Print Page | Close Window

B-125 Cam Events

Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=205529
Printed Date: 21 Feb 2025 at 11:38pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: B-125 Cam Events
Posted By: Les Kerf
Subject: B-125 Cam Events
Date Posted: 19 Feb 2025 at 6:43pm
I did a mapping of the camshaft timing events on my well-worn Model B-125 Power Unit that came off my Allis-Chalmers Model 60 Combine. I purchased this combine from my neighbor about 40 years ago, and I saw it sitting in his barnyard for about 10 years prior to that. I did observe this combine running in their field combining oats about 50 years ago. I do not believe it has run since then, definitely not since I have owned it.

The engine was stuck when I pulled it from the combine this winter; I removed the head and got it un-stuck, it now rotates freely. The head shows evidence of a prior valve job of questionable quality as the valves are sitting at various depths. I suspect the exhaust valves were replaced as they do not appear to have been ground, but the intakes are all rather thin at the margins.

The main point being, this is NOT a pristine engine. The #1 Exhaust lobe measures about 0.013" less lift than the others. The valve events are all over the place as well. I ran the cam around at least twice on each lobe and got the same readings, therefore I believe them to be reliable. So be it. I intend to run it as-is anyway when I get the head back on.

One interesting observation is the fact that the 0.050" closing point on #1 and #4  Intake are identical at 28 Degrees ABDC and their Net duration is the same at 186 Degrees.

Likewise, the 0.050" #2 and #3 Intake closing points are the same at 23 Degrees ABDC and they both have Net Durations of 180 Degrees.

Is this just a bizarre coincidence, or did Allis-Chalmers actually go to the trouble of designing a camshaft with different patterns to compensate for the weird firing order of their engines which causes disruptions in the induction system due to the overlap events?

Allis-Chalmers Power Unit Model B-125
S/N 72128 B

#1 Exhaust
0.010“  Open @ 30 BBDC     0.237“ Lift
0.010“  Close @ 10 ATDC      Gross Duration 220

0.050“  Open @ 9   ABDC
0.050“  Close @ 11 BTDC     Net Duration 182


#1 Intake
0.010“  Open  @ 2  ATDC     0.250“ Lift
0.010“  Close  @ 26 ABDC    Gross Duration 204

0.050“  Open  @ 22 ATDC
0.050“  Close  @ 28 ABDC    Net Duration  186


#2 Intake
0.010“  Open @   4  ATDC     0.249“ Lift
0.010“  Close @  39 ABDC     Gross Duration 215

0.050“  Open @  23 ATDC
0.050“  Close @  23 ABDC     Net Duration 180

#2 Exhaust
0.010“  Open @ 37  BBDC     0.251“ Lift
0.010“  Close @ 13  ATDC      Gross Duration 230

0.050“  Open @ 17  BBDC
0.050“  Close @ 8    BTDC      Net Duration   189


#3 Exhaust
0.010“  Open @ 34  BBDC     0.249 Lift
0.010“  Close @ 9    ATDC     Gross Duration 223

0.050“  Open @ 15 BBDC
0.050“  Close @ 9   BTDC     Net Duration 186


#3 Intake
0.010“  Open @ 3  ATDC      0.250“ Lift
0.010“  Close @ 44 ABDC     Gross Duration 221

0.050“  Open @ 23 ATDC
0.050“  Close @ 23 ABDC     Net Duration 180

#4 Intake
0.010“  Open @  3  ATDC      0.249“ Lift
0.010“  Close @ 44 ABDC      Gross Duration 221

0.050“  Open @  22 ATDC
0.050“  Close @  28 ABDC     Net Duration  186


#4 Exhaust
0.010“  Open @ 32 BBDC      0.250“ Lift
0.010“  Close @ 8   ATDC       Gross Duration  220

0.050“  Open @ 10 BBDC
0.050“  Close @ 12 BTDC      Net Duration  178







Replies:
Posted By: Sugarmaker
Date Posted: 19 Feb 2025 at 8:12pm
Les,
Really nice data on your combine engine. I can now almost relate. On my CA engine my guess is that the old cam would have worked just fine for me.
Good luck. Do you have a plan for your engine?
Regards,
 Chris and Cheryl


-------------
D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.


Posted By: Les Kerf
Date Posted: 20 Feb 2025 at 9:39am
Originally posted by Sugarmaker Sugarmaker wrote:

... Do you have a plan for your engine?...

Yes, I plan to install it on a derelict Model C that a dear neighbor and old family friend once owned. This will be a LOW budget project, mostly a labor of love.

I was hoping that someone with more knowledge of these engines would chime in with some further insight on the apparent anomaly in the cam timing.

Both end cylinders have shorter net exhaust duration and longer net intake duration.

Both middle cylinders have longer net exhaust duration and shorter net intake duration.

It is difficult for me to believe that this is not by design and merely an accident from wear.


Posted By: NEVER green
Date Posted: 21 Feb 2025 at 7:40am
  My guess it a coincidence of wear, I cant imagine AC would have taken the time or money for R&D on a mass produced engine.

  Like several on here I am disappointed AC never changed the cam on its 426 since its inception. 


-------------
2-8050 1-7080 6080 D-19 modelE & A 7040   R50       


Posted By: steve(ill)
Date Posted: 21 Feb 2025 at 8:21am
the numbers Les measured dont seem to show much wear.. LIFT is all very close... Hard to tell if it was really DESIGNED that way... or the manufacturer just had an OOPS in the setup... Maybe happened and not really designed ?  ... Dont think the COST would be any different once the setup is done..

-------------
Like them all, but love the "B"s.



Print Page | Close Window

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Copyright ©2001-2017 Web Wiz Ltd. - https://www.webwiz.net