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D15 stops running?

Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=200016
Printed Date: 04 Dec 2024 at 9:59pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: D15 stops running?
Posted By: modirt
Subject: D15 stops running?
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2024 at 5:17pm
So been wrestling with this issue since last fall.........hard time sorting it out.

So tractor will start and run.......backed it out and was allowing it to warm up while I hooked it to a mower.........while sitting there idling.......it coasts to a stop and dies. May or may not start again until it either cools down or rests. Sometimes full choke helps get it going......while warm?......but push in choke and it dies.

All that is with fuel tank showing 1/4 full. Dump in 5 gallons and all that goes away. Starts and runs normal. That tells me more fuel = more head pressure to force fuel down thru the hoses and filters........which seem to run fast or slow.......but run. But all fuel lines are new. Hoses, fuel filter, clean sediment bowl and screen and no sediment in the tank. Normally it runs a full stream. Normally I'd think as long as tank has fuel, it wold run. When it quit running today it was slightly downhill, so what fuel there was in there was over the drain. It was not empty.

Any chance something is off in the carb? Like a float or something?



Replies:
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2024 at 5:26pm
More gas ALWAYS fixes the problem ??? Sounds to me like someone has a "stand pipe" threaded into the sediment bowl inlet to not empty all the gas out of the tank. Your rubber fuel rubber is in a straight line?? without a droop ??


Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2024 at 5:38pm
Don't think there is a stand pipe in the tank. No sediment and no "bean" or whatever it is that accumulates in there to block the hole.

The fuel lines may "droop" an inch or so below the fuel fitting on the carb. This is same setup it has had since I took over and it never did this before.

The odd thing is when fuel gets down to about 1/4 tank.......it runs at idle......then just dies and will not start again until it cools down. But will then start again. That may be time to cool down or it may be time for fuel to fill carb bowl again. Something not right about a gas engine that when warm will start and run with choke, but dies when choke is off.


Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2024 at 5:42pm
BTW, if I disconnect the fuel line and dump it into a gas can, I can drain the tank empty. It will run a stream doing that until tank is dry.


Posted By: BobPaulusCentrOH
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2024 at 5:46pm
I had a problem similar to yours on a D14.  About drove me crazy until the sediment bowl assembly off and looked down in the hole at a timothy head in opening.  Had a problem with my D15 Series 2 running and stopping when too rich.  Bad carb float.
The little gremlins will drive you crazy.  I would take hose loose from carb, open sediment bowl petcock and drain tank into a gas can.  Then take sediment bowl assembly off, and check it over.  Also check tank for dirt.
Good Luck,
Bob


Posted By: BrianC
Date Posted: 27 Feb 2024 at 7:42pm
Good that you checked the flow out of the tank and it was good.
I suggest doing a similar test: put the measured 5 gallons back in the tank.
Remove the drain plug at bottom of carb, let it run out and collect.
Start a timer on the drain.  The 5 gallons should all drain in 75 minutes or less.
This lets you know that the float and needle valve have the capacity to support
your 40hp class gas engine. 
Unless the float setting is way off, there must be be an obstruction ("mo'dirt") in the main jet circuit. OR in the elbow passage just above the needle.

Running better with the choke means you are restricting air supply, which means the carb is not passing enough gasoline. Cutting air betters the air fuel ratio and it runs better. If your fuel is contaminated with a high concentration of diesel, you could have similar symptoms. That's all I know.


Posted By: DiyDave
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2024 at 4:40am
Also check the choke shaft air seals, if they are leaking air, pulling the choke a little corrects the problem, for a while...Wink

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Source: Babylon Bee. Sponsored by BRAWNDO, its got what you need!


Posted By: PaulB
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2024 at 6:26am
Just for giggles, leave the gas cap loose and see if the problem goes away. I've encountered some gas caps that don't have proper venting and will not allow air in to replace the gas that drains out creating a vacuum. 

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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY


Posted By: coggonobrien
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2024 at 7:48am
the newer carb floats stick sometimes.  tap the bowl a couple times with something hard and see if it takes off.


Posted By: Dennis J OPKs
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2024 at 9:18am
If it's not a fuel problem?  I have a WD 45 and it would cut out & die in exactly the same spot every time.  Turned out to be bad battery connections, I don't remember if it was + or - and it doesn't really matter.  Hope you get it isolated.


Posted By: Steve in NJ
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2024 at 9:33am
You have a fuel delivery issue somewhere there. I remember the story about the dead bumblebee floating around in the tank and every once in a while it would block the outlet to the sediment bowl and shut down the Tractor.  Wait a little, Tractor fires up and runs again for a short period of time and shuts off again.  Goofy stuff happens. And you wonder, how did that damn Bumblebee get in there!!  Wacko
Steve@B&B



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39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife


Posted By: nella(Pa)
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2024 at 10:41am
Originally posted by Steve in NJ Steve in NJ wrote:

You have a fuel delivery issue somewhere there. I remember the story about the dead bumblebee floating around in the tank and every once in a while it would block the outlet to the sediment bowl and shut down the Tractor.  Wait a little, Tractor fires up and runs again for a short period of time and shuts off again.  Goofy stuff happens. And you wonder, how did that damn Bumblebee get in there!!  Wacko
Steve@B&B



I have had wasps in my D17 gas tank blocking the gas discharge from the tank, and the only way i could think of was they went into the gas nozzle of the hose on the storage tank and when I put gas in the tractor in the insect went with the gas.


Posted By: JK in Pa
Date Posted: 28 Feb 2024 at 12:29pm
You mentioned “filters”. If you have an automotive inline filter get rid of it! BTDT.


Posted By: WF owner
Date Posted: 29 Feb 2024 at 6:41am
Originally posted by JK in Pa JK in Pa wrote:

You mentioned “filters”. If you have an automotive inline filter get rid of it! BTDT.

That would be great in a perfect world, but in reality, a lot of these old tractors have some loose rust in the gas tanks, that can't be easily cleaned. It's a lot easier to change a fuel filter than it is to clean a carburetor.

There are a lot of old tractors with some sort of added fuel filter.


Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 29 Feb 2024 at 8:37am
I included a NAPA inline metal fuel filter between sediment bowl and carb. When you disconnect the fuel line, it runs a full stream. That has been on there since I took over stewardship and has never caused an issue before. Have baled hay with it running at RPM engine speed and never missed a lick.

Will look hard to see if there is something floating in fuel tank. Have looked before, but will look again. If nothing still, I"m considering pulling the carb to have it rebuilt or gone over. Did that about 6 years ago.

BTW, normal practice when I put her in the barn for any period of time is to shut off the fuel at the sediment bowl and let her run it dry. Stored with no fuel in carb.


Posted By: IBWD MIke
Date Posted: 29 Feb 2024 at 8:49am
Originally posted by nella(Pa) nella(Pa) wrote:

Originally posted by Steve in NJ Steve in NJ wrote:

You have a fuel delivery issue somewhere there. I remember the story about the dead bumblebee floating around in the tank and every once in a while it would block the outlet to the sediment bowl and shut down the Tractor.  Wait a little, Tractor fires up and runs again for a short period of time and shuts off again.  Goofy stuff happens. And you wonder, how did that damn Bumblebee get in there!!  Wacko
Steve@B&B



I have had wasps in my D17 gas tank blocking the gas discharge from the tank, and the only way i could think of was they went into the gas nozzle of the hose on the storage tank and when I put gas in the tractor in the insect went with the gas.
I'll bet you're right! I try to look in the nozzle before fueling anything.


Posted By: DSeries4
Date Posted: 29 Feb 2024 at 3:03pm
Originally posted by WF owner WF owner wrote:

Originally posted by JK in Pa JK in Pa wrote:

You mentioned “filters”. If you have an automotive inline filter get rid of it! BTDT.

That would be great in a perfect world, but in reality, a lot of these old tractors have some loose rust in the gas tanks, that can't be easily cleaned. It's a lot easier to change a fuel filter than it is to clean a carburetor.

There are a lot of old tractors with some sort of added fuel filter.


Do a good clean out on the fuel tank and the problem goes away.  Have done all of mine.  No inline filter, sediment bowl is clean as a whistle, no stand pipes, no running issues.

An inline filter masks the problem, it does not eliminate it.


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'49 G, '54 WD45, '55 CA, '56 WD45D, '57 WD45, '58 D14, '59 D14, '60 D14, '61 D15D, '66 D15II, '66 D21II, '67 D17IV, '67 D17IVD, '67 190XTD, '73 620, '76 185, '77 175, '84 8030, '85 6080


Posted By: steve(ill)
Date Posted: 29 Feb 2024 at 6:14pm
Nothing wrong with an inline filter.. Good idea on almost every engine... You just need to make sure it is a GRAVITY FLOW type with no restriction.. ( you said you have full flow thru it)... There are SOME filters that have  1-2 psi restriction internal that can stop the flow or restrict it on a GRAVITY FEED system... Those type need a FUEL PUMP.

As steve said... it dies with a 1/4 tank and runs fine with 5 gallons.. You have a FUEL FLOW PROBLEM... You would not expect to see the above in the carburetor.. You would expect it to be in the sediment bowl / stand tube / feed hose... Once it is in the carburetor bowl, it should make no difference what the tank level is.


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Like them all, but love the "B"s.


Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2024 at 7:51am
The scenario of an inline fuel filter with a psi requirement that might prevent flow when tank is low, but works when tank is 1/4 tank or more makes sense and is consistent with the behavior. Don't remember seeing any specs to outline psi or none on the box the filter came in.......but may still have that box......or one like it.

If there is an option for gravity flow only inline filter, can try that.  As far as I know, fill cap is original. But can try that too. Almost certain tank is clean and free of any debris or sediment. That was the first thing I checked.

If something off in the carb, would think it would never run right.


Posted By: rasman57
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2024 at 8:09am
Originally posted by modirt modirt wrote:

BTW, if I disconnect the fuel line and dump it into a gas can, I can drain the tank empty. It will run a stream doing that until tank is dry.

Disconnect from where?   After the bowl assembly or right from the tank? After the filter?  If you eliminate potential blockage spots one at a time you may be able to at least narrow down your suspected areas if fuel flow is your thought.

I had a tiny piece of thread sealer that was creating issues with my carb float and needle. It was a tiny string like piece that would spiral/float and then get caught..  quite the interesting  find.  

Good luck!


Posted By: Straanger
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2024 at 2:14pm
Go out and look in the tank after dark with a flashlight ( no other light sources ). If there is anything in there, you’ll see it.


Posted By: AllisFreak MN
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2024 at 7:29pm
The Doctor has stressed on here time and time again, take the sediment bowl off, fully open the petcock and you should have TWO STREAMS of fuel. If not you have a restriction in the tank or in the valve assembly. 

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'49 A-C WD, '51 A-C WD, '63 A-C D17 Series III, 1968 A-C One-Seventy, '82 A-C 6060, '75 A-C 7040, A-C #3 sickle mower, 2 A-C 701 wagons, '78 Gleaner M2



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