer, who used the ASAE and ASME standards guidelines for selecting coupling equipment and calculating load applicability. Once the design was done, proper implement manufacturers documented their products so that the operator would follow guidelines on operation. Allis-Chalmers, for example, never made ANY implement, that didn't get passed to end user, without also being handed a book. This is why, when you look at a tachometer, that SOME have the 540rpm 'window' in the same vicinity as full governed speed... while others, it's not. How a person goes about using their equipment, is totally up to them, and totally determines how the driving force, and driven implement survive, and all the casual and catastrophic results that may occur. The performance suggestions and safety mandates of the engineers of the machine-in-use should be abided by if you desire to get best performance, lifespan, and safety from the combination. There is nothing wrong with telling another guy what YOU do, however, it is neither a wise nor honorable practice to do so without indicating that you're operating outside of the manufacturer's suggested realm, and it is an extreme disservice and liability to recomend to another a practice which occurs outside the envelope of the original design guidelines. It is one thing to have equipment damage or injury due to one's own actions, it is totally another to suffer damage, injury, or death as a result of ill advise. The damage to equipment and people can frequently be repaired, but the dead cannot be brought back to life. The loss of friendship is irreplaceable. I have nobody to blame for my injuries except myself, and I plan on keeping it that way. I would rather be the one injured, than to advise someone into peril. |
Posted By: captaindana
Date Posted: 08 Dec 2011 at 5:55am
| I had a great time reading all these posts. I will be smiling all day long! Loved it. Been there, done that. Super reading material! |
Posted By: TexasAllis
Date Posted: 08 Dec 2011 at 8:15am
| I think the conclusion is run your equipment at the manufacturers suggested speeds and loads. Companies pay engineers a lot of money and spend millions in R&D to get maximum performance out of equipment. |
Posted By: Brian G. NY
Date Posted: 08 Dec 2011 at 11:35am
|
Apparently AuntWayne's Dad had removed the governor?
Well.....without a governor, he certainly wouldn't want to run with a wide open throttle!!
Every now and again this subject comes up and like the Capt., I have to laugh at some of the comments. It appears that many on here do not understand the operation of a tractor governor?
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Posted By: Steve Bright
Date Posted: 08 Dec 2011 at 11:58am
| Don't know who is right or wrong but I never run anything on the PTO faster than the 540 or 1000 mark on the tach, But what do I know |