D15 Revival
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=152203
Printed Date: 22 Nov 2024 at 7:37am Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: D15 Revival
Posted By: modirt
Subject: D15 Revival
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 12:10pm
New member and first time poster.
Have potentially been presented with a FREE D15.
History is tractor was running when it was parked, and hasn't moved since. Exact time it has sat is unknown, but best guess is 15 years +/-.
Had new tires on it when parked, but fronts are flat and cracked nearly through. Backs are low, and cracked, but may still be usable.
Initial check, throttle and choke are locked up tight and won't move. Have not budged the tractor to see if engine will turn over. I checked the oil and it only had oil on the dipstick.....no water so that was promising.
I am not looking to go into a big restoration project, but would love to have the tractor as a user if I can get it running.
So my question is, what are the steps to get this going?
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Replies:
Posted By: Allis-Chalmers Damon
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 12:34pm
Wow congrats on that find! The tractor looks in pretty good shape overall. The first few things I would do would be drain all gas and fuel lines, get a carb rebuild kit, fresh oil change, new plugs and wires (maybe rotor and cap as well), and possibly a new muffler as that one looks really rusted. The tires might be in ok shape, I am running my D14 with a few cracks here and there and have not had any problems.
I am sure I am missing a few things but if it ran when parked, I don't see any reason why it won't turn over and fire up.
------------- 1955 WD45 Diesel, 1959 D14, All-Crop Drill, 2015 John Deere 5075e, New Holland 279 Haybine, New Holland 575 square baler, New Holland 1032 Stackliner, 10ft Industrias Disc, 6ft Titan grapple
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Posted By: Jim Hancock
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 12:46pm
Hi Modirt! Welcome to the forum! First, pull and check the plugs for any carbon buildup and clean. Squirt a cup or so of ATF fluid into the cylinders to avoid a dry start up. You can change the oil either before or after you get it started - up to you. Just need to find out if it will fire yet, or not, after these preliminaries. Was the oil clean when you checked the dipstick? If not, I'd change it and the filter. Carefully unscrew the oil pan drain plug just enough to see if you get water run out to verify that there's not any water in the bottom. If oil, screw back in, unless it needs changed due to all of the dirt settled in the bottom. Check the fluid levels of the tranny and hydraulics - add as needed - after you get the engine running. Drain the gas tank and put in new and check for flow at the carb. There may be a screen disc above the sediment bowl on the bottom of the gas tank that will probably need cleaned up. You will probably have to pull the carb for a new kit in it if it doesn't get gas up to the cylinders. I'd add a can of Seafoam or Chemtool B12 to the gas to get into the carb to start cleaning it out. You "might" not have to "kit" it yet. Pull distributor cap and check for and/or clean corrosion off the points. Replace with new points and condensor if no fire. You may or may not need a new coil, distributor cap, rotor bug, plug wires just from age and any deterioration from sitting so long. Check the air filter to see how "plugged" it is. Replace if needed. While hood is off, pull the valve cover and pour some ATF over the valves to let it run down the stems to avoid a dry start up. Check fluid level in the radiator. Add as needed to just cover the cores, which one finger length and just touch the coolant is about right. Otherwise, if these are like other tractors of this era, fill to the neck and it'll overflow when the engine heats up. Install battery and bump the starter while watching for valve movement, or not. This will get you enough info to see where to go, if it sputters and/or starts, or not.
Where 'bouts in Mo. are you located? My hometown is Carthage in the sw corner just east of Joplin.
Again, welcome aboard!
------------- How blessed we are by HIS GRACE!
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Posted By: Jim Hancock
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 1:12pm
Check the throttle linkages and get them lubed up loosened up and working first before starting on the engine stuff. No sense in getting the engine going until you can control it's speed. Pull the drain plug on the bottom of the carb and get your fresh gas flowing out of it there. It'll drain any old gas and/or water out and hopefully flush any tiny bits of rust out. If it doesn't flow, the needle valve and/or float may be stuck. Very gently tap the carb to see if that will unstick them and get the gas flowing through it. If not, rebuild the carb.
------------- How blessed we are by HIS GRACE!
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 1:24pm
Thanks for the quick responses and help! I've only been driving tractors for close to 55 years, but that is only driving and maintaining them. I've never tried to bring one like this back from the dead, although my first car was an unused John Deere B. But it had only been parked for a year or so. It only needed clean fuel to start.
Yes, my first instinct was to make no attempt at turning the engine over.....at least by using any force, until I knew if engine was locked up / frozen. Figured I should pull the plugs and squirt something in the cylinders......wasn't sure what. I might have used a bit of diesel fuel. But ATF will work and I can see about pulling the valve cover too.
Is there a way to turn the engine over by hand or is it going to require more force, like the starter? Am resisting temptation to get it rolling and pop the clutch. That would be an easy to to do a lot of damage in a hurry. The PTO is shifting in and out. No belt drive wheel or flywheel I can see.
I don't think it has any fuel in it.....may have all leaked out. Will check coolant, but I don't think there is any there either. Looked to me like a nest of some type behind the radiator where the fan blades might hit it. Will dig that out before touching anything.
At the least, muffler needs to come off to be cleaned out. Has a mud daubber nest sticking out the top as is.
The other big issue will the the carb, as choke and throttle are currently frozen up. Not much is going to happen with the engine until those are freed up and working again.
PTO and tranny are freed up and shifting in and out, and high / low lever seems to also be working.
Lastly, will and AGCO dealer have parts or where is the best place to get parts like the carb kit, plugs, wires, points, etc?
I'm in Central MO, near Fulton.
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Posted By: Jim Hancock
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 1:32pm
Hi! Air up the tires, put the tractor in 4th gear Hi(forward) and rock/bump it a little and watch the fan blades. I think that I'd let the ATF soak a couple days before bumping it. You can add acetone to the ATF 50/50 mix and get somewhat faster(?) results from the reports on this forum . Being shedded all this time may be in your favor. Vendors on this site can help you with the electrical items,
B&B Custom Circuits is Steve in NJ,
OKTractor.com is Jim Danforth
------------- How blessed we are by HIS GRACE!
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Posted By: Allis-Chalmers Damon
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 1:42pm
http://www.tonystractors.com" rel="nofollow - www.tonystractors.com is a great place to shop for AC parts.
If you are looking for someone closer, here is a link to other dealers:
https://www.allischalmers.com/sources/index.aspx" rel="nofollow - https://www.allischalmers.com/sources/index.aspx
------------- 1955 WD45 Diesel, 1959 D14, All-Crop Drill, 2015 John Deere 5075e, New Holland 279 Haybine, New Holland 575 square baler, New Holland 1032 Stackliner, 10ft Industrias Disc, 6ft Titan grapple
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 2:21pm
So this thing is currently in a barn across the road from me, so I can check on it, play with it there.
Gas tank is empty. Sediment bowl is half full of what looks like varnish, and is stuck and won't come off.
Eased off the choke linkage a bit, and was able to work choke a little, so while it remains very stiff, it's not entire frozen either.
How does the breather cap come off? Right side engine cover can't get past it without it coming off, and this one seems to be stuck in place. Lifts off? Screws off? Hate to apply force if you don't know where or how.
Can't tell if there is any coolant. May dump some antifreeze in and see if it spills out.
Also, cannot see much evidence of oil or other fluids on the ground below. Oil on the dipstick is full, but is black and thick. It will rate a change before trying to turn the engine over.
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Posted By: tadams(OH)
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 3:12pm
I would take penatrating oil and spray the throttle and choke and sediment bowl good while you work on the other things. I think the oil fill cap just pulls off.
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Posted By: AC720Man
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 4:16pm
Oil fil cap just lifts off. A slight twist and lift should do it. Does it have the breather cap that comes thru the right side hood? If so, a twist and lift should remove it also.
------------- 1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Posted By: AC720Man
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 4:20pm
The D-15 is a great little work horse, surprising what 46 hp will do. Dads is a 1968 series II and it has been very reliable. Pulls a 3 bottom Oliver plow easy.
------------- 1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 4:24pm
Found a gallon of fresh 50/50 Prestone antifreeze and was pleased when it only took about 1/2 of it to bring radiator coolant up to visible level and was not leaking any.
Was also relieved to find out our local Ford/New Holland dealer, who used to sell Allis, still stocks many of the common Allis parts, like oil filters, air filters, etc. and can get most others given enough time. They also stock carb kits and will do the rebuild in their shop if I bring it it.
This is looking better all the time, so next step will be for me to air up the tires and drag her home to my shop and get busy on it.
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Posted By: DiyDave
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 5:50pm
First thing I'd do with a FREE tractor would be to air up the tires and drag it HOME!. No matter what the other problems you may encounter, at least its a short walk, to mess with it...
Air cleaner top is just a press fit, if its stuck, just squirt your favorite panther piss, up, and around it, and tap it with a hammer, whilst twisting with a pair of channel locks...
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Posted By: Sugarmaker
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 6:58pm
I agree Free is good. Getting it home on your property even better! Great gift. It will cause you pleasure and pain! But its worth it! Welcome to the Allis forum! Regards, Chris
------------- D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Posted By: Gary Burnett
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 8:16pm
I recently bought a D17 that had been sitting 5 to 7 years put some fresh gas in the tank ,got the gas to running to the carb and out out the drain.Filed the points,clean up the rotor button,cleaned up the contacts on the dist cap.Installed new battery cranked it over a few times it fired up and I backed it off the trailer.Get it home before you work on it as the person who gave it to you might decide they need to keep it once it becomes a running tractor.
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Posted By: Hubert (Ga)engine7
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 8:31pm
Congratulations you lucky dog! That is a Series II and is a very nice find. Welcome to the Forum. Already some good advice given and like has already been said the first thing I would do is drag it home.
------------- Just an old country boy saved by the grace of God.
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Posted By: Macon Rounds
Date Posted: 18 Jul 2018 at 11:13pm
Looks like a sickle bar hold up rod tied to the left side of the tractor and the sickle mower parked behind it. If that was its job in life it should be a good tractor.
------------- The Allis "D" Series Tractors, Gravely Walk behind Tractors, Cowboy Action Shooting !!!!!!! And Checkmate
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2018 at 1:24am
There is a pull type JD sickle bar mower parked behind it, and I'm told that when the original owner retired, this tractor and that mower were the only pieces of equipment he kept, and used it to clip pastures, mow pond dams and road banks, etc. Prior to that, tractor was used in his general farm operations. I suspect it has only had one owner. BTW, I'm hoping to revive the mower too.
I also noticed that rod and am not sure what its purpose was. It does not appear to be part of the existing JD mower. It appears to me it is tied to the 3 point hitch on the left side, and projects motion forward. Good news is the original owner is still alive and may be able to tell us what it is.
BTW, 3 point lift, no snap coupler and no center link to be found. One single hose hydraulic service. Fixed up and running, this could be a handy little tractor for a lot of things. Mowing and raking hay both come to mind.
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Posted By: B26240
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2018 at 6:06am
Welcome to the forum !! Lots of good advice above, D 15 is a nice tractor.
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Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2018 at 8:08am
If you take the plugs out and squirt some type of oil in each cylinder, reach in and grab the fan and see if the engine will turn over without the plugs in. D15 II with 3 point has been my DREAM tractor for a long time. I wish a neighbor had one near me and wanted it removed from his property
------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2018 at 4:44pm
. This is a before and after my D 15 was also in the barn for 20 years without moving!! It be too much typing but if you wanna give me a call tomorrow would be a lot easier for me to just tell you everything I did and the things you’re probably have to do as well.. Justin 740 272 1992 also Adter you get it rolling you will absolutely fall in love with it I have!!
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Posted By: Fred in Pa
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2018 at 5:06pm
------------- He who dies with the most toys is, nonetheless ,still dead. If all else fails ,Read all that is PRINTED.
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2018 at 5:09pm
Nice wheel weights ! Looks to be a really straight tractor
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Posted By: Sugarmaker
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2018 at 5:50pm
Folks,See these tractors are still out there hidden away and just waiting! I see we have a pretty nice WD45D at the local tractor show this weekend for sale. Regards, Chris
------------- D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2018 at 5:56pm
Yes they are !! Hunting them down and getting leads is half the fun. It’s addicting unfortunately ha ha
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2018 at 6:14pm
I've lived within 200 yards of this tractor for the past 2 years and didn't know it. Ball got rolling when I was looking for some storage space for square hay bales and some hay equipment. Place is rented, but that tenant isn't using the barn, so I asked and was told ok, but the barn would have to be cleaned out....old hay moved, hole in roof patched, doors fixed up. No worries.
Then someone mentioned that also included an old broken down tractor, that was half buried in the dirt. Still no worries. First glance and something came out of my mouth that might have went something like "Jesus Christ...that's an Allis D15!"
They thought I was doing them a favor by taking it, so they would not have to find a way to haul it off. One man's treasure and all that. If it pans out and I get it running, I will still give them something for it. I'm still hoping I get to heaven.
About 5 years ago, I ran across a barn full of similar stuff. Two All Crops.....one a 60 and the other a 66. Owners (heirs of an estate) thought they would work, but were not sure about the belts. They also had an an old E combine, with two 10' platform heads and a 2 row picker.
Was offered good deals on all of them, but had no use for them at the time. They eventually sold at an estate auction. Pretty good deals as I recall. Buyer of the E towed it home, but sellers thought they did get it running.
So yes, that stuff is still out there. More than you know. Dwindling, yes, but it still exists.
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Posted By: GregLawlerMinn
Date Posted: 19 Jul 2018 at 8:25pm
You can turn the engine by turning the PTO stub. Place tranny in neutral, engage the PTO and rotate the stub. It may be easier if you remove the spark plugs 1st.
------------- What this country needs is more unemployed politicians-and lawyers. Currently have: 1 D14 and a D15S2. With new owners: 2Bs,9CAs,1WD,2 D12s,5D14s,3D15S2s, 2D17SIVs,D17D,1D19D;1 Unstyled WC
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 6:35am
I've been on a few other forums, and if this one is anything like
all the rest, payment in the form of pictures is the currency of choice
in exchange for all the good advice given.
So......a progress update:
Got
the tires aired up and they look much better than I expected. Flat, but
NOT cracked as I thought. They look nearly new and were holding air.
One rear had a bit of a crack in the sidewall, but came up and held.
Rims have some rust down low however.
So with the tires up, we got her moved. I drove, and she handled well. Brakes were working perfect.
Engine covers off and so it begins........
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 6:36am
Hmmmm........images have been uploaded, but when I click on the images icon to add them, nothing happens? All other functions appear to be working, but not images?
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 6:40am
Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 6:41am
Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 7:52am
BTW, what is the motor oil of choice for this Geezerette?
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 8:04am
Congrats man those back tires literally have no use on them. Like I said before give me a call if you want me to tell you all what I did with almost the exact same situation except I had to pay 800 which is still a steel
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 8:08am
Personally I just use a good 10 W 30. And I wouldn’t spend a Ton of money on the oil until after you fired up and see if those rings are stuck.. But it is a good idea to change the oil that way you lubricate the top of the engine.
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 8:11am
If the engine is not stuck at all you should be able to move it by just using the fan belt. At least I could get it to move a touch anyways or put it in fourth gear and rocket lightly
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Posted By: AC720Man
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 8:21am
A steam Ginny would clean her up really well. You will be surprised how good the paint will look after its cleaned up since its been kept inside. How many hours are showing on the hour meter? Cleaning the grime off before digging into its issues makes it easier and cleaner to trouble shoot IMO. That is a great find, I couldn’t sleep at night due to the excitement of the project. Looking forward to reading your updates and seeing pictures of your progress. Dads D-15 series II pulling the rake, new paint about 7 years ago. Has been a great tractor since new in 1968.
------------- 1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Posted By: AC720Man
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 8:49am
I’m a firm believer in Seafoam in the gas tank and the crankcase. Since it has set for years, I would do as others have said, pull the plugs and add some ATF or even better spray Kroil in each cylinder and let it set. My brother purchased a 190XT Diesel with a stuck engine. Pulled the head as we suspected a blown head gasket. Found cylinders 3-4 is where it was blown and filled with antifreeze in the dome of the pistons. Filled the cylinders with Kroil several times over a few hours. Pulled the starter and Placed a large screw driver on the flywheel and with very little force she broke free. After a new head gasket, fresh rebuild of the injection pump, she runs great. Kroil and Seafoam are both wonderful products. After you get it running, put Seafoam in the crankcase several times with fresh 10w-30 and filter. It will clean the rings and all components inside the engine. When you drain it you will be shocked at how dirty fresh oil becomes as it cleans the engine. Figure on at least 2 filters and fresh oil before it clears. Well worth the money as the engine will be clean as well as the rings, head, valves. She will run much better as the carbon build up will be gone. Has worked well for me on multiple engines over the years.
------------- 1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Posted By: Kenny L.
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 9:26am
Modirt, congrats on your find you'll love the D-15. I see you've the mounting brackets for a cultivator and I believe the rod is part of the cultivator also. Have fun with the old girl.
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 11:30am
I suspected the rod may have been for a cultivator. There is a forward projecting bracket mounted to the top of the left side 3 point link. We had something similar on a JD 620, which carried a front mounted cultivator. Except that one used two push/pull rods....one on each side, and they were more like 1.5" pipes. But if this one was used to lift in a pulling motion vs. a push, a single solid rod may have worked.
I was also wondering what those brackets would have been used for and a front mounted cultivator was the only thing I could think of.
My first "car".....was a JD B tractor. I got started on it when I was about 10 or 11. At the time, my interest was in the fact it had an engine and didn't need to be peddled like my bicycle did. It also had a 2 row cultivator and I tried to talk my dad into letting me put it on and use it. He refused, insisting that if I was interested in running a cultivator, I'd get more done with the 4 row, and the 620 had power steering and the B didn't. My guess now is he simply wanted to get out of all the work it would take to mount it up, knowing the glamor of that would wear off in about 10 minutes once I tried to steer the old B by hand. (Known of then as Armstrong Power Steering) Especially with the weight of the cultivator on it.
The D15 was probably big enough to have handled a 4 row cultivator too.
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 3:34pm
Progress updates:
This is starting to remind me of my first date with a lewd woman. Curiosity running wild as to what I'm likely to discover next.
Hour meter is showing something like 5200 hours. No clue if the tach is working or original.
Oil plug is out. Black as midnight but at least all oil. No water.
1 cup ATF in each cylinder.
Plugs a bit black for my taste. Two blacker than the others.
With plugs out, AFT in, and my curiosity getting the better of me, I rocked her a bit in 4th gear and fan blade twitched about 1/4". That was good enough for today.
Air filter pulled and looked newer than new. Air breather cap and stack tube full to the gills with mud dauber nests. Shop vac to the rescue. (Secondary benefit to this is I'm on my way to gaining 1/2 acre of accretion dirt from all the mud dauber nests).
Battery pulled and first real clue as to how long she may have been sitting. Battery was marked Sep - 7. Too old to be 2017 and not old enough to be 1997, so that leaves 2007 - 2010 as to about when she was running last. So maybe 10 years vs. 15? Battery box has got the cancer, so has a little life left, but not much. I'd put a new on one if I could find one. Battery was much smaller than the box it was sitting on and in true "make due" fashion, was held down with a tarp strap.
Aft of the engine dip stick, found two more dip sticks. Both had clean....bordering on new.....oil in them, although the one under the seat was barely showing anything on the dip stick, and I remember there was some dark dirt below that area where she had been parked. May have a slow leak.
Gas tank smells as bad as you would expect it to from ancient gas, but no rust. Carb is froze up solid. Time for that to come off for a cleaning / rebuild / kit job. Right now, that is looking like my biggest obstacle to a running engine.
Too much fun!
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Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 3:37pm
The pistons have a bowl top. One cup of oil maybe doesn't quite fill the bowl, so you need another cup to flood the rings/sleeves.
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 3:42pm
Forgot the pictures........sorry....
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 3:49pm
Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 3:51pm
DrAllis wrote:
The pistons have a bowl top. One cup of oil maybe doesn't quite fill the bowl, so you need another cup to flood the rings/sleeves. |
Will do. Good thing I bought 2 quarts!!!
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Posted By: Kenny L.
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 3:51pm
Modirt, I think Matt Scott from Jordan make battery tray for them but I could be wrong I know he made some hold down for them, his # is 612-508-4759. If you want to sell them cultivator brackets I may be interested in them or if you would like a cultivator for D-15 I would sell the one I have because I don't have the brackets.
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 4:28pm
Looks like you’re on the right track to have that running in absolute no time after we pulled mine out of the barn the starter was spinning slow so put A little oil in it as it was spinning doubled in speed then proceeded to do all the things you did except for transmission fluid in the cylinders new battery Fuel cleaned points and Fired right up now it’s my favorite tractor to hop on to do any little thing around shop!!
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 4:43pm
Added more ATF to the cylinders.......enough it ran out the plug hole of the aft one and I could hear it sloshing around in the others. Hopefully that should do it.
And while I understand what the purpose of the ATF oil is in there, I remain somewhat fuzzy on what becomes of it. On the other hand, the oil drips coming out the drain plug are now the color of the ATF, so given enough time, it may all seep past the rings and out the bottom?
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 5:12pm
Yeah as long as Stuff Isnt locked up most of it will penetrate in between the cylinder wall the piston... Personally after you get a new battery I would leave the spark plugs off and blow most of that out of there as it seems your engine is free when you crank it over. Then proceed to put your plugs in them put fresh fuel in it and see if you have a running a tractor might smoke for a couple minutes. Before doing that I personally would have just seen if the engine would move in a gentle fashion but to each their own this is fun it’s like I’m reliving my D 15 barn find again!!
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Posted By: DiyDave
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 6:24pm
modirt wrote:
I suspected the rod may have been for a cultivator. There is a forward projecting bracket mounted to the top of the left side 3 point link. We had something similar on a JD 620, which carried a front mounted cultivator. Except that one used two push/pull rods....one on each side, and they were more like 1.5" pipes. But if this one was used to lift in a pulling motion vs. a push, a single solid rod may have worked.
I was also wondering what those brackets would have been used for and a front mounted cultivator was the only thing I could think of. You're right, one is a wing nut type gizmo, the other has a wedge, that goes up against the side of the cultivator unit. Need a clearer view of the rod, to see if it goes with cults, or mower. The way the front cults were raised, was a bracket, on the inside of the lift arms, went to a J-bolt, attached to a flat piece of iron, that connected to the cult gangs, and made them lift (IIRR!)
My first "car".....was a JD B tractor. I got started on it when I was about 10 or 11. At the time, my interest was in the fact it had an engine and didn't need to be peddled like my bicycle did. It also had a 2 row cultivator and I tried to talk my dad into letting me put it on and use it. He refused, insisting that if I was interested in running a cultivator, I'd get more done with the 4 row, and the 620 had power steering and the B didn't. My guess now is he simply wanted to get out of all the work it would take to mount it up, knowing the glamor of that would wear off in about 10 minutes once I tried to steer the old B by hand. (Known of then as Armstrong Power Steering) Especially with the weight of the cultivator on it.
The D15 was probably big enough to have handled a 4 row cultivator too.
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 6:25pm
I think I'm OK on the rings and pistons. With all the oil in, I jogged the fan a bit and it moved about 1/2" and I could hear stuff sloshing around. Sounded wonderful.
But at the least, she is going to sit where she is until the carb is working.
Next big worries are the starter and generator. Fan belt looked OK.
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 6:38pm
Luckily with the 12 V system the couple D series tractors I had brought back to life I haven’t had to mess with the generators they charged right away and you might get lucky with the starter!
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Posted By: JayIN
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 7:49pm
Jeeeeeez! What a lucky dog! I dont even know you but I am happy for you!!!
------------- sometimes I walk out to my shop and look around and think "Who's the idiot that owns this place?"
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Posted By: AC720Man
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 9:24pm
I’m happy for him to! So glad another great D-15 is saved from the scrap yard! Sounds positive so far. Hope your able to get some sleep, I feel your excitement.
------------- 1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Posted By: DanWi
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 9:33pm
You need to get it turning over good without spark plugs to blow the oil out because you can't compress all the oil. Whatever is left in there thou will prevent a dry start and help the compression.
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Posted By: AC720Man
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 10:39pm
You can use a shop vac to remove what oil is left in there.
------------- 1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Posted By: Steve Zidlicky
Date Posted: 20 Jul 2018 at 11:25pm
just clean or replace points. set point gap at .22. your old condenser will be better than a new one. clean contacts inside dist cap. no need to throw a bunch of parts at it. you can get carb kit and tune up at local parts store as needed. you should put new plugs in and contrary to what most will say, I use champion plugs in allis with good results. use a J8c. they have changed the number but a J8 is the right heat range especially if it uses some oil. I have a lot of seat time on a tractor just like yours. looks like the ground cable will cause trouble too. the breather/dip stick under the seat is important to have enough oil in it. send me a personal message if you like. good luck and don't grind the gears. that is the death to those transmissions!
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Posted By: wekracer
Date Posted: 21 Jul 2018 at 6:35am
Those are sweet little tractors and highly collectible. We had one and traded it on an 8070. I hated to see it go but the only thing we used it for was pulling a trailer in the spring fixing fence.
Where in Mo are you. I’m northeast of Jefferson City.
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Posted By: chaskaduo
Date Posted: 21 Jul 2018 at 7:34am
He said Central MO, near Fulton earlier.
------------- 1938 B, 79 Dynamark 11/36 6spd, 95 Weed-Eater 16hp, 2010 Bolens 14hp
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 21 Jul 2018 at 7:37am
I'm located west of Millersburg, so not far.
BTW, I should also mention something a bit spooky. Two years ago, I was driving down the road and noticed a guy mowing his lawn area with a nice looking old AC tractor. I turned around, stopped in his drive and walked out to visit. A nice looking old D15 that was purring like a kitten. Something about his son in law or someone had bought it an an auction, and had brought it to him to use.
I noticed he kept it in an old barn and every time I drove by, I'd see the nose of it sticking out. Always thought it would be a nice unit to have, but never did or said anything more about it. About a month ago, I also noticed a new looking Kubota sticking out of another door of that barn, and I began to wonder what would become of the D15.
So fast forward a few days, the tractor I'm writing about showed up one evening across the road from my house. Literally the next morning, the D15 I had been watching showed up on the side of the road with a for sale sign on it. $3,000. And one like it on Craigslist about 50 miles away for $3,500. So those two became my benchmark for what I should be willing to spend on repairs on this one. Scary part is you don't know until you are into it. I think I'm going to get lucky and come in way under that, but until it's running and all is known, it is still a wild card.
But these are pretty rare tractors, and what are the odds that two of them would show up within a mile of each other? Neither owner knowing the other existed, and I found out about both of them within 12 hours of each other?
BTW, as of yesterday, the D15 that was for sale is still there. I've stopped by to look at it to see where some of the working parts are so I know where things are on the one I'm working on.
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Posted By: JayIN
Date Posted: 21 Jul 2018 at 7:48am
It IS worth $3000 if the tranny is good!!!!
------------- sometimes I walk out to my shop and look around and think "Who's the idiot that owns this place?"
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 21 Jul 2018 at 8:27am
Also The best deal on New original looking seat cushions is eBay There dang near half the price of anyone else and they’re comfortable.
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 21 Jul 2018 at 8:39am
Was wondering if it would be possible / feasible for an upholstery shop to rehab the original seat. Main reason being it still has the AC logo and name on the back of it.
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 21 Jul 2018 at 9:32am
Yes you use the same frame and put the new cushions right onto it
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Posted By: Steve Zidlicky
Date Posted: 21 Jul 2018 at 9:34am
you will use the original seat frame either way. you are only changing the cushions.
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Posted By: Steve Zidlicky
Date Posted: 21 Jul 2018 at 9:35am
slow today. question already answered
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 21 Jul 2018 at 9:38am
Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 21 Jul 2018 at 12:53pm
Ah yes....nothing like the smell of ATF in the morning............That pan was empty last night, so all that came from the cylinders.......plus whatever is still left on top of them.
And the carb is off and is went to town to be cleaned up and rebuilt. Shop said they had an old guy (who turns out to be younger than me) who had done about 1,000 of them.
Throttle valve was stiff but working. Choke was not wanting to budge much at all.
Once free of the carb, choke cable freed up and while stiff, was working some. Throttle linkage remained stiff however. Not sure where to go looking for the trouble there. Don't know if simply working them back and forth some is the answer or if something else should be done.
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 21 Jul 2018 at 6:26pm
End of the day and I turned the fan and it was moving an inch or so in either direction. I'm guessing engine is free.
I'll drink to that!!!
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Posted By: AC720Man
Date Posted: 21 Jul 2018 at 10:01pm
A D-15 in that nice of shape would bring $5k around here. They dont come up for sale very often. Lights would have to go. Missing side panel but they are available. You could have twins!
------------- 1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 9:38am
Those asking about the cultivator, not sure if this would have been a part of it or what it was used for. Attaches to the 3 point lift arms, and when the arms are lifted, it would rotate forward.
On the rod in question, don't have a better picture of it than the original.
The rod in question is held up in the front by a loop of baling wire. It runs back under through a loop under the left step, where it simply ends in space. The back end is threaded rod.
Don't know if the three point arm bracket thingy and this rod were supposed to be connected in any way or if both were for some other implements that are long gone.
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 9:46am
Another question. She has a single hydraulic coupler for a one way cylinder. The mower she was pulling has a one way lift cylinder as does my 7' New Holland haybine. (If I get her running guess what job she is going to have?)
I assume this is a standard pioneer coupler fitting?
The newer D15 parked on the road has two working fittings? I assume that means a two way cylinder operation? Is that an option for this tractor?
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Posted By: ocharry
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 10:15am
hey Modirt,,would you or could you stop by the D15 and give it a good look over,,,start it up,, and talk to the owner for me ,,,,just for some particulars,,,,please,,,if its any good i may need that little girl
and you are around jeff city???? if you decide to take this mission let me know
this communication will self destruct in 30 sec.....lol
thanks much
ocharry
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 10:37am
ocharry wrote:
hey Modirt,,would you or could you stop by the D15 and give it a good look over,,,start it up,, and talk to the owner for me ,,,,just for some particulars,,,,please,,,if its any good i may need that little girl
and you are around jeff city???? if you decide to take this mission let me know
this communication will self destruct in 30 sec.....lol
thanks much
ocharry |
You would probably do better to call the number on the ad to address your questions directly to the seller. After that, I'd be happy to go over to take additional photos and post them or send them to you.
If not obvious by now, I don't have much history with these old Allis tractors ( we had all John Deere), so I'm not the person you want to be your eyes and ears. I'm getting up to speed as fast as I can, but I'm still learning.
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Posted By: Don(MO)
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 11:01am
Here's a nice show that will have lot's of great AC guys there ready to help and you will see rows of Allis tractors just asking to be looked at.Join us at the Osage River Antique Power Association (ORAPA) show at the Miller County Fairgrounds in Eldon, MO from August 24-26, 2018. The Missouri Allis Chalmers club's summer meeting will be at 2:00 PM on Saturday, August 25. ORAPA is featuring Allis-Chalmers tractors and equipment in 2018. It's a must see show for me. Here's the link to the "Missouri Allis Chalmers club" below. http://www.moacclub.com/" rel="nofollow - http://www.moacclub.com/ Forgot the link to the show grounds web sight below. http://orapa.org/" rel="nofollow - http://orapa.org/
------------- 3 WD45's with power steering,G,D15 fork lift,D19, W-Speed Patrol, "A" Gleaner with a 330 corn head,"66" combine,roto-baler, and lots of Snap Coupler implements to make them work for their keep.
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Posted By: ocharry
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 11:10am
ok,,,,thank you sir..
i will have to give them a call and get the skinny on it
ocharry
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 11:43am
Don(MO) wrote:
Here's a nice show that will have lot's of great AC guys there ready to help and you will see rows of Allis tractors just asking to be looked at.Join us at the Osage River Antique Power Association (ORAPA) show at the Miller County Fairgrounds in Eldon, MO from August 24-26, 2018. The Missouri Allis Chalmers club's summer meeting will be at 2:00 PM on Saturday, August 25. ORAPA is featuring Allis-Chalmers tractors and equipment in 2018. It's a must see show for me. Here's the link to the "Missouri Allis Chalmers club" below. http://www.moacclub.com/" rel="nofollow - http://www.moacclub.com/ Forgot the link to the show grounds web sight below. http://orapa.org/" rel="nofollow - http://orapa.org/
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Thanks for the info on the show. Looks like the perfect chance for me to fondle paint, kick some tires and learn what I need to know.
Also, I noticed the Wise Bros. plow day? I live 15 minutes from there. I cruise threw his lot now and then. He has an old All Crop 66 I've been ogling, with a few unique things on it, like the duel tires and straw spreader. Does not have the belts and not sure about the condition of the cylinder bars. I have questions about the All Crops and that probably rates a new thread unto itself.
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 2:04pm
This appears to be the serial number, but it makes no sense to me. Perhaps someone with better eyes than mine.....one who speaks the language, can interpret?
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 2:09pm
Peeked up the back end of the generator and can see what looks like mud dauber nests inside the housing.
I assume that is bad and firing it up in that condition could risk fatal damage? (My dad had that happen to him with an air compressor motor that sat unused for a year or so. It fried the motor).
If this needs to be addressed and I slip the generator off, how extensive does one have to get to fix this?
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 2:20pm
Believe that serial number would put it as a 1963 If I’m reading it correctly it says 16,800 also if it’s the original carburetor a lot of times it will have the date on the brass tag.
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Posted By: JayD-17(NY)
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 3:37pm
May be I am not seeing it right but the last # in serial # looks more like the letter "D" to me which would suggest it was a diesel at one time or the torque-tube/rear end came from a diesel?...may be not.......
Again, maybe I am looking too much into it; but I'm seeing what looks like yellow paint peeking through around the serial # suggesting maybe ,at least that half of the tractor, came from an industrial model? Could be just my eyes, could be primer......any signs of yellow elsewhere on the tractor? It does appear to have been repainted and re-decaled in the past......
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Posted By: AC720Man
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 3:59pm
They used a yellow primer from the factory. Primer may not be the correct term, but that was factory. Dad's had that on it when I sand blasted it to paint. I only removed what had flaked up. Primer never lifted.
------------- 1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Posted By: JayD-17(NY)
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 4:07pm
Yeah I remember seeing that type of "Primer" on some of the Allises from that period...thats why I asked if any yellow was peeking through elsewhere....that 0 that looks like a "D" is likely a funny stamped 0 then , and the tractor is probably a all original 1963.....
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Posted By: DiyDave
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 5:19pm
modirt wrote:
Those asking about the cultivator, not sure if this would have been a part of it or what it was used for. Attaches to the 3 point lift arms, and when the arms are lifted, it would rotate forward.
On the rod in question, don't have a better picture of it than the original.
The rod in question is held up in the front by a loop of baling wire. It runs back under through a loop under the left step, where it simply ends in space. The back end is threaded rod.
Don't know if the three point arm bracket thingy and this rod were supposed to be connected in any way or if both were for some other implements that are long gone.
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Not sure about tractors with 3 point, but on my SC D-15(II), the lift mechanism is mounted under the foot rest. The mechanism that is in the pictures appears to push forward as the arms lift. The cultivator mechanism (at least on mine), pulls to the rear, as the arms are lifted. Might be a farmer cobble-up, to adapt a JD mower, to an Allis tractor...
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 5:35pm
Is that actually a D 15 with a factory three point?
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Posted By: LeonR2013
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2018 at 6:17pm
Modirt I live just east of Fulton and travel WW pretty often to go to Columbia to the doctor. So if you would like me to drop by I'd be glad to. Use a PM to keep it a little more private. Have fun with it. Leon
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2018 at 11:41am
Asked this before, but it may have gotten lost in the flurry of stuff I posted over the weekend........
Now that I know the engine is freed up, I"m ready to put on new oil filter and dump in new oil so I can bump the starter to try turning her over.
But if my recollections is right, no oil will be flowing to the moving parts until the oil filter has been filled. I could pre-load the filter before putting it on, but putting it on upside down would mean most of that would dump out on the ground. Or just work fast?
But the question is.....is there a way to spin the oil pump to get all the parts lubed up so as to avoid a dry start? Especially for an engine that has sat for so long?
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2018 at 12:01pm
Other people can chime in but you are oiling the valves and such as you pour the Oil on the top of the engine You’ll be fine just turning the engine over... That’s just my opinion it’s not gonna take much for the oil to be distributed everywhere and it’s not like the engine is going to be running so just turning it over will be fine.
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Posted By: Steve Zidlicky
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2018 at 12:35pm
since it has sat several years, just unplug coil wire so it will not start and spin it over some to get the oil everywhere then hook up coil wire and start it
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Posted By: Don(MO)
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2018 at 1:00pm
Like the guys said it will be OK to roll the engine over, I'd leave the plugs out when you roll it over to get as much of the ATF oil out/off the tops of the pistons before you try to start it.
------------- 3 WD45's with power steering,G,D15 fork lift,D19, W-Speed Patrol, "A" Gleaner with a 330 corn head,"66" combine,roto-baler, and lots of Snap Coupler implements to make them work for their keep.
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Posted By: Jk chalmers
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2018 at 1:02pm
Also don’t be alarmed after it fires up that it smokes for a second ha ha just make sure the oil pressure is good after it fires up...!! I’m sure you already knew that just had to say and can we post videos I’d love to hear the initial fire !!
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2018 at 1:30pm
Considering all the help I've been given, I figured a video of the initial fire-up would be mandatory.
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2018 at 3:47pm
What is this tube and why isn't it connected? Can't tell if it is broken off or simply pulled out.
It runs from a fitting at the base of the distributor to a similar fitting at the throttle linkage at the governor.
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2018 at 5:06pm
Hmmm......D15 service manual I ordered off ebay arrived today. That is an oil line that runs from governor to distributor. Manual only mentions what it is. Not what it does or what happens if it's not connected as this one is.
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Posted By: AC720Man
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2018 at 5:11pm
Go to Advance Auto store if you have one, they have a copper line kit made by Bosch for $10. Has all the parts you need to make a new line connection. You need that fixed before you turn it over. Looks like it goes into the connector at your finger tip. I can check dads after dinner.
------------- 1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Posted By: DiyDave
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2018 at 5:51pm
Yep dist oiler runs from that tee fitting with nothing sticking out. Needs to be connected, or it will squirt oil from the tee...
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2018 at 8:04pm
OK, I now know what it is, and think I know how that happened (a self inflicted wound).
The oil tube T fitting, (the T fitting with nothing sticking out of it), is stuck to and rotating with the governor control rod lever mounted directly below it. The T fitting is swiveling back and forth with the control rod lever when the throttle lever is moved up and down. Even in the picture you can see the fitting and hole in it are not pointing to the oil tube.
So my guess is that needs to be freed up, so that the T fitting does not rotate with the control rod lever directly below it and remains pointing at the oil tube in a fixed position while everything else is moving. Otherwise, it bends back and forth at the fitting and will keep snapping off?
The self inflicted part came as I was manually working the throttle body back and forth once to free it up once the balky, sticky carb was off. Unknown to me, I was also working that line and it must have snapped.
That is a really small line. Is there a known Bosch number for a tubing kit to fit? The ones I saw online looked to be much larger OD/ID than this line is.
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Posted By: AC720Man
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2018 at 8:31pm
The one I picked up is the only size they sell and it fit. I threw the packaging away. I think its 1/8” line. It’s used for oil pressure gauges.
------------- 1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Posted By: Dave (Mid-MI)
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2018 at 8:53pm
The rod under your footrest pulled back when the three point was raised to raise the front cultivator gangs. The mechanism near the fender is a depth stop for the rear cultivator gang.
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 24 Jul 2018 at 1:16pm
Dave: Thanks for confirming the info on the cultivator. That would have been my guess, but being a pull/lift was different than what was used on our old JD stuff.
But that being the case, once I confirm this thing is mine to have and to hold, and since there is no cultivator to be found, and since I don't want one, I suspect the cultivator stuff will be made available to someone who wants it. I've got an idea on the best way to ration this out, but will share that when the time comes.
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Posted By: modirt
Date Posted: 24 Jul 2018 at 1:22pm
On the oil line, I have found it locally, and it is indeed 1/8" OD stuff and is sold for oil pressure gauges. Not sure if the compression fittings they sell with it will work with my existing ends, but we will find out. Does anyone know if the small compression fittings inside the existing ends can come off and be used again, or ??????
Also, I checked the roadside FS D15 and confirmed the T fitting and governor control lever are supposed to work independent of each other. Mine are turning together as a unit and seem determined to continue doing so. Looks like I need pull the stack to get them apart, cleaned up and working as designed. So how does that stack get pulled? Does the T screw out the top or is the entire stack screwed into the base as a unit?
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