D17 spindle support tube length?
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Topic: D17 spindle support tube length?
Posted By: ChuckLuedtkeSEWI
Subject: D17 spindle support tube length?
Date Posted: 17 Dec 2010 at 5:16pm
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Found a good D17 spindle support tube from Neil from Northside Salvage. Talked to him on Tuesday and I got it already today which was awesome so hopefully if some bushings I ordered show up as fast, I can get the front end back together this weekend. Question is the tube that I got from Neil is a little worn on the bottom but so is the tube on the other side and none of the thrust washers were left in either side of my front end when I dismantled it. So, does anyone have the specs on how long the tube should be? I have one that is 9 3/4 from top to bottom and the other is 9 5/8". If I'm gonna spend the time to build them back up, it would be nice to know what they were originally. I guess I could wait until I get the thrust washers so I can put them on the base of the spindle and then put one together and see how much slack I got, but if someone has the number of what they should be I can get a head start and have them all built up before my bushings and thrust washers show up. Thanks for any help. ------------- 1955 WD45 diesel 203322 was my dad's tractor, 1966 D15 23530, 1961 HD3 Crawler 1918, 1966 D17 IV 83495, 1937 WC 41255, 1962 D19 6221 |
Replies:
Posted By: Skyhighballoon(MO)
Date Posted: 17 Dec 2010 at 5:27pm
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Chuck - l don't have measurements but let me tell you my experience in this area. When I started work in late 2004 on restoring my D17 Series IV (later 65 model with 5 bolt hubs), I'd planned to replace both spindles as one had the threads on the end ruined and wouldn't hold the nut on any more. I bought a set of new spindles from a reputable dealer (Cook Tractor in Clinton, MO). When my tractor mechanic went to mount them the new spindles were too long for the spindle support tubes. He said he could have shimmed them up with multiple thrust washers but he said multiple washers would break up fairly soon and I'd have a mess. Now let it be known that the original slightly shorter spindles fit fine so it was not a case of the support tube getting worn down. So I believe there were two different size support tubes and spindles....but have no proof other than my singular experience with my tractor. I took the spindles back and the one "bad" one went to a machine shop to get the threads repaired instead. Mike
------------- 1981 Gleaner F2 Corn Plus w 13' flex 1968 Gleaner EIII w 10' & 330 1969 180 gas 1965 D17 S-IV gas 1963 D17 S-III gas 1956 WD45 gas NF PS 1956 All-Crop 66 Big Bin 303 wire baler, 716H, 712H mowers |
Posted By: Gatz in NE
Date Posted: 17 Dec 2010 at 5:33pm
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Mike,
You may have gotten ahold of spindles from a D19. They're the same except for the spindle length. I had seen these while looking for replacements for my D17SerIV.
I ended up cutting out the old spindles and using ETD150 alloy to make new. Made it about .002 interfernce fit to the bottom forging, heated the forging up and slipped them together. Welded while still hot. Soaked in oil-dry overnight. Cut the keyways last.
Gatz
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Posted By: ChuckLuedtkeSEWI
Date Posted: 17 Dec 2010 at 5:36pm
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Thanks for the info Mike. At least the two spindles that I am using are in good shape, so I didn't have that to deal with. I just want to make sure that this whole thing is sound as I am putting a loader on it and I want things to hold up for good. I should also ask you this. Did you notice on your front end that the front pivot pin could go further into the front support? I have about a 1/2 that the pivot could go in more if I wanted to but that would mean I would either have to build a spacer up for behind the back pivot bracket or put washers between the rear bracket and the rear pivot point to essentially move the wide front forward. I figure the more the front pin is in that front pivot bushing, the better off I am and the longer things will hold up to wear and abuse. My wide front does have a new bushing in there and the pin is in really good shape and not worn or eggshaped. ------------- 1955 WD45 diesel 203322 was my dad's tractor, 1966 D15 23530, 1961 HD3 Crawler 1918, 1966 D17 IV 83495, 1937 WC 41255, 1962 D19 6221 |
Posted By: ChuckLuedtkeSEWI
Date Posted: 17 Dec 2010 at 5:40pm
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Gatz, I believe you did the same thing on your wide front spacing it forward. Just wanted to see if anyone else came across this. I might make a spacer for the back as well this weekend, especially if I don't get my bushings in tomorrow's mail. ------------- 1955 WD45 diesel 203322 was my dad's tractor, 1966 D15 23530, 1961 HD3 Crawler 1918, 1966 D17 IV 83495, 1937 WC 41255, 1962 D19 6221 |
Posted By: Skyhighballoon(MO)
Date Posted: 17 Dec 2010 at 6:05pm
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Chuck - Tracy Martin makes new front pivot pins if you want to go that route and cut yours off and weld a new longer on on. My Series IV needs the front pivot fixed and I plan to go that route on mine. I haven't look to see how bad it is in the casting and if it's egged out But I have an almost perfect spare casting with no apparent wear in the bushing in case it is bad. Mike
------------- 1981 Gleaner F2 Corn Plus w 13' flex 1968 Gleaner EIII w 10' & 330 1969 180 gas 1965 D17 S-IV gas 1963 D17 S-III gas 1956 WD45 gas NF PS 1956 All-Crop 66 Big Bin 303 wire baler, 716H, 712H mowers |
Posted By: Tracy Martin TN
Date Posted: 17 Dec 2010 at 7:23pm
| Making the pivot pin longer is best fix. When doing so you will probably have to loosen front support to install wide front end. The factory pin is short enough to allow attaching front end with support bolted to tractor. If you lenghten pin, it must be installed together. It will give a much larger area of bearing surface though. I make my pins from chromed case hardened shafting. Works great. HTH Tracy Martin |
Posted By: Tracy Martin TN
Date Posted: 17 Dec 2010 at 7:27pm
| Also on the washers. They came with two each side. It really helps to keep wear down by using them.I make the tubes from 8620 alloy. Works great. HTH Tracy Martin |
Posted By: ChuckLuedtkeSEWI
Date Posted: 17 Dec 2010 at 9:10pm
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That makes sense as to why they made it that way for installation, but wouldn't it work just as good to make a spacer to space the rear mounting bracket forward? Or am I messing up some geometry somewhere. The pin on mine is like brand new and if I remember, the bushing that is in it is only so long. I guess I am trying to avoid using a new pin and a longer bushing as the ones I have are like brand new. ------------- 1955 WD45 diesel 203322 was my dad's tractor, 1966 D15 23530, 1961 HD3 Crawler 1918, 1966 D17 IV 83495, 1937 WC 41255, 1962 D19 6221 |
Posted By: Gatz in NE
Date Posted: 17 Dec 2010 at 10:01pm
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Chuck
There's a recess in the casting that is deeper than the bushing is long; the pivot pin will go farther in than the bushing. The bushing bottoms out on a larger bore. This is so it can be removed. (Had to make a special threaded slug and a slide hammer to get mine out)
Exactly how much room there is, I don't know, but you can measure it with a scale when it's apart.
Making a spacer at the rear won't affect the geometry.
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Posted By: Tracy Martin TN
Date Posted: 17 Dec 2010 at 11:05pm
| Chuck, and to others watching this thread. While your wfe is bolted to tractor properly, with rear pivot in correct position. Measure the distance you have between front support and wfe tube. When disassembled, the distance you measured from front support to tube,plus the depth of hole in front support casting(where bushing goes), less at least 1/8 inch would be maximum length of pin protruding in front of tube, this does not take into account,the lenght required to weld to tube. It will be a great bit longer than factory, it will increase bearing surface, but will require assembling wfe and front support as a unit.Hope this helps out some. Tracy Martin |
Posted By: Chris/CT
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2010 at 7:15am
Interesting post, latching on to the thread for input. Here is tube/spindle on my 175, pretty sure these spindle/tube assy are not correct, anyone have any thoughts?
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Posted By: Steve M C/IL
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2010 at 12:02pm
| I'd say wrong spindle.Too bad folks put in wrong stuff and say "Oh well." |
Posted By: Dave H
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2010 at 5:21pm
| chuck, that is the way I had it figured, so I make spacers for the rear mount to move the pivot pin farther forward into the bushing area. |
Posted By: Jess
Date Posted: 21 Dec 2010 at 8:33am
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Chuck if you are puting a loader on i would consider puting gusets on the spindle tube like a D19 I have seen many broke on 17 but very few on 19 just a thought Jess |