A few 190XT questions.
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Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
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URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=147303
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Topic: A few 190XT questions.
Posted By: ezlle71
Subject: A few 190XT questions.
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 11:15am
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Hello everybody, We farm about 400 tillable acres and another almost 100 of hay ground. The goal is to get this tractor back into full use capability instead of just a loader tractor. A good friend and i have been doing some major repairs to my 190xt. Its a 1968 diesel, split it and rebuilt the power director, (low side was slipping), New main clutch kit and flywheel, rear main seal. Had the injector pump rebuilt as the governor was about to fly to pieces. The mounts for the platform were all busted out so welded all that up. I believe it was from wearing a cab and the previous owner did not do much maintenance. And a bunch of other stuff along the way we have fixed. Question 1. My dad wants to take the 18.4 38's off his parts 7010 and put them on the 190. What would be the best way to go about this? Question 2. Where does the 68' model fall as far as the weak rearends and other known weak points in the 190 series? Question 3. Any other tricks or tips for this machine that will help the longevity and performance? Thank you for any help/ideas you can throw my way. ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Replies:
Posted By: Joe(TX)
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 11:35am
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1. You would need the centers from a 200 tractor to put the 38 in tires on. The combination, however would make the tractor a lot faster since the tires are 4 in. larger than the original. I would not recommend the 38 in tires. 2. A lot depends on the serial number of the tractor. A lot of improvements were made at SN 23001 (series !!!). The biggest change being the 4 pinion differential. ------------- 1970 190XT, 1973 200, 1962 D-19 Diesel, 1979 7010, 1957 WD45, 1950 WD, 1961 D17, Speed Patrol, D14, All crop 66 big bin, 180 diesel, 1970 170 diesel, FP80 forklift. Gleaner A |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 12:04pm
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serial # is 19xxx i can't remember the last 3. I will have to look at my notes. I thought 38's were a common swap. I take the axle shafts would be bigger on the 7010 so ya can't use the centers? ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 12:07pm
| You can use the 38 inch wheel centers from a D-19, 190, 190XT, 200, 7000 and D-21. Use your existing center bushings. 7010mand up are totally different. |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 12:07pm
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With after market cabs they were known to break platform mounts. If the rear end has ever been overhauled it may have the 4 pinion differential already. How far gone is the 7010? That was a great tractor and may be worth resurrecting over doing a whole lot to the 190. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 12:14pm
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To help longevity I wouldn’t put duals on it and then pull the snot out of it. It was really designed to pull equipment made for a 70 HP tractor but pull it faster. That would go a long way in making that tractor last. Also, of course, changing oils on time and using quality oil and filters. Oh, don’t grind gears either. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: Joe(TX)
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 12:57pm
38's were used, but they were 15.5's and not 18.4. ------------- 1970 190XT, 1973 200, 1962 D-19 Diesel, 1979 7010, 1957 WD45, 1950 WD, 1961 D17, Speed Patrol, D14, All crop 66 big bin, 180 diesel, 1970 170 diesel, FP80 forklift. Gleaner A |
ezlle71 wrote:Posted By: darrel in ND
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 1:13pm
| I put 18.4 38's on my XT, and I am very happy I did it. Gives it a lot better stance, more windrow clearance underneath for big round baling. Made it a little faster, but it needed to be. I didn't notice any power loss from turning the bigger tires, but then it's primary job was baling, and it didn't do any tillage. I sure hope that you didn't waste time and money on the power director, but if you did, it's all water under the bridge now anyhow. But on my one ninety gasser, I had power director slipping problems. I also had broken up platform issues like you had. Turned out that getting the platform fixed back up, beefed up, and propped up off the axle also fixed my power director issue. The sagging platform had the power director shift linkage out of whack, so it wasn't engaging the power director fully. Going on probably 10 years or better now since I fixed it up, and still rock solid. Good luck with your XT project. In my opinion, they are a great tractor. darrel |
Posted By: Dakota Dave
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 1:23pm
| If the cab was added they probably didn't add the platform support braces. It should have tubes that bolt to the platform outside edge and go down to the top of the axle. These support the load of the cab. Otherwise the plTform is just bolted to the top of the transmition and the cab swaying gas a lot of leverage on the cross braces. You could also use univerth step up wedges to install the 38" rims on the 34" centers. The only problem with this is they are expensive. You'd need 12 dof them for each rim and they were $75 each when I looked for them. The farm I work at used them plus step up rims to go to 46" tires on one tractor. The rims and wedges were over $4000 that didn't include the cost of tires. We had tires all the other tractors use that size and we've got duals for all the tractors and spray cart. If you've got the power shift wheels you'll also need the hardware. |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 1:44pm
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Thank you Doc! good info Yea that stupid cab is NOT going back on. It tore one front mount completely off and the back part under the fuel tank was all busted out too. And wasn't planning on putting duals on. I guess probably keep the 34's unless i can find centers. No biggie there. Yea i am a stickler on keeping fluids and filters changed. An ounce of maintenance is worth a pound of repair in my book. Lonn, Dad bought the 7010 new and i think when the crank broke for the third time in about 2004-2005 we said the hell with it. It has been cannibalized for some parts so it lives on! we bought the 7040 after that. When Jeff at Lott implement when thru the power director all the spacers were blue and 3 of the ceramic discs had blueing, so thats what we replaced. ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: grinder220
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 2:28pm
| Get some step-up rims to go to 38s. Did it with mine and its far cheaper then the wedges and makes the tractor look a lot better and puts the drawbar up where it really should have been from the factory. |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 4:55pm
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Wow, 3 broken cranks. Must be a problem with the block..... unless using reground cranks instead of new. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: AC7060IL
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 6:47pm
How many hours did the 7010 accumulate before it's crankshafts began breaking? |
Posted By: FREEDGUY
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 8:22pm
| Will the XT be the main tillage tractor for those acres?? |
Posted By: bigal121892
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 9:21pm
| With all the orange tractors we had, and all the hours we put on, we only had one crankshaft break, (7040). That was after an overhaul, and was due to the block not being line bored at the time of the overhaul. Lot's of rear end failures, but only one crankshaft. |
Posted By: Allis Magoo
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 10:58pm
 38s def make a better stance and look cooler
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Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 08 Feb 2018 at 8:12am
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Freedguy, No it will supplement the JD7230 that we have now. Mainly hay work, swathing baling loading hay. But will probably get some time on the field cultivator and drilling wheat or some beans. Grind feed, feed cows, just all kinds of random farm tasks. Bigal, the 185 broke a crank but that was the fuel pump went bad and pumped the crankcase full of diesel while grinding feed. Older sister was running it and had no idea til too late. ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 08 Feb 2018 at 9:13am
| Broken crank because fuel got in the oil ?? Nonsense. Broken crankshaft after the main and rod bearings burned out because of fuel in the oil ?? Nope. Broken crankshaft because the local machine shop reground the crank incorrectly AND/OR the crank journals had been discolored from bearing failure (and shouldn't have been reground anyway) ?? BINGO !!!!! Multiple crank breakage failures in a 7010.......sounds pretty fishy to me. Who was the ignorant mechanic working on that one ??? |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 08 Feb 2018 at 10:31am
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Doc, i talked to my dad the 185 scored the sleeves when the injector pump filled the crankcase with diesel. it was grinding hog feed at full throttle and my middle oldest sister was about 15-16 and didn't know any better. I was young when that happened and didn't quite have the story straight. Sorry about that. The 185 has been a great tractor it has been used and abused and still to this day goes to work. That tractor does not owe us a thing. The 7010 broke the crank right at the edge of the rod journal. Hours were about 4000 or so dad thought. All the work was done at the allis dealer. They replaced the crank and dad made it across the creek and almost to the field and it broke the second crank. The mechanic had found that crank upstairs at the dealer out of another tractor. So this time they got another crank from Abilene Machine. it lasted probably another 3000 hours and 10 years. Dad admitted he probably loaded it up on ether too much the last time and that's what broke the third one. The 7010 was hell on exhaust manifolds too. i know for a fact i replaced 2 and i think it had been done twice before that. All in all though we have always been allis guys. Dad had a 180 brand new and a 200 brand new. he traded the 200 on the 7010 and has always wished he would have kept the 200. ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 08 Feb 2018 at 2:54pm
| 7010's don't break crankshafts as a general rule. Those cranks were either reground (by someone who doesn't know how and when to regrind an AC crank) or there was a problem with the vibration dampner or line-bore of the block. Anyway, your mechanic obviously wasn't too up on AC engines with that kind of failure rate. In fact, he's maybe even a little worse than our local weatherman on forecasting. |
Posted By: injpumpEd
Date Posted: 08 Feb 2018 at 4:22pm
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Damper issue is first thing I thought, because the manifold issue. It had probably been running with the injection timing way off. When an engine isn't happy, it will tend to make parts fail lol! ------------- 210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers! |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 7:49am
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The dealer was one one of the biggest Allis dealers in the state. I don't believe the timing was off. They did turn the pump and it dynoed at 120 hp i think. and ran a long time after that. ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 20 Feb 2018 at 2:17pm
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Worked on the 190 yesterday some more. Got to hear it run and move! Sounds a ton better with the rebuilt injector pump. Also hauled the 7040 home this weekend. So it was an Orange weekend to say the least lol. The 7040 has been sitting for over 3 years, i put a set of batteries in it, a sniff of ether and she took right off. i was surprised to say the least. When the 190 is done we are going to work on the 7040, hopefully before spring planting ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 09 Mar 2018 at 8:30am
 Wanted to get a picture of my tractor when we brought it home last weekend------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 09 Mar 2018 at 3:45pm
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Looks like a beauty ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: HD6GTOM
Date Posted: 09 Mar 2018 at 9:31pm
| I sold fuel to many farmers with 190's back when they were the "big tractor". My dads early 190xt was the only 1 I remember with 34" rubber. All the rest were 18.4x38's. I would not hesitate to do what you are wanting to do. I sold several step up kits for Case when I first started in the tire business in 1986. I do not remember anyone being unhappy with their decision. Have fun - just remember to recheck all bolts. |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 09 Mar 2018 at 11:58pm
 It’s hard to believe that’s the same tractor. That’s my dads 6400 next to it. It stalled on my dad and him and my mom went down there with my XT to pull it out but the water was rising to fast. Thank god they both made it out alive. ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: Allis dave
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2018 at 7:23am
| wait... So what happened here? How they get flooded out? Sounds like a scary story |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2018 at 9:41am
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That will be 5 years ago in August. The 6400 went down the road as salvage. We bought our 7230 and we cleaned up and repaired my 190xt. The water went over the top of the roofs of both. ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2018 at 12:58pm
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Dad had went across the creek to take salt and mineral to the cows. He came back and the water was about 4 ft deep in the crossing. A big wake went out in front of him and it came back at killed the engine on the 6400. He swam out and went up and got my mom and my tractor. Tried to pull the 6400 out but the water was rising to fast. He bailed out of the 6400 when the water went over the top of steering wheel. Swam to shore and got my mom to the bank. Not bad for being 65 at the time lol ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: Allis dave
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2018 at 1:30pm
| wow that's crazy. They were lucky. Do you know what caused it to flood so fast? |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2018 at 1:56pm
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Around here creeks can rise and fall in just a few hours. The water had receded the next day we pulled both tractors out. Crazy stuff here in the flint hills. ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 04 Apr 2018 at 10:06am
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Got another question, Can anybody tell me where a good place to tee into the hydraulics on the 190XT for a loader without using one of the remotes? Really don't wanna tie up one of the remotes for the loader all the time as we plan on puling the field cultivator with it. thanks ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: CAL(KS)
Date Posted: 04 Apr 2018 at 10:17am
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a loader valve with power beyond tapped into the pressure line in front of the tractor valve stack. power beyond then runs to tractor valves. discussed on here many times, a search would probably yield several discussions. ------------- Me -C,U,UC,WC,WD45,190XT,TL-12,145T,HD6G,HD16,HD20 Dad- WD, D17D, D19D, RT100A, 7020, 7080,7580, 2-8550's, 2-S77, HD15 |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 04 Apr 2018 at 11:30am
Sorry about that. I should have searched ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 04 Apr 2018 at 11:51am
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What's the trick to searching on this forum? having a difficult time getting results ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: CAL(KS)
Date Posted: 04 Apr 2018 at 12:03pm
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you can do a google search also if this doesn't get you what you want "adding loader valve on 190" site: http://www.allischalmers.com" rel="nofollow - www.allischalmers.com search topic in " " this brings up a bunch of topics ------------- Me -C,U,UC,WC,WD45,190XT,TL-12,145T,HD6G,HD16,HD20 Dad- WD, D17D, D19D, RT100A, 7020, 7080,7580, 2-8550's, 2-S77, HD15 |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2018 at 11:35am
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Surplus center has 3 different GPM loader joysticks. 10, 12 and 25. Would the 12 gpm be sufficient for my 190xt? From what i looked up the hydraulic gpm of this tractor is 12 gpm. I searched the forum and have the procedure for connecting to the tractor figured out. ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 09 Oct 2018 at 10:52am
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Wanted to give alittle update. Thanks to several people here, i got the 12 gpm surplus center joystick all plumbed in and operational. Have been very happy with the results all summer. The XT got to field cultivate, round bale, swath hay, drill sudan grass even got hooked to the plow alittle bit. Got some side shields from Abilene Machine. And at the request of the hired man and my dad, the XT now wears a 200 muffler. I will admit the muffler makes the tractor alot more enjoyable to operate. For next year, a sun shade was requested by the hired man. During prairie hay mowing, the radiator sprung a slight leak. So i am gonna pull it and have it professionally cleaned and repaired. And gonna replace the water pump while its out, have new hoses all ready for it. While on that subject, i have heard of people using a different fan on these tractors for more or better air flow? if anybody can confirm that? Because i would make that switch too while i'm at it. Thanks ez ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 09 Oct 2018 at 12:00pm
| More airflow to accomplish what ?? If you aren't having overheating issues as it is, why change anything when it comes to the fan ?? There's a reason a model 200 has two fan belts.....the different fan pulls harder. |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 09 Oct 2018 at 1:32pm
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She was running alittle warm this spring working ground. 210-220 degrees pulling the 22 ft krause field cultivator about 6 mph. Maybe having the core of the radiator rodded and cleaned will take care of it. It would cool right back down when i backed outta it. So maybe i was worried for nothing. How many blade fan should a XT have? It seems to really move air so that's why i was curious how much more air a 200 fan will move. ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 09 Oct 2018 at 7:34pm
| A good cleaning might take care of your problem. If your fan belt wasn't TIGHT, the belt may have been slipping at high idle. With the single belt at full throttle the belt has to be in good condition and tight. |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 10 Oct 2018 at 7:56am
Thanks Doc!  ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |
Posted By: ezlle71
Date Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 11:53am
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Had to put new rear tires on the XT last friday. Ouch. Got Firestone Super All Traction 2's in 18.4x34. Should be good to go for a while now. ------------- 190XT, 185, D15 SII, 7040 is living again, 7010 retired for parts. |