technology. good or not..
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Topic: technology. good or not..
Posted By: acwdwcman
Subject: technology. good or not..
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2011 at 8:35pm
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Today in ag class we were talking about farming and tractors and about how they are so hi tech. I made a comment that when your tractor can drive itself it is not real farming. I have a friend that says the same thing that I say. I was wandering what your opinion was on the matter. ------------- wd with a freeman model 90 trip loader, wd45, 38 unstylled wc, b 10 garden tractor and 2-14 ac trip plow. grandpa has a 56 wd45. wd. allis chalmers snap coupler blade and 3 bottom snap coupler plow |
Replies:
Posted By: cougar766
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2011 at 8:44pm
| I'll agree with you, I also say that the units coming off the assembly lines will never make antique status due to the computors |
Posted By: D17 owner
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2011 at 9:38pm
| they are throw away tractors! I like My d17, dont need a scaner for it ether. |
Posted By: frankmi
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2011 at 10:09pm
| More are farming (as just a job)now, but there are less real FARMERS!!! |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2011 at 10:38pm
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I remember sitting on a tractor with only a heat-houser pulling a great, big 4-16" plow during cold fall days. I've also gone back to the farm and spent a couple of days in a 475 hp 4WD tractor with a guidance system. I loved the warm, quiet cab and the guidance system. If anything, it gave me more time to look around at the fields, nature, and what was happening behind me. It also made it possible for this 65+ year old man to stay in the field for 12 hours and not be beat. I could even still hear when the tractor was shut off. The fact that I got as much tillage done in an hour vs a day with the 4 bottom plow wasn't bad either. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Posted By: Pat the Plumber CIL
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2011 at 10:43pm
Amen ------------- You only need to know 3 things to be a plumber;Crap rolls down hill,Hot is on the left and Don't bite your fingernails 1964 D-17 SIV 3 Pt.WF,1964 D-15 Ser II 3pt.WF ,1960 D-17 SI NF,1956 WD 45 WF. |
427435 wrote:Posted By: wekracer
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2011 at 10:51pm
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certainly the guidance system is a great invention, but given all else being equal. i would take an 8000 series Allis in the field any day. for a 30 year old tractor, they're as comfortable and modern as any new tractor. besides the guidance, what more do they have to offer. Once more, tell me what more you could ask for in a chore tractor than a D17 IV. Live hydraulics/PTO, power stearing, 56 hp and the power director. If they made them brand new today, they would sell. the only way to improve is a cab and radio. that's a big streatch for 50 years. |
Posted By: abbaschild95
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2011 at 11:05pm
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ok i agree TO A POINT. technology is there for a reason. it is improving the way we farm. without alot of it we wouldnt be able to farm the big farms. a few 50 acre farms arent going to feed the world. my family is well known for having big farms and we couldnt do it without the higher tech equipment. the systems also give us higher efficiency to grow a better crop.
that being said, it is definitely not how it used to be. the farmer is not in a sense as "personal" with their crop. whether that is a bad thing is a personal opinion. i believe that as long as a farmer is taking pride in what they are doing and doing it to their full potential, they are a true farmer, technology or not. ------------- Great-granfather's WC---- hopefully many more to come! |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2011 at 11:46pm
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I forgot one major advantage of today's guidance systems. They virtually eliminate overlap which wastes both fuel and chemicals--------both expensive items. I had started a program using a computer aided vision system for auto guidance with Honeywell shortly after the 8000's were introduced (this was in the days before GPS). They thought they could do it using some technology from some of their military work. Unfortunately, the military clamped a secrecy order on it and wouldn't let us pursue it. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Posted By: SHAMELESS
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 1:32am
| i have a neighbor that bought one of those green tractors with all the do dads, when the warranty was out, and the electonics gave him a bunch of expensive grief, he traded it for an older bigger tractor without all that garbage on it! he's alot happier now, as it's not costing him as much! |
Posted By: SHAMELESS
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 1:34am
| plus...ya'll know what "dust" does to electronics!! and where does a tractor/combine run in? |
Posted By: SHAMELESS
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 1:44am
| acwd...you don't always have to agree with the ag teacher! don't be disrespectful either, some ag teachers really haven't been out there on the farm spending the money to do the job, most are brainwashed by equipment companies to teach the kids what they want them to learn! then the kids go tell dad's they should do it this way cuz they said so! our ag teacher had never been on a farm in his life! cept to visit! us kids taught him alot! was kinda funny sometimes, as JD and Ford were big contributers to our ag classes...and when we would bring in or talk about other brands, things were not pretty in class! our ag teacher catered to the families that had JD and Fords more than the other kids in the class! so be cafeful of what some teachers are trying to cram down your throats! |
Posted By: Brad(WI)
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 7:01am
| Every generation has said that about the new technology. It's not farming if you aren't behind a horse, can't be farming if in a cab, etc. I'll take air conditioning and auto steer any day. We haven't moved up to auto steer yet, but it's the next step. Electronics do last in an ag tractor, many 10 year old tractors out there running with mega hours. A few will lose a computer or have wiring problems, but that will happen with anything. |
Posted By: John (C-IL)
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 7:46am
| Well, take a little trip to India, China or Africa and see how those farmers are doing without technology. I'll take all I can get or afford. At the end of the day the technologically savy farmer will be feeding the world and the guy that doesn't have the technology will be feeding his family and his kids will be barefoot and living a subsistance lifestyle. |
Posted By: Justin(IN)
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 8:02am
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We run John Deere tractors with the deere guidance (RTK with ITEC pro), also added air clutches to the planter. With this combination we save a lot of seed and time by the end of the day (enough to pay for itself in a hurry).
We run auto steer on the combine and sprayer as well... it is well worth it in my opinion...
Thanks:
Justin
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Posted By: Nathan (SD)
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 8:14am
| I have been kicking around the idea of putting the add on auto steer on the D17. It mounts right on the steering shaft. It would double the value of the tractor and make spraying a lot easier. |
Posted By: Dave H
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 8:29am
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Yep take me back to the good ole days. The team of horses I drove had auto steer that was nice when mowing hay. Another great thing was the air conditioning, especially early in the morning when you got them into a hard up hill pull and they started to loose compression. Oh and then we had the high tech toilet that had two holes and you never even had to flush it.
I think it is better to think back and look forward.
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Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 9:00am
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An 8000 series can easily be fitted with a light bar or even auto steer.
The new cabs that are so comfortable for the operator will help all that new technology survive longer, as well as the electronics being built to "military" specs. Like our beloved ACs most of these new tractors will be obsolete long before they're worn out, and it will depend on the luck of the draw how they will last. Some will stay on the same farm for 40 years and others will go from farmer to farmer. The thing to remember is there are a lot less of any model or series built than there used to be. How many tractors today will see production runs of 50,000 or more. Another problem for the future tractor collector wil be the size of todays average tractor. Not going to put one on a trailer behind your electric car and take it to a show. And how much harder will it be to replace a 30 year old computer when the time comes than parts for a 100 year old steamer today?
Like it or not, the "real" farmer had 160 acres when his nieghbors had 40, had a 1000 acres when his nieghbors had 400. Today he has 3000 or more while his nieghbors have 1200. The more technology usually means more efficiently and faster. The more acres, the cheaper the big hi tech stuff becomes.
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Posted By: cougar766
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 9:11am
| I'll agree we need the technoligy (did I spell that right?) to increase our production. I just wander about everybody forgetting how we got here though, and the way a computor is outdated so quickly what about restoring a piece in 30 to 40 years as an antique, will we be able to do it and preserve this history. Thats my fear. |
Posted By: JC-WI
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 12:49pm
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Well, I guess I will be the black sheep of the family here. I seen when there were 19 farm families on this road. there were 121 farm/ers in a township of 6 mile square, or 36 square miles. They all made some form of a living. Some barns became idle in the fifties when the manufactoring industry grew and turned from military goods to other goods and hired many more locals.
They liked the paycheck and not having to work so hard in town. Some lands got set aside gov programs on them and others sole their homesteads and farms to the dnr and moved into town... Sixties rolled around and the 20 cow farms were still mustering along but cost of everything was going up by leaps and bounds and by the beginnings of the seventies, those that were still farming were getting older and were retiring and the small farms were now getting to be 30-50- 60 cows large and some were heading to the hundred cow size trying to make enough money to pay their "investment" loans on what they built. ...By the time many of those loans were paid off, the facilities & equipment were worn out so hence new loans. Eighties came busting in and many were turning to trying cash cropping, specially after the dairy herd byout program came into being.That forced many farmers to add more cows to keep their cash flow going to pay debts.. Many sold out and/or rented their places. Ninties came into play, with the same old song and dance routine of get bigger, get more efficient. Now all of a sudden people started to realise that those old twenty and thirty cow herd farms were dying and gone...People were busy looking for any job they could find in town. Why?
Maybe the game of screwing the farmers out of honest pay for honest worth of product in leu of cheap food goods? And higher cost of fuel and machinery and parts and insurances and .... on ten dollar or less milk and not being able to compete with large farms that were taking away rented grounds from the smaller guys.
That is what your modern technologies has done for you, put thousands of acres into the hands of few agricultural controlling corporation farms. The so called "dairy farmers" with a thousand cows should have never been... they took away what could have been lively hoods of 33 farm families that would have had 30 cows.
Sadly the majority of people have left the land and it will never be as it was... but there is a saying something about what was will be again, ... sometime evolution will take its turn at the wheel.
Maybe when the big farmers can't afford to buy the new shiney big stuff...Maybe we will be back to picknn corn by hand and working with horses again.... or using the rebuilt 'antique' tractors to pull the loads. And maybe not with 5 dollar gas acoming
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Posted By: Orange Blood
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 3:31pm
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I agree with a little bit of everything that has been said. I will tell you this, I love farming, even though I was forced into a city job. I would do it in a heartbeat, if the startup costs weren't so high. I remember the days on the old 190, or the 19 cuttin stalks, or pulling the planter, and we were farming around 600 acres then, and autosteer would have been a blessing, cause my rows were never straight, and the cultivator blight was a bit of a problem, so from the technology point of view, I say bring it on, it would have saved money, and made those long hours a little more tolerale, maybe would have let me catch a few costly breakdowns sooner, if I could have been paying attention to ALL of the factors, rather than 75% of my time steering and 25% of my time watching the equipment. I am slightly biased, my degree is in electronics, so all that technology doens't pose a real threat to me, or my pocketbook. ------------- Still in use: HD7 WC C CA WD 2-WD45 WD45LP WD45D D14 3-D17 D17LP 2-D19D D19LP 190XTD 190XTLP 720 D21 220 7020 7030 7040 7045 3-7060 Projects: 3-U UC 2-G 2-B 2-C CA 7-WC RC WDLP WF D14 D21 210 7045 N7 |
Posted By: Byron WC in SW Wi
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 3:35pm
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That's part of the reason I sold my AGCO. It was a fantastic tractor but it was run by electronics and I can't trust that AGCO will stay in business long enough to fix it when it fails. And, electronics do fail. Still, most of the time the electronics let you have a safer tractor with automatic four wheel braking and controlled shifting. Guidance systems have a long way to go before they'll be effective in my neck of the woods. Too many small weird shaped fields. |
Posted By: dave63
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 5:12pm
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Intersting that you use a COMPUTER on the INTERNET to ask if technology is good or not. We live in an age of no return like it or not we need technology to sustain the lifestyle that we enjoy. Sad part is that i see so many people still farming old school and not adopting technology only to wonder why thy can't make it financialy. Yes it cost money but it takes money to make money. If you want to farm you realy NEED to learn buisness managment as well. I had to learn it the hard way and i still can't spell. Tomorrows farms will be owned by people that spend more time in there office than in there tractor seat. Becouse you have to spend more time figuring out how to grow more with less. Its not just about surviving it's about sucseeding. ------------- The universal answer to all questions is yes, how much do you want to spend? |
Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 6:53pm
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My thoughts are it's both good and bad. From time to time I see older vehicles with electronic issues that while the vehicle is in good overall condition, the part(s) needed are extremely expensive or NLA. ------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 6:58pm
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An example of where technology may not be so great is the Ford Contour Merc Mystique with a 2.5L V-6. The wire used for the engine wire looms gets brittle from the heat underhood. The insulation cracks and the wires corrode or break. Computers are very sensitive to resistance. A little unwanted extra resistance can really cause problems. Repairs can quickly exceed the value of the car... ------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: Ryan Renko
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 7:10pm
| My Dad remembers when there used to drive around to see who planted the straightest rows. It made for great talk in the local tavern!!! With this auto guidance stuff what are those fellows gunna talk about now in the bar?? I agree todays farmer has to feed the world, but kinda miss the old days to!! Ryan |
Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 7:15pm
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Who cares if the rows are a little crooked? Only gonna use 'em once year... LOL ------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 10:25pm
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Anyone else on here that's old enough to remember "checking" the corn so you could cultivate crossways?? The farmer that could get his field planted so that the "crossways" rows were straight was the pride of the area. I also remember cultivating crossways-----for some reason Dad always let his smart-acre son do that. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Posted By: singingpig
Date Posted: 12 Apr 2011 at 10:47pm
Not necessarily, John. Depends on what you are farming and the scale. If you are farming commodities or veg/fruits for processing where your net/acre is a few hundred dollars I would agree. On the other hand, if you are producing fresh veg and fruit where your net is $1000s/acre then the need for technology isn't as great. For example, I farm 20 acres that is almost a perfect square and flat. The only thing I spray is a fish/kelp foliar feed or some humates on bare ground. I spread manure pellets and granular lime+trace with a cone spreader. I lay out my beds with my eyeballs....on 20 acres how much more efficient am I going to be with satellite guided equipment? How much am I going to save by not overlapping my applications? I do just fine on the technology that larger growers are discarding to make room for the latest and greatest. For example, the 1880 foot long wheeline irrigation unit I bought for $3200 from a farmer who upgraded to a ultra high tech, computerized linear (cost=$100k). The wheeline was state of the art technology in about 1960, but it was made out of aluminum, steel and brass and those parts are as good now as they were when they were manufactured. The only parts I have had to replace are rubber which gets a little brittle after 50 years. My 1948 G works better now than when it rolled off the AC assembly line...for HP I have a 140hp JD 5020 made in 1967, a 1995 ford 62hp 4X4 loader tractor for utility tasks and seeding/spraying. They could all certainly be more comfortable and quieter but they still get the job done. 12 and 14 foot tools bought cheap used because they are too small for big farms. A 10 ft chisel plow for $450, for example. Instead of a manure spreader I graze pigs in my fields...plow in the front, manure spreader in the rear. Plus they turn a profit as opposed to a manure spreader that depreciates. I do have some technology for seeding and harvesting that keeps labor needs to a minimum. I'll go with technology when I see that it will give me cashflow. Everything doesn't have to be big and high tech for a farmer to be profitable. The profits from fresh veg and pastured livestock far exceeds the profit from commodities on an acre to acre comparison. I don't need to have teams of 6 swathers and combines like the guy next to me who farms 22,000 acres of grass seed, although I do put in a lot more hours of manual labor. I don't need all the buildings and grain storage, etc of a large hog farmers and my profit/animal is much greater on lower input costs + my manure is an asset to my operation not a liability that is considered hazardous waste in need of an EPA permit. Certainly both types of farms are necessary. People can't live off of just corn and soybeans and wheat. They need fresh veg, fruits and meat, too. |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 5:55am
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You can bet that almost everyone on this forum who farms today won't be farming in 20 years and neither will their kids, other than for a hobby maybe. Those who think they run with the big dogs won't be big enough. The numbers will continue to fall and the equipment will continue to get bigger and more expensive. Ever since Nixon's Secretary of Agriculture said get big or get out every administration has tuned the ag policy to benefit the large producer which has put farming into fewer and fewer hands just like almost all of today's businesses. For some inexplicable reason people have been brainwashed into thinking that a small producer is inefficient and not able to produce 200 bu corn or 60 bu beans. Eventually this country will be like old England with surfs, dukes and lords. Guess which one you all will be. Pessimistic? I guess. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: John (C-IL)
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 6:30am
I agree with you to a point. What you are doing is fine and provides a good living for you. What you are doing won't feed 7 billion people on your scale. What you are doing is not sustainable, i.e. when you can't or won't do it anymore there won't be a line of people wanting to buy your operation or operate it the way that you do. Will technology solve that problem? Probably not.
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Posted By: JayIN
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 7:03am
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Amen, Lonn. You are exactly right. All business today is driven today by GREED. ------------- sometimes I walk out to my shop and look around and think "Who's the idiot that owns this place?" |
Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 8:27am
| Ah marketing it a great thing, specially if your selling. All this "technology" that us farmers cant do with out cost about as much as it returns, so the net net net to us is nothing, but from the sellers of tech gear and it constantly updating systems its like printing money. We have a state of the art monitors on both our planters, cost big bucks doesnt tell us anything the old blinking lights didnt, yes it gives population seed spacing etc, but does it transfer into money ...no. Once in a blue moon it detects a problem with one row due to a chain, or some other malfuntion, and yes it did translate into yield, but the bottom line is it would have been detected when the planter stopped to fill, its not like the planter would have planted a 1000 acres like that. Auto steer which sounds awesome would be great if you had a bunch of guys working for you that had no idea of what they were doing, but the guy that runs our field cultivater in the spring has been here for 10yrs and if you watch his pass he is with in inches of his last pass its remarkable on a 50ft swath. We have tech that runs the sparyer controls the flow by speed etc, that saves money, but when it fails, and it does, the old pressure and speed way works till its repaired and I dont see the HUGE difference in chemical costs I was promiced. Yield monitors another high tech toy is great its about as accurate as counting trucks leaving the field and guessing thats another 1000 bu on it. If you made all the yield that the monitor is telling you we would all be rich, but the big scale doesnt lie. What is gained from the yield monitor is quick comparisons to varity and it does detect weak spots in the fields , however as a farmer I knew where those weak spots are I didnt need the monitor to tell me that, and some areas are just unfixable so there is nothing that can be done about the yield drop, but thanks for reminding me yearly of it. The old adage of figures never lie, but liars figure holds alot of weight with all this high tech, one comment was it allows us to farm more land, well awesome but you have to farm more land to cover the cost of all the high tech, so your right back to the dog chasing its tail. You wanna make money in farming and stay sustainable the biggest advice I could give anybody is to GET RID OF THE BANK!!!!!!!!!! When we paid off all dept we make way more money, life is much better, less pressure, more enjoyable and with a high net worth unencumbered by debt I can pass this to who ever and they can farm with out the pressure or the need to farm a million acres and 3 counties to please some a..hole in a suit telling me I need more high tech to be competitive. Just my take on it as a city boy gone farming but not following the herd mentality. |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 8:31am
No one today can feed 7 billion people. What's the difference between a large scale farmer and a small scale farmer? Neither can do it alone. The difference is that today's farm policies are geared to assist the advance of the mega producer and leave the smaller producer in the dust bin. Turn it around and leave the mega farms go belly up when the time comes (and it will) and assist the smaller farmer and you have a different story. The story might be that these large corporate farms are to big to save or if the subsidized low cost illegals or even so-called legals are cut out of the deal the mega producers may disappear quickly. Maybe get rid of the programs all together for both small and large and maybe start to enforce monopoly laws on large agri business including equipment builders and dealerships that have full control of large areas. BTW any of you on this forum that might think you are part of the mega producers, think again. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: singingpig
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 9:33am
I'm pretty sure no matter how big your operation is you aren't feeding 7 billion people either. lol I understand you're proud of what you do,but feeding 7 billion on just commodities? How much of your dietary needs are filled directly from the crops you grow? IOW, how much of your corn do you serve at the dinner table? As I said before, people need fresh food...veg, fruits, meat. Truck farms have been in existence for a long time and they will continue to exist for a long time to come. I will have no problem selling my operation, I could sell it now if I was ready but I think I have another 20 years or so left in me. Whether the buyer wants to do it my way...I don't really care. Once we have a closing it is theirs to farm as they wish, but in 20 years when I am ready I am positive that the demand for high quality produce and meat will have increased not decreased. Where I live, irrigated farmland like mine is $10-12k/acre right now...that won't be going down over the next 20 years. Add 30% premium to that for cert OG land like mine. There are roughly 1 million acres of farmland in the valley where I live. We are 1st in the nation in blackberry production, 3rd in raspberries, the region is 1st in blueberries, the valley is 1st in Xmas trees, peppermint and grass seed. A lot of strawberries, sweet corn and green beans for processing as well. A very diverse crop mix out here...2 things we don't grow corn and soybeans. Too cool in the summers and the rains start to early to get them harvested. Just got this in my email last night from The Rodale Institute...takes the exact opposite position the you are putting forward: link to full UN report: http://www2.ohchr.org/english/issues/food/docs/A-HRC-16-49.pdf - http://www2.ohchr.org/english/issues/food/docs/A-HRC-16-49.pdf GENEVA – Small-scale farmers can double food production within 10 years in critical regions by using ecological methods, http://www2.ohchr.org/english/issues/food/docs/A-HRC-16-49.pdf - a new UN report shows. Based on an extensive review of the recent scientific literature, the study calls for a fundamental shift towards agroecology as a way to boost food production and improve the situation of the poorest. “To feed 9 billion people in 2050, we urgently need to adopt the most efficient farmingtechniques available,” says Olivier De Schutter, UN Special Rapporteur on the right to food and author of the report. “Today’s scientific evidence demonstrates that agroecological methods outperform the use of chemical fertilizers in boosting food production where the hungry live -- especially in unfavorable environments.” |
Posted By: abbaschild95
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 9:43am
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i dont think that you have to have every single piece of your equipment be brand new. our center pivot system is pretty new and it raises the best corn thats been on the farm. and we also have sever pre '70's tractors along with our later 2000's tractors. whatever is profitable i agree. ------------- Great-granfather's WC---- hopefully many more to come! |
Posted By: John (C-IL)
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 10:23am
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After erasing what I wrote, I give up. Move this all to the politcal section and pray for the almighty O to save everybodies asterisk. |
Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 10:50am
| Just an after thought about large scale farming, if you go back through history this happens every so many years, farms ramp up, equipment etc all goes big time, than it implodes and we start all over again. What happened to all the bonaza farms out in the Dakotas, look back through old farm jouranls and Successful farming magazines, find some issues from the late 70's early 80's when big was the only way to farm, 747 big buds, 1156 versatiles, tiger steigers, than all the 4wd companys went under or changed owners, no more big 4wd no market to sell them, FWA and 2wd tractors were what was selling to the family sized farm, prudential, standard oil etc all pulled out of the large scale farms, Paloma Ranch in AZ gone, broken up to family size farms. Now look at the present and the current attitude to size just give it a couple of more years and we will reset again, and technology isnt going to stop that cycle. |
Posted By: JayIN
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 11:45am
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My father told me 20 years ago that the worst thing that ever happened to agriculture was putting headlights on tractors. Think about it. Now you can plow 24 hours and rent all the neighbor's places! I have 1 prediction--- today's current high prices ( $7.37 Corn ) will be the downfall of many. It would be better in the long run if corn was $5.00. The worst thing about high prices is high prices. ------------- sometimes I walk out to my shop and look around and think "Who's the idiot that owns this place?" |
Posted By: singingpig
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 2:39pm
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For the original poster. 1st good for you for going to school, and for recognizing that there are many different, valid business models for farming...you don't just have to do it the way they teach it in school. 2nd...if you thirst for knowledge of the old ways, talk to every old timer who will share their time. Also, google has scanned a bunch of the old Farm Journal magazines that you can read for free...excellent advice from the early 1900s, back when there wasn't organic vs conventional farming...it was all just farming. Here is a link to a several book series from an ag course published in 1831...you'll get many months of reading here: http://books.google.com/books?id=IYpBAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA1048&lpg=PA1048&dq=feeding+sour+whole+milk+to+swine&source=bl&ots=XYoVkipOec&sig=ZwSMKXmbooxMwV6JYi0HPCjDxB4&hl=en&ei=VQWlTeDmDpLEsAOIz6z6DA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CCIQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=feeding%20sour%20whole%20milk%20to%20swine&f=false - http://books.google.com/books?id=IYpBAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA1048&lpg=PA1048&dq=feeding+sour+whole+milk+to+swine&source=bl&ots=XYoVkipOec&sig=ZwSMKXmbooxMwV6JYi0HPCjDxB4&hl=en&ei=VQWlTeDmDpLEsAOIz6z6DA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CCIQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=feeding%20sour%20whole%20milk%20to%20swine&f=false |
Posted By: singingpig
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 2:44pm
An old Italian/Scottish guy I used to rent acreage from before I bought this place was well known for always having the straightest rows in his area. One day I planted 5 acres of tomatoes on his place without laying out every row with a string...man, was he mad. Next morning he was shaking his cane at me and cussing me out. I just laughed and said "You get more in a crooked row." Of course in 6 weeks the plants had grown together and you couldn't tell if the rows were crooked or not, but he was so mad he didn't speak to me for 3 months. |
Posted By: Larry(OH)
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 3:23pm
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I think the big business farms have alot to gain with it. Around here, the guys that went to it are saving lots of $$$ in overlap,fuel,etc. I think if one can find a niche crop/crops and make money, get er done!! My buddy says the best part of the auto guide in his big JD's is he sets the distance to a headland and an alarm goes off to wake him at end of the field....gets some shut eye on those long days and nights!!!
The one also has an excavating business and said all that stuff is like the GPS/Laser that all excavators use now. The money he saved on the first big job he did paid for everything
------------- '40 WC puller,'50 WD puller,'50 M puller '65 770 Ollie *ALLIS EXPRESS contact* I can explain it to you, BUT I cannot understand it for you!! |
Posted By: Oldoug
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 9:34pm
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I am 100% against guidence systems and all the electronics. There should be more farmers and more 4 row equipment. Just as little as twenty years ago the countryside was so neat to drive through and look at the old farm places and such, nowdays it's just bulldozers and tree piles and bare farmland. You have see the so called farmer twice a year, to plant and then come back for harvest, then they bring the bulldozers back to push in more trees later. ------------- Matt Folkers FOLKERS RESTORATION Restoring vintage things to last so the future can enjoy our past. |
Posted By: Richard S
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 10:25pm
Yes I remember the days of checked corn. It looked pretty but what a waste of ground!
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Posted By: farmer0_1
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2011 at 11:49pm
| i dont have any answers just a few comments. yes i do remember checked corn. the concept behind the electronics is fine its just that it isn't as easy to implement . the day of the 15 year old tractor or pickup is fading fast and the feds, tractor salesman and envirementalist are all cheering. i don't have to make a living at our family farm thank god so mine is a persuit of happiness . and for the most i am happy. remember that we cannot serve two masters. |
Posted By: bill2260
Date Posted: 14 Apr 2011 at 6:56am
| JayIN hit the nail on the head. The first thing you should do when unloading a new/used tractor is take a hammeer and knock the headlights out of it. Burning the candle on both ends works for a while, but you will one day pay dearly with health problems working 16 hour days, days on end. Stop and smell the cow manure, it's great. Bill |
Posted By: hillmonkey
Date Posted: 14 Apr 2011 at 2:14pm
| technology is great. if it wasnt for technology people would not be buying newer tractors. if it wasnt for newer tractors we could not buy the old ones, if there are no old tractors we would not have this forum. i love technology.hm |
Posted By: Texas B
Date Posted: 14 Apr 2011 at 2:27pm
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I must ask you stop and think - somone said that the new tractors woulod not be antiques due to electronics - here's another thought, due to the electronics they are antiques when they come off the line due to the electronics because the engineers have something better already.
kidding aside, I was not a farm boy but lived next to one of those old 50 acre farms. That guy thought me a lot because I worked with my hands, got dirty and tried anything he threw my way. Never took a dime for the farm work, just for mowing his grass. That is where my AC fever came from. He had a WD with a spring bucket front end loader. Sure loved that old hand clutch and that easy access to the seat. Hauled hay and ear corn out of the field may days for him. Never could split would the way he did. I guess I was an early adopter of working for food - lunch was my pay for efforts. ------------- Texas B 39 |
Posted By: Bill Long
Date Posted: 14 Apr 2011 at 2:34pm
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You know, When Pop first sold Allis Chalmers B's to the small farmers his biggest competitor were the mules or horses. When WWII came along and we basically had to produce tractors and the technology of the age helped make it happen. That technology looked at today is way behind what we have. A 100 - 200 Acre farm was fairly large in our area. Now in the small state of Deleware I look at farms with acreage that seems like half the state. They do it with equipment that I could only dream of. Tractors that produce some 550 hp - pull 16 rows of no till planters, and combines that have heavens knows how wide a header. All guided by technology that does straighter and more efficient rows that even the checked corn - which I well remember. We are fortunate to live in a most efficient technologically savy age. While, I miss the mule farming my Grandfather did I envy all who can avail themselves of the latest and best and most efficient farming system I have ever seen. I know I won't but I would love to be around for another 77 years just to see how much further we all progress. Yes, we will have problems but I'll take them. We have always managed however feebly to best them too. Well, guess I have said too much but I cannot tell you how much I enjoy living in this age.
Good Luck!
Bill Long
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Posted By: Eric NY
Date Posted: 14 Apr 2011 at 8:04pm
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Take a look at this video..........I think it kind of explains the role of technology in feeding a hungry world and what is going to be needed in the years to come.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w68OH8zV7Hw Eric NY |
Posted By: abbaschild95
Date Posted: 14 Apr 2011 at 9:19pm
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you know the ffa creed comes to mind...
I believe in the future of agriculture with a faith born not of words, but of deeds. Achievements won by the PRESENT and PAST generations in the hope of better days through better ways, just as the better things we now enjoy have come to us from the struggles of former years.
to me those words mean so much. farming will not end because of technology. the past has shown that technology only makes better farms. we went from 30 bushel corn in the 1800s with muels to 200 bushel and up! the old times have only made us stronger and more able to be stewards of the land. when it boils down to it most farmers care about the land and thats what technology allows us to care for.... ------------- Great-granfather's WC---- hopefully many more to come! |
Posted By: Byron WC in SW Wi
Date Posted: 14 Apr 2011 at 9:24pm
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Talked to a guy today that had a Ford TW-10 and New Holland 8340 or something like that. The 8340 is a newer tractor with "electronics" but nothing like todays tractors. He said their always fixing something electrical on it and it drives him nuts. |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 14 Apr 2011 at 9:50pm
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I'm not against technology but I am against policies that benefit the large producers over the small producer. Same with most other industries too. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |