D17 PD adjustment?
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=30991
Printed Date: 24 Sep 2024 at 9:28pm
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Topic: D17 PD adjustment?
Posted By: rascal
Subject: D17 PD adjustment?
Date Posted: 19 May 2011 at 1:02am
| Hi everyone,I really need help with my D17 gas, I inherited this tractor,got it running great and the loader goes up and down like it should. The problem I have is when I put it in gear it creeps and then doesn't go anywhere, does the same thing in reverse. If I press the foot clutch and depress it i feel the tractor nudge,but doesn't move both in hi and in low, I have looked inside the inspection cover on bottom of housing and everything looks like it should ,bearing is good also. I am wondering if PD needs some type of adjustment, which I don't know how to do or is there some other type of problem some one here is familiar with that could help. Just one other thing I don't know if it could be related,but the power steering comes and goes. Would appreciate any help. Thank you |
Replies:
Posted By: ChuckLuedtkeSEWI
Date Posted: 19 May 2011 at 6:10am
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I'll try to help and put your post back to the top. When you adjust the PD clutch, there are three sets of shims all the way around in three different places. There are shims in the low side, the middle, and the high side. If I am right, to adjust you take shims out of the side you want to tighten up(in your case both high and low) and then put them in the middle part. You don't remove the shims, just change location of them. Do it the same on all three spots, and then try it. As far as how much to take out to try, that I couldn't tell you. Hopefully one of the true experts will chime in. The power steering should have nothing to do with the power director.
Also, is the loader running off of the tractor's hydraulic pump or a front mounted pump. If it's running off the pump in the torque tube, and the pto is moving good, you can eliminate the possibility of the clutch being worn out. Just trying to see exactly what your problem is. ------------- 1955 WD45 diesel 203322 was my dad's tractor, 1966 D15 23530, 1961 HD3 Crawler 1918, 1966 D17 IV 83495, 1937 WC 41255, 1962 D19 6221 |
Posted By: David Maddux
Date Posted: 19 May 2011 at 6:18am
| Make sure that the PD handle set screw has not come loose. You may just be slipping the handle. |
Posted By: MACK
Date Posted: 19 May 2011 at 7:45am
| Engauge the PTO, If it quits turning when you engauge PD the foot clutch is out. If it continues to turn problem is in PD. MACK |
Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 19 May 2011 at 8:28am
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Check the P/S fluid level. It's in the front bolster. The filler is behind the grille. Fill it to the point it has about 1/2" over the gears inside. The manual says it could have 20wt motor oil, Dexron, or hydraulic oil. I'd say if you stick something in there to see what it looks like, red is Dexron. If it's other than red, I'd use universal tractor hydraulic in it. There is a drain plug on the bottom side so it can be changed... ------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: rascal
Date Posted: 19 May 2011 at 2:13pm
| Hi an thank you for that info, I am going to take a look inside the cover. By the way if I takethat cover of for the PD will oil come out? thanks |
Posted By: rascal
Date Posted: 19 May 2011 at 2:14pm
| Hi, thanks I did check and the shaft is moving forward and backward to engage. thanks |
Posted By: rascal
Date Posted: 19 May 2011 at 2:19pm
| Hi Mack thanks for your help on this issue, I can say that this morning I engaged the PTO and then engaged the PD ,the PTO kept turning with no problems, so I am assuming that it is a PD problem , you wouldn't have a diagram or instructions on how to adjust the shims ? I live in south central Canada and there isn't anyone around here that can give/sell me that info. Thanks again |
Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 19 May 2011 at 6:32pm
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Check the link to the store on this site. Darin has manuals for sale. It looks like it might be pretty easy to adjust. As far as the oil coming out with the cover off, I don't know. I was hoping someone would answer that. I need to adjust mine too. ------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 19 May 2011 at 6:56pm
| I wish you would find another D14-D15-D17-D19 and actually feel what the handclutch should be like and then report back......I have a hard time believing that it needs shimmed that badly on both low and high sides. |
Posted By: Chris (swIA)
Date Posted: 19 May 2011 at 7:18pm
| It can't be the shims. I just had to fix mine because it was so far out of adjustment that the splines on the back plate an the low side jumped over the outside of the drive hub and it never slipped. I would guess the set screw fell out. |
Posted By: Pat the Plumber CIL
Date Posted: 19 May 2011 at 11:17pm
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Drain plug for PD is on foot clutch side .Drain before removing cover. ------------- You only need to know 3 things to be a plumber;Crap rolls down hill,Hot is on the left and Don't bite your fingernails 1964 D-17 SIV 3 Pt.WF,1964 D-15 Ser II 3pt.WF ,1960 D-17 SI NF,1956 WD 45 WF. |
Posted By: lenholm
Date Posted: 11 Oct 2023 at 7:05pm
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I have a 1961 D17, gas engine, I bought last year. I will admit up front I know very little about tractors. I don't have a mechanic close by to work on it. My power director seems to work fine in high. However, when I pull the handle back to low I have to hold hit back or the tractor goes to neutral - without the handle moving all the way to the neutral detent. How is this adjusted? Without getting a lot of derogatory comments I am also interested if the best way to operate the tractor is to have the hand clutch in neutral; use the foot clutch to select the transmission gear, then use the hand clutch to drive? Or can you have the hand clutch in high or low and use the foot clutch? Thank you
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Posted By: AC720Man
Date Posted: 11 Oct 2023 at 7:46pm
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The foot clutch overrides the PD as far as gear selection so yes you can leave it in hi range, neutral, or lo, come to a complete stop and select the gear you choose. Mush easier to engage gear if tractor engine is at idle. ------------- 1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD |
Posted By: AC720Man
Date Posted: 11 Oct 2023 at 7:48pm
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If your tractor creeps with the PD in neutral don’t get concerned, this is normal until the oil warms up. Most still creep some after it’s warmed up ------------- 1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 11 Oct 2023 at 8:04pm
| You've had the tractor since last year. Did the hand lever stay in LOW range then?? if it did, I'd guess that you have a piece of low range linkage inside now broken, especially if it never wants to stay in low at all when you pull back on the lever and springs forward when you let go. If your tractor has any kind of linkage hanging from the hand lever down to under the tractors belly, REMOVE all of those parts and try it. The lever should "feel" the same when you pull back on it as it does when you go forward into HIGH range. If it "feels" the same, and will stay back with the engine OFF, you may have badly worn ramp plates and rollers. No adjustment fixes that. New parts inside does. If it feels "soft" when you pull back on the lever and it slowly works forward to neutral, shim adjustment might help that. |
Posted By: lenholm
Date Posted: 29 Oct 2023 at 9:44am
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Thank you for the reply. The tractor has always slipped out of low range if I don't hold the lever back. Now that I've re-read the manual it does appear there is some adjustments that can be made to the lever location stops. That might be the fix. I will give that a try before a more extensive rebuild.
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Posted By: Pat the Plumber CIL
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2023 at 7:55am
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Len , when I was a young man learning to operate our tractor on the farm I was told the foot clutch is for changing gears and engaging PTO . The power director (hi-nuetral-lo) lever is for making the tractor move or stop . This is how I was instructed. The foot clutch is ahead of the power director and hydraulics. It can be used to make tractor move or stop without disengaging power director. My father's theory was by using the power director to move and stop and the foot clutch to change gears would save wear on the foot clutch. Power director is submerged partly in oil/fluid and takes a lot of abuse and doesn't wear out as fast . AllisChalmers made a good foot clutch and have not heard about a lot of tem wearing out . My father said they had a WC that wore out foot clutches (probably from running a roto baler on it) and when the D17 showed up the dealer told him told him to use the power director as much as possible and he would never wear out a foot clutch again. Now having said this I have an elderly neighbor up the street that keeps his D17 in the high position and has never taken it out of high position.He grew up on super M and says he can't get used to it . His tractor runs fine though and uses it to mow a couple acres of pasture each year ------------- You only need to know 3 things to be a plumber;Crap rolls down hill,Hot is on the left and Don't bite your fingernails 1964 D-17 SIV 3 Pt.WF,1964 D-15 Ser II 3pt.WF ,1960 D-17 SI NF,1956 WD 45 WF. |
Posted By: DSeries4
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2023 at 2:48pm
No derogatory comment intended, but buy and operator's manual. It will tell you everything you need to know about your tractor. They can be found on e-bay. The foot clutch is completely separate the hand clutch. The hand clutch can be in any position when shifting gears, but you do need to use the foot clutch to shift gears. ------------- '49 G, '54 WD45, '55 CA, '56 WD45D, '57 WD45, '58 D14, '59 D14, '60 D14, '61 D15D, '66 D15II, '66 D21II, '67 D17IV, '67 D17IVD, '67 190XTD, '73 620, '76 185, '77 175, '84 8030, '85 6080 |
lenholm wrote:Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2023 at 3:50pm
| If the hand lever immediately jumps out of low range (not slowly, but right now) there's no adjustment for that. Sounds like a broken linkage arm to the front of the clutch or low range ramp plates and rollers completely worn out. I suppose someone could have it shimmed terribly wrong to cause this, but I don't think so. So many people think that when the hand lever jumps to neutral on its own, that is a shim issue. It ain't. Rearranging the shims is to make up for wear on the clutch discs and plates. Changing the shims makes a slipping or "soft" clutch not slip anymore. Not repair it to stay locked in engagement. |
Posted By: lenholm
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2023 at 6:41pm
Thank you for replying. I do have both the original owner's manual and a shop manual. They are good references but maybe because I'm new to tractors they don't help diagnose issues. They are very good at guiding me to making repairs.
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Posted By: lenholm
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2023 at 6:53pm
Thank you sir for your time and reply. The hand lever doesn't immediately "jump" out of low. I can pull it back and the tractor begins to move but after a short while the lever slowly creeps forward enough stop the tractor movement. The lever does not move to, or snap, to the neutral position. If I hold the lever fully to the rear the tractor moves in low range and I don't notice any issues - it will spin tires in the dirt if I get the bucket jammed up for example. Am I correct to assume that if that is the case it's not a slipping or "soft" clutch"? I guess I don't have any way to know if the clutch pack is fully engaged but it seems to be because I can scrape or use the bucket to move dirt, rocks, etc. It seems like if the clutch packs were slipping then the tractor tires would stop moving. Again I appreciate your assistance. I recognize it's nearly impossible to diagnose an issue via a forum but any avenues to consider are great. I just don't have anyone around here who can drive the tractor to let me know if it is operating as intended.
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Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2023 at 7:02pm
| If it will spin the wheels with a load, it's probably not slipping. So, it doesn't immediately jump to neutral when you let go of the lever in LOW range ?? Worn out ramp plates and rollers act like this oftentimes: Pull the lever back fully into LOW range with the engine at a very slow idle and remove your hand from the lever. How long will it stay engaged with the engine idling ?? I must advise you to spray some WD40 or the like all over the neutral latch mechanism so it isn't helping hold it in LOW range. Or better yet, jam something on top of the neutral lock pin from the outside to hold the pin down, negating any chance of it dragging on the lever and trying to hold it in LOW range. Now, if it seems to stay locked in at a very slow engine idle, throttle the engine up to wide open throttle. If it jumps into neutral (with a disabled neutral latch mechanism) that is a sure sign of worn out ramp plates and rollers. RPM gives them away because centrifugal force makes the clutch release, which it would not do if the ramps/rollers are in good condition. |