IA, DOT Laws? any body concerned?
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Topic: IA, DOT Laws? any body concerned?
Posted By: ac_bowsers
Subject: IA, DOT Laws? any body concerned?
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 9:05am
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Found this on Pulloff, whats a guy to do? I live in IL, does this mean I can't go through IA without getting this done, or does my crooked state have this too and just haven't heard the news yet. Thoughts gentlemen??
Just to remind everyone in Iowa new DOT law goes in effect July 1. Every vehicle with GVW over 10,001 lbs must have US DOT numbers. New law went in effect Jan 1 2010 but only warnings given until July 2011. This even includes heavy 1 ton pickups. Must have Farm/Business name and number just like Semi. You will go through safety audit after you get your number. I wouldn"t wait till last minute on this because lines could get long. This is INTRASTATE so is required whether crossing state lines or not. ------------- Pine Stock Farm "Home of the ALLIS" 35-WC-36-U-37-UC-47-C-49-G-57-D17-58-D17puller-63-D21-71-210puller-79-7045-83-8070-AA9675-BigTen-B10-310-1300fieldcult-snapcoupler imp.-longhopper blower,signs,etc. |
Replies:
Posted By: Russ-neia
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 9:40am
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I believe the legislature is working on, or already passed a bill to exempt farm use and possibly some others. Google Iowa Farm Bureau, that is where I was reading about it. ------------- The innovators offer what others will imitate. |
Posted By: Nathan (SD)
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 9:47am
| Is it GVW or GVWR? |
Posted By: Dick L
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 9:47am
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It is all about bringing in more money not safety as they claim. Is seems funny to me when every time they try more regulations with fines it actually causes the states to bring in less money over all. When it doesn't bring in more money they just figure out more regulations thinking it will this time. Same old circle. When the money is about to run out the people vote in more slugs that have in their heads that the past slugs didn't try hard enough. Bad ideas don't work regardless of the thinking of the next slug.
Ends up being the silent majority's fault for not getting involved.
I met one of the fellows that I used to pull with last evening in Cracker Barrel that went to pull in at least three different states all summer long. Because of the crap did not leave his own state the last coupla years. I quit pulling altogether. I bought tractors all over in many states and quit tagging my big trailer.
The Above Is Only My Opinion,
(SLUG) Smarter than everyone else just because they got the job.
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Posted By: Coke-in-MN
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 10:15am
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1 ton truck are now commercial and also you must have a annual DOT inspection sticker if your pulling a trailer over 10,001. Also if you have a bottle of propane or your torch bottles in your truck be sure you have placards on truck.
Also do not forget you need a health card . that is the NEW Fee Generator , lack of health card, and the DOT inspection sticker and papers.
Bulk fuel tanks also are another area where rules come in as to size of tank and tank markings , you may need a has-mat endorsement also depending on amount and chemical or other content. ------------- Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something. "Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful." |
Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 12:19pm
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There is a deciding factor in that. Are you "Private" or "Commercial"? If you're a farmer, they're going to say you're commercial. If you're hauling a tractor to a pull or show where you can win prize money, have a sponsor helping to pay any expenses involved, going to do work for hire, showcasing your restoration skills to "advertise" you're available to restore tractors for others, going to receive any sort of compensation, your truck is registered to something like "John Doe Farms" or any other sort of business entity, you're commercial.
If you're just "John Doe" hauling a tractor to a show or dragging one home simply because you collect them as a hobby, not going to use them in a business, you're private and the stricter laws don't apply. These are examples the DOT gave me when I asked.
Another one is if your trailer has 3000 lbs rated capacity or higher, it MUST have working brakes on all road wheels. ------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: jeffnil
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 12:52pm
| I thiink it is long overdue. I hope other states adopt this as well. It is a safety issue watching pickups with trailers weighing up to 30k or more running a regular license. There was an article in an insurance paper I get from my semi insurance company about this, and how safety was becoming a huge issue with pickups and trailers. Dot numbers are free to get, very small cost in getting a magnetic sign for pickup door that can be taken off when not in use. If you get a dot number, then get an icc number and not pay tax on next trailer purchase. |
Posted By: Chris (swIA)
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 1:09pm
| All the regulation in the world does keep stupid people from being stupid. It is like saying gun laws keep people safe from criminals. First it will be the "free DOT" number followed by higher registration fees. |
Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 1:53pm
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I've been here before, my Ford SD250 is GVWR at 10,000+, my trailer is 13000+, I have 24000# Mo BL plates so I can haul anywhere in state without issue; HOWEVER, if I go to Illinois I must have a DOT number, the registered name sign and a inspection or they will issue a ticket as it is not a "Farm" tag on the truck, has to be "FARM" licensed or you do not get a free pass; also requires at least a B CDL per the 'interpretation' I was given with a health card. This crap is getting ridiculous, they want us all to stop hauling for ourselves and are making it too difficult to do so intentionally. |
Posted By: D17 owner
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 2:08pm
| Wi has this for over a year now. Just more money out of the working mans pocket that all. |
Posted By: Dipstick In
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 2:30pm
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DMiller, and anybody else. This is not an attack by any means! I feel that many of these rules are the offshoot of too many beurocrats at too many desks with too much free time to dream up this crap! As most of youhave said and we all pretty much agree, these rules have very little to do with safety! I know my tractors cost a lot(as defined by how much ready cash in my pocket), for me to get to the point of loading on a trailer for a show. Enough in fact, along with sentimental factors, that I for one sure won't be driving on a road stupidly and too fast to risk damage from an accident! This leaves one of two reasons for the laws. #1. Revenue enhancement #2 Job justification. Generally no. 1 is obvious, but no. 2 probably is more reliable as a reason, for the simple fact that it is geared to enhance no. 1 How do we rid ourselves of stupid rules nos. 1 &2? Contact any legislators that will listen, and seek means of drawing down the monies available for these valuable government employees to sit on their collective butts and dream up this crap! Hmmm, By Jove, two dead birds with one stone, less laws, and fiscal responsibility!! Imagine that! ------------- You don't really have to be smart if you know who is! |
Posted By: John (C-IL)
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 2:59pm
That's one of the reasons that I have gone RV on my rig. The only restriction is that I can not do anything that would be construed as commercial, but then I don't do that anyway.
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Posted By: Rfdeere
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 3:03pm
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Hey John, your using an enclosed trailer. Is the trailer licensed as an RV ? Will they allow an open trailer ? How long is your truck and trailer ? Just curious. ------------- Randy Freshour,Member Indiana AC Partners, http://www.rumelyallis.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.rumelyallis.com |
Posted By: AaronSEIA
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 3:08pm
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The day that people running diesel pushers have to run under DOT regs is the day I'll agree with you. Regulations do not make things safer, they just fine the unsafe
AaronSEIA
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Posted By: cwhit
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 3:10pm
| AC _browsers, it's in IL. also. Contact your local DOT rep. and he'll fill you in. Our local farm bureau had another meeting tue. night to help explain the rules. |
Posted By: D17 owner
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 3:10pm
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Dipstick In wrote:Posted By: Unit3
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 3:24pm
| Went to Kossuth county FB DOT meeting last week. If for hirer, a 1/2ton pickup and trailer over 10001 (door tag and trailer axle) are the same as an 18 wheel semi. My understanding is if you are hauling for your bussiness, you need the CDL license and DOT numbers. If you are hauling your Iowa owned race car up to Fairmont or Jackson ("Just to mess around") , you are doing it to make money and the DOT can come after you. If you are hauling a tractor (3/4 ton and gooseneck) inside 150 miles rad. of your farm to a show, then you only need a farm license. If you are going to sell the tractor at the show then you need the DOT license and numbers. With an Iowa farm license, one can haul grain 150's from their farm and ??? MAYBE ??? 30 miles in Minnesota ,Illinois. and Missouri. Nebraska is forbidden. My semi doesn't need a DOT number as long as it stays just for my farm use. This is my understanding of our laws as of last week. The officer told us that the laws can and will change at anytime. Good luck with this. I also asked what is the biggest fine the DOT has ever handed out? $85,000.00 A wind tower tube tried to cut into Iowa for just a few miles without premits. |
Posted By: John (C-IL)
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 3:37pm
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Posted By: John (C-IL)
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 3:47pm
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Posted By: Rfdeere
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 3:55pm
I wonder if you could get away with a 53' open drop deck behind a truck like yours ? How Long is just the truck ? ------------- Randy Freshour,Member Indiana AC Partners, http://www.rumelyallis.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.rumelyallis.com |
Posted By: Stan IL&TN
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 4:07pm
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Later on this year I plan on renting a car hauler (U-Haul) to put behind my pickup and load my Ferguson onto it. Moving it through Illinois, Missouri, Arkansas and Tennessee from the farm to my home so I can restore it. I assume I'm good to go as far as the reg's go but I could also be in la la land. ------------- 1957 WD45 dad's first AC 1968 one-seventy 1956 F40 Ferguson |
Posted By: John (C-IL)
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 4:21pm
A 53' dropdeck is a commercial trailer and I don't want to have the appearance of being commercial, I'm close enough the way it is. The truck is about 28 feet long from bumper to bumper, it handles as well as a 243" wheel base can but I do have to pay attention to tight places I can get into.
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Posted By: dave63
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 5:53pm
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Just the thought of all those super sized RV's out there towing there cars. Driven by 90 year old folks that are half blind. AND legal gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling.
i just went through the process of registering DOT for my trucks. It was realativly painless. It's best to comply.
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Posted By: Dipstick In
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 6:21pm
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RfDeere, we're pretty lucky here in the Hoosier. I asked the Indiana DOT at the State Fair a year ago about pulling two trailers with my truck. I told them I had triples endorsement on my CDL. They told me there was no limit on how many pieces that you could put together, just don't go over 75 feet. At that time there was no requirement for a CDL for us to haul our trailers, even when over 10000 lbs. If you are commercial, that was a different story;;;;; CDL, dot no., dot physical, etc., etc. Who knows what rules have changed by now, and we probably need to check stuff before this summer,fer sure! I know that my son who manages Bane Implement at I-65 and US 24 was busted over by Wabash on the way to get an auger for a grain cart. Company truck, no dot no. no cdl,no physical, etc,etc. one hour and 45 minutes while the young newby dot ossifer looked through his training manual for anything else he could drum up. Over 300 dollars in demerits later he said "Have a nice day". My son is nicer than his daddy, cause I'd surely have said something about then!! ------------- You don't really have to be smart if you know who is! |
Posted By: michaelwis
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 6:26pm
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Around here things are good .. something has to be pretty bad for SP to get involved (locally ) ------------- WD WD45 DIESEL D 14 D-15 SERIES 2 190XT TERRA TIGER ac allcrop 60 GLEANER F 6060 7040.and attachments for all Proud to be an active farmer |
Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 6:28pm
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Used to wrench in a general garage, so many old couples with RVs, air brakes, commercial diesels, towing massive trailers or cars on trailers and no thought as to having to have a special license. They would drive until they couldn't take any more miles then stop for the night, oh to have a log of time to miles so they could catch hell as truckers do. If it were up to me, anyone towing a trailer, albeit tongue or 5th wheel camper or a load of freight would have to have a towing license or CDL. I have had a commercial license since 1975, I have to take specialized tests, I had to pass a rigorous road test and had to show proficiency with the machine plus do minor repairs to get it out of the line of fire when it broke, needs to be the same for these people. I am going to get signage for mine, then I am going to apply for DOT number as I may need to cross into Ia , Ar, Ks,or Il to get machines/materials and cannot afford the tickets. |
Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 7:17pm
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If you get a DOT number you're stating that you are definitely commercial. That's what the Ia DOT told me. ------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: Dusty MI
Date Posted: 05 Mar 2011 at 7:34pm
Don't tell U-Haul that you are going tractor on their car hauler, they have rules against that, and how big your towing rig needs to be. Dusty ------------- 917 H, '48 G, '65 D-10 series III "Allis Express" |
Posted By: GlenninPA
Date Posted: 06 Mar 2011 at 8:18am
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Never mention tractor to U-Haul.
On the car hauler - say it's an Escort, or a Prizm or some other tiny lightweight car. When I used their 6x12 open trailer for B's, it was always "mulch".
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Posted By: Stan IL&TN
Date Posted: 06 Mar 2011 at 10:23am
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Thanks Dusty and Glenn,
I looked over the requirements they have and did not see any thing that would prohibit a tractor but I think they only reference cars/trucks because they have the weights of those and not tractors. But the point is well taken. I'm hauling a 1956 Ferguson, I mean 1996 Ford............Escort.
I think the weight of that Escort is about 3200-3500lbs so it's well within the rating of my truck and hitch. I also believe the car hauler has surge brakes on it. I'll have the operators manual with me showing weight of tractor just in case I was to be stopped along the way. ------------- 1957 WD45 dad's first AC 1968 one-seventy 1956 F40 Ferguson |
Posted By: Hartland Farm
Date Posted: 06 Mar 2011 at 11:39am
| Stan, Back a few years ago I purchased a 16' car hauler to haul my small AC's around to shows and from my house to the farm. When I went to the County Clerks office for licenses I was given a brochure with the rules of transportation for semi trailers. The one rule here in Tennessee that catches up with a lot of people like me is that when hauling a wheeled vehicle chains must me used (no straps). Also the brochure stated that the chains be on all four corners of the hauled vehicle and the chains must be crossed. Also the DOT here looks for brake-a-way units. Joe (TN) |
Posted By: DarrylinWA
Date Posted: 06 Mar 2011 at 12:39pm
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In January, I spent along time on the phone with getting tonnage on my 2005 Dodge 1 ton in WA. STATE. I carry 32,000 GVW on the thing. (I know I am opening a can of worms here, I have been doing this since 2005) I told them I am running private and not commercial and hauling my own tractor. I pay $400 a year for tabs. I do carry a log book, have a med card, and have class A CDL because I will run for fill in for my friend who runs tankers and end dumps. I had the gal from Olympia run me though the web site with her and I explained what I was all doing on hauling my tractors. She said if I have any problems, she gave me her direct line. I am legal on the tires, axles, fifth wheel plate etc etc. I know what the GVW is on my truck is lower, and I know alot of the DODGE or Ford or GMC HOT SHOT trucks can run up to 40,000 in a one ton. I do not know how they do it, but they do. I have not had a problem going by the scales and am just waiting till the summer when I go down south with my tractors on the trailer. When I haul our 31 ft 5th wheel I am a total of 19,000 lbs and I dont have DOT number for that because it is not required. (Recreation is the only reason why ? So is my tractors ) I have thought about getting a Peterbilt with a big sleeper to do some traveling with the RV and the tractor, but I dont want to run a Pete for s short 10 run to pick up or drop off a tractor at a friends house.
I really like my Dodge and its paid for one and bought it new. Have PACBRAKE and set up for towing.
What do I have to do if I run my truck and trailer to Minn.with my 21 on back to a national show. I will be under 26,000 lbs do I go past the scales.
BIG interesting subject and I think it will continue to get worse.
Sorry for rambling and a can of worms.
Take care, Darryl ------------- B 10 Custom. Serial # 1001 D21, First D21 built 69 #4498 and Last D 21 Built #4609. 1946 MM UTU. And 2000, 2005 Pete's. AC custom Hauling. |
Posted By: JC-WI
Date Posted: 06 Mar 2011 at 12:45pm
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"Around here things are good .. something has to be pretty bad for SP to get involved (locally " Maybe not in your area, but I have been stopped to many times already just minding my own business running under farm tags.
" I have had a commercial license since 1975, I have to take specialized tests, I had to pass a rigorous road test and had to show proficiency with the machine plus do minor repairs to get it out of the line of fire when it broke, needs to be the same for these people." Thats a half a joke there, A few years back I helped a company that shipped a load of peat granulers every evening, You wouldn't believe the number of truckers that came in there that couldn't back a rig up to save their soul...Some couldn't even speak our language and others well, lets say I wouldn't trust them with my pickup and there they were behind a steering wheel of 40 tons. All dot certified...Makes me really wonder.
As for all the laws endorsements etc, most of that is nothing more than a racket to make money in some form or another...such as fines when they stop you and you don't have that specific listed on record.Theres stupid all around the world and in every profession ... And I usually say to myself, don't make it any tougher on everybody else, rather try and make it easier on yourself. That falls into that catagory of "why me, why aren't they required to do the same too?" In this case of dot, we the people gave /allowed them to push/pass to much crap/rules/regs/laws on our former freedoms... and didn't take a stand and tell them to back off -cease and decease.
Shoot man, I don't remember roads piled high with accidents back in the sixties because we didn't have big extensive dot laws to protect the public ..........
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Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 06 Mar 2011 at 12:53pm
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I was told by the IA DOT that if the sign says something like "All trucks over 6000 lbs must weigh", you would want to be pulling in. If they don't care about you, you'll just get waved on through. If they have to chase you down, you are much more likely to be gone over with a fine tooth comb. If they want to, they can write a ticket for failure to obey a traffic control device. (scale open sign) ------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: Stan IL&TN
Date Posted: 06 Mar 2011 at 2:22pm
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Joe,
That's interesting because I read the federal DOT rules in securing loads and they said that chains, cables and straps were allowed as long as they met the formula for working load weight and that the straps had to be in good condition. I've got 6 new straps which have a working load limit of 3333 lbs each. But as I'm well aware of the rules are not exactly clear and the reg you stated could have been burried somewhere in another reg. Confusing for sure. ------------- 1957 WD45 dad's first AC 1968 one-seventy 1956 F40 Ferguson |
Posted By: michaelwis
Date Posted: 06 Mar 2011 at 4:28pm
JC .. like i said depends where u r .... ------------- WD WD45 DIESEL D 14 D-15 SERIES 2 190XT TERRA TIGER ac allcrop 60 GLEANER F 6060 7040.and attachments for all Proud to be an active farmer |
Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 06 Mar 2011 at 5:30pm
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Where I work now we have truck drivers come to deliver that cannot back a rig either, I got used to backing tri-axle equipment floats into a 12 wide garage blind side, damn things would shift the axle it was pivoting on so you had to be careful and precise. I had to qualify as a mechanic to drive the trucks I worked on, had to be able to park, maneuver, highway or in-city operate; we had to pickup the heavy equipment so tie down became a second nature. Anymore if the drivers cannot handle the task my boss sends me down to either direct them or to back the rig into the buildings myself, I have over 30 years of heavy truck driving and 25 mechanic on all manor of machines. I keep my full endorsements so I can be asked for the damn thing and have it to give regardless the load I am dragging, have more than once subbed for a friend when he got sick and couldn't drive to deliver his paycheck materials, have been offered a driving job hauling gas but really want no part of that. |
Posted By: Dusty MI
Date Posted: 06 Mar 2011 at 5:36pm
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At one time I did service work for an electrical contractor at ware house complex. It was not very hard to tell the long haul drivers from the short haul/local delivery drivers. Dusty ------------- 917 H, '48 G, '65 D-10 series III "Allis Express" |
Posted By: Dipstick In
Date Posted: 06 Mar 2011 at 7:01pm
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After 49 years of messing with trucks I've come to the realization that if a diesel bear wants your pelt bad enough he or she now, will get it. I once had a rookie measure a pa speaker setting on the dash of an F moodel Mack. The windshield dropped quite a ways down from the level of the dash. From the bottom of the windshield to the top of the speaker was 7.5 inches, and the law only allowed 4.5. That darned thing was barely visible and not in my line of sight. That didn't matter to him, he wrote me a warning for it just to have some paper finished. I asked him if he was done, and he said yes, I told him to his face that it was the most chicken excrement thing I had ever heard of. The older guy who was training him grabbed him by the arm and said it's time to go. But, he did have a smile on his face!!!! ------------- You don't really have to be smart if you know who is! |
Posted By: TedBuiskerN.IL.
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2011 at 11:39am
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You get a DOT number, you're then in the computer and "They gotcha". May be easy to get now and no problems, but wait a while and they will make life miserable for you eventually. ------------- Most problems can be solved with the proper application of high explosives. |
Posted By: Coke-in-MN
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2011 at 7:27pm
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Strapps are legal or there are sure a lot of loads of lumber, shingles, and other such flat stuf on the roads that do not meet regs.
You might find the type of strap and how it is tensioned might come into question, just like using a come along as a binder will not meet the rules. ------------- Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something. "Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful." |