653 Steering Clutch Drive Shaft
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Construction and other equipment
Forum Description: everything else with orange (or yellow) paint
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=164318
Printed Date: 23 Nov 2024 at 1:08am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: 653 Steering Clutch Drive Shaft
Posted By: 2206rick
Subject: 653 Steering Clutch Drive Shaft
Date Posted: 13 Sep 2019 at 5:02pm
I am looking for some wisdom on removing a steering clutch drive shaft.
I have already removed the right hand side without difficulty. On the left hand side I have tried several penetrating oils, heat and many different hammers and punches in the hole in the spline. I made a collar that secures to the shaft and have placed a wedge behind it with no luck. Short of cutting the shaft, because of all of the disassembly required to put a new one back in, does anyone have a suggestion?
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Replies:
Posted By: Randaleky
Date Posted: 15 Sep 2019 at 2:56pm
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are you talking about the drive shaft to the clutches that has the clip in the hub ?
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Posted By: 2206rick
Date Posted: 15 Sep 2019 at 3:53pm
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Yes that is the one. It has a spline on both ends and slides into the differential to remove the steering clutch pack.
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Posted By: pinball
Date Posted: 15 Sep 2019 at 6:47pm
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do you have the steering clutch and brake band removed and the clip pin unpinned.
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Posted By: Randaleky
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2019 at 1:10pm
Are you telling us that the drive shaft is stuck in the rear end and the clutch pack and brake band have been pulled out ?
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Posted By: Randaleky
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2019 at 1:17pm
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also, if the splined shaft moves as far as possible toward the final outer housing and will not clear the seal at the point between the rear end and the final drive housing , then it is either hung up on the seal or the gearing in the differential. may need to pull the rear differential cover to discover what is hanging the shaft up .
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Posted By: 2206rick
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2019 at 3:36pm
It is stuck in the steering pack. It will move on the differential side the little bit that it can with the steering pack stuck to it. The clip has been removed. I have already removed the right side so I am familiar with the removal process.
I am almost at the point of cutting the shaft and removing the clutch pack and dealing with those consequences.
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Posted By: pinball
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2019 at 10:16pm
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sounds as though you cant get the shaft to move back enough to get the clutch pack out. sounds like either you have a burr probably around where that pin was or something broke off the pin and is caught in there. if you have a small magnet you might see if you can get anything out with it. you might also try stp as its a very good lubricant. one man prying with a large pry bar against the shaft and another man try to rotate the clutch pack back and forth might work. I could be wrong but with all the movement it gets when in use I just cant see it being froze to the shaft. really does sound like a mess. I think those shafts are pretty pricey. I have never been inside the tranny. don't know maybe something isn't lining up properly in there to let the shaft to go in far enough. good luck and hope you find the problem.
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Posted By: Big Jim
Date Posted: 16 Sep 2019 at 11:45pm
I had this problem with a 653 of my. The thing that was wrong was the collar
that the throw-out bearing slides on was bent. Try getting the bolts of this.
I cut good axle to find this was my problem.
Jim
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Posted By: pinball
Date Posted: 22 Sep 2019 at 7:16pm
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did you get your shaft out.
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Posted By: Big Jim
Date Posted: 22 Sep 2019 at 9:31pm
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Yes it slid out once the bind on the axle was removed.
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Posted By: 2206rick
Date Posted: 23 Sep 2019 at 5:57am
I got the axel out this weekend after I cut it with a torch. Once I removed the clutch assembly I was able to remove the cut off piece with a hammer and punch. It appears that it was stuck with corrosion. There were no burrs or excessive wear.
This machine had evidentially been sitting for a very long time. I now believe that had I moved it back and forth aggressively it may have broken up the rust and allowed the shaft to slide out.
Now comes the further disassembly to install a new shaft.
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Posted By: pinball
Date Posted: 23 Sep 2019 at 7:11am
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should have, would have. we all have been there. glad your on the way to fixing it. These old machines some times can really be a bugger. have a good day. norm
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Posted By: 2206rick
Date Posted: 24 Sep 2019 at 4:29am
I am looking for some more guidance on installing the new drive shaft. The old drive shaft, even with the end cut off of it, will not come out of the clutch shifter sleeve assembly that the throwout bearing slides on. Has anyone ever removed that sleeve assembly? Once the sleeve assembly is out can you remove the drive shaft? Or do you have to remove the pinion shaft from the final drive and slide the drive shaft in through the hole that the pinion shaft was in?
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Posted By: Randaleky
Date Posted: 25 Sep 2019 at 9:27pm
some pics would help to explain the process. There are three small bolts that hold the carrier containing the drive shaft and throw out bearing. this may let you see the problem when it is slid to the pinion where the clutches were bolted to.
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Posted By: Randaleky
Date Posted: 25 Sep 2019 at 9:30pm
I believe the pinion will need to be removed to give enough room to put new shaft into the differential .
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Posted By: Tracy Martin TN
Date Posted: 25 Sep 2019 at 10:01pm
On the sleeve assembly, I took a piece of rope and polished the grime off of sleeve. It then would let the clutch and brake assembly out without resistance. HTH Tracy
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No greater gift than healthy grandkids!
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Posted By: 2206rick
Date Posted: 25 Sep 2019 at 10:04pm
Last night I removed the 3 bolts that hold the clutch shifter sleeve assembly (the tube the throwout slides on) and wiggled it out. Once this was loose I was able to remove the sleeve with the drive shaft slid inside it.
The job should be complete this weekend. If anyone has questions about steering clutch replacement let me know. I probably ran into that problem.
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Posted By: pinball
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2019 at 6:25am
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just look at like this. you have gained a lot of knowledge and that's a good thing. the bad thing is all them bad words you used while learning that knowledge. I remember replacing my first steering clutch. got a lot of help on here. very rewarding to get the job done. good to see your on the way back to getting it run again. have a good day. norm in missouri
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Posted By: 2206rick
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2019 at 7:34am
The machine is now running and turning right and left. Some thoughts at the end of the job are:
If the drive shaft is stuck try vigorously going from forward to reverse to break up the corrosion.
If that doesn’t work find a replacement and cut the shaft. Everything else is a waste of time. There is no way to push it out. It can only be done by levering on the shallow hole on the shaft.
Have a torch ready. You will need lots of heat for a machine that has been sitting.
When setting up the clutch pack align the lock hole in an open spot. This will make locking the shaft easier.
When installing the tube that the throwout bearing slides on tighten the 3 bolts evenly. If not aligning and installing the drive shaft may be difficult.
If the shaft holding the throwout bearing fork is rusted in place use a thin cutoff wheel and cut it out in between it and the casting pivot points. They are fragile and will break ( broken from a previous replacement).
When replacing the brake return spring run the pull wire through one of the front cover holes and use a lever to pull it up. This is a 2 person job.
Rick in MA
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Posted By: pinball
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2019 at 8:00am
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Man look at all that knowledge you learned and didn't have to pay anyone to teach you that. congratulations on completing your job. Well done
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Posted By: Randaleky
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2019 at 9:36am
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congratulations . Now you will be able to help others with the vast knowledge you have obtained .
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