1934 WC estimated value?
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Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=24237
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Topic: 1934 WC estimated value?
Posted By: Pa.Pete
Subject: 1934 WC estimated value?
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 3:09pm
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I know this is hard to estimate especially without pictures, but all I'm looking for is an estimate.
I looked at a 1934 WC today it has the round spoke wheels 1 front and 1 rear are in real good shape the other rear has some rust pitting and the other front is rusted through on the bead in a couple spots, tires hold air but barely. Engine block has a crack and has been patched poorly, the hood doesn't look rusted but has been hammered out from the inside with ball-peen hammer on one side (could be straightened with a lot of work), no rear fenders and the mounts on top of the axles are broke on both sides. The radiator is in decent shape and has Allis Chalmers embossed on the front but it is made of brass or tin, I was thinking it should be cast I may be wrong. Supposedly it runs good I didn't try to start it as the owner wasn't there and his daughter showed it to us. It did seem to have decent compression though. The serial number does check out to be a 1934.
Again just an educated guess is all I'm looking for.
Thanks in advance for any info ,
Pete |
Replies:
Posted By: Jim Lindemood
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 3:19pm
| Sounds like the correct radiator - don't believe they were cast on WC's. Hard to guess on value. If it really does "run good" -- and they way you described other condition, I would think around $500 would be tops. If it does not run, I'd think hard about taking on this project --- as it would be a project tractor -- can be fun, but the dollars do add up. |
Posted By: StewartMD
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 3:29pm
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I agree with Jim. $500 tops. It costs alot to fix them up but sometimes those projects are the best if you have plenty of time. One thing that I always consider is tires. Tires are expensive these days unless you can find nice used ones. ------------- 8030, 8010, 220, 185, 160, D-17, WD, Unstyled WC, CA, G, 20-35, Gleaner E |
Posted By: Gary in Texas
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 3:31pm
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I had a 36 WC give to me, but tires were shot ($700) the engine is stuck ($???) and the sheet metal is so so.
My guess would be how bad do you want the 34?
Then the price is kind of up to you, but you can spend a lot of money fast.
Myself would stay well under $500...
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Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 3:34pm
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34's didn't have the "Allis Chalmers" on the rad tank That is about the only difference I know of between the 34's and 35's. What is the serial number? If it was WC29 it might be worth a bit more for someone.
------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: 70Standard
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 3:42pm
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I believe my WC is a 1934 and doesn't have "Allis Chalmers" stamped in the top radiator tank and has 24" rear round spokes. I believe it's otherwise similar to later unstyled WC tractors. ------------- Roof Palomino (SN 224), Chetech Pug UTV, Three Green Tractors and one Red Tractor. |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 4:05pm
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70Standard,nice straight looking tractor. Your 34 has the 4 spoked steering wheel and the right rear starter tank. That hood was designed for the Wakeshaw motor set up with the cab on the right side. They must have made a few extra and had to use them up cause they switched the starter tank to the front left later for the Allis motor with the carb on the left side. I have seen a 3 digit serial number WC with the same parts. There might be many more out there??????
------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: Pa.Pete
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 4:34pm
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Thanks for the info every one, I was thinking about $500 tops too, but then when I start adding everything up in my head (tires $800 fenders $400 misc. $200 +?) I think it would be better to look for one that at least has fenders and useable tires. The serial number was 13,xxx. They were asking $1200 - $1300 according to the daughter,
she said they might take a little less and the Father is supposed to call me with his bottom line #. I always hate to insult somebody when I think they are asking too much.
It probally would be worth a little more in parts but I hate to see Old Iron get parted out.
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Posted By: Rfdeere
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 4:48pm
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A serial number above 13,000 would be at the earliest a very late 1935. ------------- Randy Freshour,Member Indiana AC Partners, http://www.rumelyallis.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.rumelyallis.com |
Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 4:58pm
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There was a similar WC for sale near me for $200. $1200 is crazy. Would have to have a Waukesha or a very low serial #.
------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: TedBuiskerN.IL.
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 6:06pm
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Some of the differences in the early 34 WC's were, the smooth radiator, four spoke iron steering wheel, transmission top was different, the fuel tank cover was hinged and had a "T" handle to tighten it. That's all I know of off hand. I know where tractor #120 lives. ------------- Most problems can be solved with the proper application of high explosives. |
Posted By: B26240
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 6:32pm
| 70 standard you have a nice early example WC looks like yours has the suicide clutch foot pedal, you dont see many of those around! |
Posted By: 70Standard
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 7:17pm
I had no idea the foot clutch was anything unusual. I guess a hand clutch was more common?
Dad found this tractor in a barn in central Missouri about 15 years ago. It was complete except for the carb, which the owner had taken off and drained when he parked it, then lost it. I had a local mechanic go through it earlier this year and found a wrist pin groove in one sleeve, but otherwise no problems. I need to get the carb back on - I've never heard it run! ------------- Roof Palomino (SN 224), Chetech Pug UTV, Three Green Tractors and one Red Tractor. |
B26240 wrote:Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 8:01pm
None of the WC's had a hand clutch unless aftermarket. He's referring to the style of the clutch pedal itself I'm pretty sure. Wrist pin scored the sleeve probably because the last one who overhauled it install the wrist pins without the proper offset. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: Pa.Pete
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 8:32pm
Thanks to everyone for the info, you guys are a wealth of knowledge. The guy just called me back and said he would come down to $1150 I said thanks but I think I'll pass.
Pete
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Posted By: Billoh
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 8:47pm
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There are lots of things different in the earley WC.Some other things are base mount mag,cast iron oil pan,no vent in valve cover,one piece crank,gas tank supports bent different,canister type oil filter,17 inch front wheels& some other things I would have to show you. |
Posted By: 1946WP
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 9:55pm
| My 1934 WC is serial # 1934 with engine serial # 1934, It does not say allis chalmers across the radiator , the bottom of the hood is straight, it has a base mount mag & cast iron oil pan.it has all dish type wheels , which I've been told isn't correct. It does run & has a patched cracked block. I gave $200 for it . don't know if if gas tank is different & I don't think mine has an oil filter. I'd have to look again. |
Posted By: MNLonnie
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 10:34pm
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Hey Bruce, that's pretty cool to have matching serial #'s. My 1934 WC #'s are off by 17 (899/916) and mine has the wrong radiator( it has Allis Chalmers on it), the bottom of the hood is straight but I've never noticed if the oil pan is cast or not, it had round spokes front and back but I put full steel on it instead. ------------- Waukesha B, B, IB, G, styled WF, D15, 615 backhoe, 2-Oliver OC3's, 4 Ford Model T's, 3 Model A Fords, AV8 Coupe, AV8 Roadster, 1933 Ford Wrecker |
Posted By: HagerAC
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 11:05pm
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We gave $500 for our '34 WC which was stuck, and had bad tires, but was complete, and was easy to get running. The gas cap should also be larger on the 1934 tractors, as well as no Allis Chalmers name on the radiator, and as bruce said a base mount mag, and a cast oil pan. They should also have a cartridge style filter, but most were converted to spin on. When we restored ours we noticed the wheels had green paint on them, and I have seen one other tractor that was like this. Does anyone know the story behind this, I have talke to some people that have heard of it, but never knew the reasoning. We painted ours black, but we may paint them green someday again. We actually still have the original rear wheels in the shed because we put a different set on the tractor that had a set of 1935 firestones on them. ------------- 30+ A-Cs ranging from a 1928 20-35, to a 1984 8070FWA, Gleaner R52 |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 12:43am
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Pete, Those numbers on YT aren't even close to being right. Look here. http://www.allischalmers.com/serials.html - http://www.allischalmers.com/serials.html Keep in mind, the number posted at this link is the last tractor number produced for the given year. Charlie ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: 1946WP
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 8:01am
| charlie, just looking at that serial # chart I noticed that the WD & WD45 serial #'s overlap. according to the book I have the last WD was # 146606 (1953) & first WD45 was 146607 (1953). yea Lonnie, I didn't know the engine serial # on my 1934 until after I had it home. It don't look like much ,but it's kinda special because its the last tractor my dad drove at 95 yrs old in a parade. he had bought a 1936 brand new. he said it's alright, but it's not as snappy as it should be. |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 9:31am
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WP, yea there is a note below that table with the double * saying the 45 started with 146607. I don't know why the charts over lap but maybe it was easier to add the asterisk than to change the chart. ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: Butch(OH)
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 10:03am
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WC trivia question,
Why is the TOP of the radiators smashed down on 90% of the flat top WCs? I can understand the front for obvious reasons and sides if for no other reason than going in and out of the culitvators,,but why the top?? Always has mystified me.
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Posted By: KenBWisc
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 10:11am
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My '34 is S# 629. I t has features the same as mentioned above by 1946WP except I have both the original and correct cutoff wheels and a full set of steel. My gas in let and cap is larger than '35 and after and has a chain with a t rod on the bottom, correct according to Dave Ferguson. Ted, could the '33's have had the t handle locking cap or is mine wrong? As far as I know mine is original and correct except I don't have the one-piece crank due to my Grandpa and Dad's hired man dozing off while discing and running it through a fence, twice! I'd like to have a one-piece crank if anyone has one laying around. It wasn't original when I inherited it and getting it there cost me way more than it's worth ion the market.
------------- '34 WC #629, '49 G, '49 B, '49 WD, '62 D-19, '38 All Crop 60 and still hunting! |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 10:13am
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Butch, could be when the tractor heats up and water expands it pushes air or water out the cap. When it cools off and everything contracts, with the overflow outside of the pressure cap, the brass tank won't hold up and it collapses. Just a guess on my part but sounds possible. Somebody tell me if I'm all wet here. Charlie
------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 10:21am
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HagerAC, I think Allis had green paint left over from the E series tractors that they wanted to use up. I think the French and Hecht rims came from F&H painted black. When they were dealer installed, they could have been were left black. When they were factory installed they could have been painted green early and Orange later.
------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: JW in MO
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 11:20am
| Charlie, I don't think they hae a pressure cap, my 37 doesn't. I try to imagine the 30's and farming, around here, fields were probably small and the path to them wasn't brush free like nowdays. Also, I can only imagine my grandfathers farm with 6 rowdy boys using the tractor for all sorts of chores from feeding cattle to hauling wood. I'm sure the first dent ended with the involvement of a leather razer strap. |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 1:17pm
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Well maybe it had something to do with learning how to operate a tractor. So many were used to telling the horses what to do and found out that the tractor wouldn't follow the same commands. LOL ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: Pa.Pete
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 3:47pm
I never knew there were so many variables on the early WC's.
Does anybody know why the blocks crack on these motors?
Also what years did they use the Waukesha engine, and does any one have any pictures of one?
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Posted By: rnjmyers@bright.net
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 4:21pm
| On the comment about radiators have dents on the top, I know how the radiator on my dad's 1936 WC got the large sized dents on the top. He had a temper and I saw him ( more than once) take a hammer or a heavy piece metal to beat the crap out of the top of the radiator when the WC would not start or backfired during the cranking process. He probably would have used the crank for this but it was a one piece crank and this may have saved the radiator from total destuction as he cooled down some while looking for something that he educate the old WC. |
Posted By: MNLonnie
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 6:00pm
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Pa Pete, 1933 was the only year for Waukesha WC's, they made 28 of them and I believe only 2 are known to exist. As far as the 1934 serial matching the year, most models should have 1 tractor that does that. U1929, UC1935, WC1934, WF1940, B1938, RC1939, C1941, G1948, WD1948, CA1951, so check your collection for your unique # tractor. Someone out there has a pic of a Waukesha WC from a show. ------------- Waukesha B, B, IB, G, styled WF, D15, 615 backhoe, 2-Oliver OC3's, 4 Ford Model T's, 3 Model A Fords, AV8 Coupe, AV8 Roadster, 1933 Ford Wrecker |
Posted By: Pa.Pete
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 6:13pm
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Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 9:15pm
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You won't find a B, CA, WF, or a WD with matching engine and tractor numbers. B's had the first 97 with a Waukesha engine then went to the BE engine. CA's had a CE engine of which the first 14,000 or so were used in C's and B's and the WF used the 201 which had some 37,000 engines used in the WC before WF production started. WD's also used the 201 engine and the first WD would have an engine number somewhere around 200,000 because of WC's, WF's and power units produced before the WD came out. 45's may be a gray area too because the tractor numbers followed the ending number for the WD's. but had the new 226 engine????????? I also doubt very much there would be a U or UC with matching tractor and engine numbers because of the Continental engine in the first U's and the same UM engine in U's,UC's,power units and M crawlers. Could probably forget the G also since Continental built the engine and probably stamped them with their own identifying number which would not match the Allis tractor number. I don't know about the RC's and how they were numbered so that would leave the WC1934 just about by itself in the matching number quest. ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 9:32pm
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Lavern Greif's 33WC http://lh5.ggpht.com/_0A8SkPvYpV0/TG8HiIHprQI/AAAAAAAAC-Q/tY-e9iF7LVw/Lavern%20Greif%20of%20Dallas%20Center%2C%20IAwaukwc.jpg - http://lh5.ggpht.com/_0A8SkPvYpV0/TG8HiIHprQI/AAAAAAAAC-Q/tY-e9iF7LVw/Lavern Greif of Dallas Center%2C IAwaukwc.jpg Fred Wilke's 33 http://lh3.ggpht.com/_0A8SkPvYpV0/TG8HkfdKbdI/AAAAAAAAC-U/WSAM9QffOmA/s128/Fred%20Wilkes33WC.jpg - http://lh3.ggpht.com/_0A8SkPvYpV0/TG8HkfdKbdI/AAAAAAAAC-U/WSAM9QffOmA/s128/Fred Wilke's33WC.jpg ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: MNLonnie
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 9:40pm
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You are right, there are several possibilities for tractor #'s matching the year but to get all 3 #'s to match, Bruce may have the only Allis that it could be possible on. ------------- Waukesha B, B, IB, G, styled WF, D15, 615 backhoe, 2-Oliver OC3's, 4 Ford Model T's, 3 Model A Fords, AV8 Coupe, AV8 Roadster, 1933 Ford Wrecker |
Posted By: TedBuiskerN.IL.
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2011 at 10:43pm
Norm Meinert's serial #120 has the old style gas cap with the T handle, when they changed to the newer style? I don't know. ------------- Most problems can be solved with the proper application of high explosives. |
Posted By: 1946WP
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2011 at 7:48am
| lonnie & charlie , thats why the patched block engine is staying in it. |
Posted By: Pa.Pete
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2011 at 8:27am
I think I would keep it in there too. Can anybody tell me why these blocks are prone to cracking, is it just a weak spot, and is that why they cast the rib down the side of the 226 block?
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Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2011 at 9:00am
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Pete, the blocks were prone to crack because people were prone to put water in as a coolant and not draining it before it froze. I doubt there ever was one cracked that didn't have frozen water in it. ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: David Maddux
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2011 at 10:38am
| Butch: I have also been told about the bashed in radiator tops, being from irate people having a hard time geting them to start. I was also at the understanding that the late model 34's had the name on the radiator. Dave. |