d-17 series IV wont run
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=146317
Printed Date: 22 Aug 2025 at 6:23am
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Topic: d-17 series IV wont run
Posted By: papa bear
Subject: d-17 series IV wont run
Date Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 7:24am
| My d-17 wont start or run ran decent when I got it I figured it just needed a tune up. used it one day and blew a line on the loader and it hasn't been quite right since. It would still start and run but not at all well. I changed the points and condenser and put in new plugs and it was the same thing, then I cleaned the carb and put in new gaskets and it would start and run but still not right. I recently pulled it in the shop and put the full premium rebuild kit in the carb and now it wont start or run at all. I have good spark when you arc a plug wire to the block but a weak looking spark when you arc it to the plug. also after cranking and not starting gas will leak out the carb intake. If the bowl is full and the gas is off it will still do this after cranking so I don't really think it is a stuck float or anything any help is appreciated. |
Replies:
Posted By: Stan IL&TN
Date Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 7:42am
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Make sure you have a good clean ground connection from battery to frame. Also make sure you have a steady flow of gas from the carb bowl drain when the drain plug is removed. This is where I would start on both. ------------- 1957 WD45 dad's first AC 1968 one-seventy 1956 F40 Ferguson |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 8:18am
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Sometimes, you just need to back away and forget what you think is right, before you can figure these situations out. I have had the "distant star syndrome " myself more than I'd like to admit. Distant Star syndrome- when you look at something so long, you can't see it anymore till you look away for a bit. If you think you've checked everything out and still can't get it to run, PM me. I'm only 12 miles from Morrison, maybe could help ya out. ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: Don(MO)
Date Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 8:28am
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Where did the tune-up parts come from? Have you checked the cranking dwell?
------------- 3 WD45's with power steering,G,D15 fork lift,D19, W-Speed Patrol, "A" Gleaner with a 330 corn head,"66" combine,roto-baler, and lots of Snap Coupler implements to make them work for their keep. |
Posted By: papa bear
Date Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 10:46am
| i haven't checked the ground but I would assume since i have good spark to the block that is not the issue. I don't remember where I got the points plugs and condenser but once again I would assume with good spark to the block this is not the issue. The carb kit was the premium kit from steiner and it has good flow in and out. When you mention checking the dell I assume you mean checking the dwell which I have not done and don't know how to to be honest. My next thought was checking the timing and the valves. If I am thinking wrong or if someone has any other ideas please let me know. I appreciate any help I can get. |
Posted By: Stan R
Date Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 11:18am
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If you have gas coming out of the carb intake, I would start with that and fix it. Maybe sticky needle valve (I assume you connected the "mini wire" between the needle valve and float), or float not adjusted correctly. Get that fixed and then move onto the electrical side of items (adjust or replace points, condenser, plug wires, etc.). Also, make sure you have good flow out of the carb via removing bottom carb plug and make sure you have good flow. If not good, maybe bowl screen is plugged or ????. |
Posted By: DougS
Date Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 11:22am
| A good gasket on the carb? Did the distributor get any oil on it? Could be a bad distributor cap. A weak spark when you put the wire to a spark plug... you didn't by chance install resistor plugs? |
Posted By: DSeries4
Date Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 4:42pm
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Are you sure you have the firing order correct? 1-3-4-2 starting at the front of the engine. My WD45 was off 180 degrees after I tuned it up. ------------- '49 G, '54 WD45, '55 CA, '56 WD45D, '57 WD45, '58 D14, '59 D14, '60 D14, '63 D15D, '66 D15II, '66 D21II, '67 D17IV, '67 D17IVD, '67 190XTD, '73 620, '76 185, '77 175, '84 8030, '85 6080 |
Posted By: DougS
Date Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 6:51pm
| Ummm is that firing order correct. I thought it was 1 2 4 3. |
Posted By: wfmurray
Date Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 7:11pm
| If it blew oil on dist and coil i thank that would be first things to look at.Oil can act as a insulator.Put one drop of oil on spring of rotor button and it will not hit a lick. |
Posted By: MACK
Date Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 9:26pm
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Did you put the venture back in carburetor? Go find old condenser and put it back in. Sounds like first problem is timing or advance is stuck in distributor. MACK |
Posted By: MACK
Date Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 9:28pm
| Firing order is 1-2-4-3. MACK |
Posted By: papa bear
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2018 at 7:10am
| Thanks for all the ideas guys. Mack I was thinking about the timing being off somehow how would you check the advance mechanism? I also thought about going back to old condenser but figured with a good blue spark to the block the sparky bits weren't the issue. I looked last night and I am pretty sure the spark plugs are wrong it has autolite 303's and I think it needs 64's but even with this issue it has ran with those exact plugs in it and now it wont even pop. |
Posted By: papa bear
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2018 at 7:12am
| also firing order is right(1243) and venturi is in carb. |
Posted By: Ted J
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2018 at 9:25am
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Toss the dist. cap in the junk and try a new one. Clean the ends of the plug wires REAL good too. I'm with SougS, dizzy cap. ------------- "Allis-Express" 19?? WC / 1941 C / 1952 CA / 1956 WD45 / 1957 WD45 / 1958 D-17 |
Posted By: JC-WI
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2018 at 12:17pm
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Try spraying brake kleen and let dry or spray WD40 liberally onto the coil inside and outside of distributor cap . Wipe the excess off the inside and see if that works... and you might want to check float level along with sticking needle & seat... and make sure you have the spark plug wires on right. Such as having compression on #1 cylinder and rotor pointing to #1 spark plug wire. ------------- He who says there is no evil has already deceived himself The truth is the truth, sugar coated or not. Trawler II says, "Remember that." |
Posted By: Pete from IL
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2018 at 12:42pm
| If the last thing you did was rebuild the carb and now it won't run, that is where you have to look. Is it flooded? Look at the plugs after cranking see if they are wet. |
Posted By: Orange4ever
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2018 at 7:06pm
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Check your air cleaner from the carburetor all the way forward i'm amazed what I find sometimes ! pipes fitting everything ------------- If you want a man to be a successful farmer, give him a Allis Chalmers tractor. If you want him to be a successful mechanic, give him a John Deere |
Posted By: LeonR2013
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2018 at 7:58pm
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Take the top off the carb. Check and make sure return spring is attached to needle. Check float level. Both sides of the float usually comes out to be about a 1/4" below the top of bowl. Someone said something about the venturi. Always check them close for fitment, cracks etc. If they're loose or cracked they will not hold vacuum, so gas will not be drawn into the cylinders properly. Strange as it sounds there's a short ground wire that goes from the switch box that is held to the battery box by two small screws or bolts. It just runs from the switch box to the frame. 4-6" long and 12ga will do it. I've seen tractors not start good when it is broken or corroded. Oh, while you have the top off the carb. take something like the handle of a screw driver and tap the needle very lightly. This seems to seat the needle in the seat and keeps the carb from overflowing when you kill it. |
Posted By: Ted J
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2018 at 8:39pm
This is the FIRST thing
This is the SECOND thing
THEN, the third thing He didn't NEED to change points and condenser or new plugs...... He didn't NEED to work on the carb........ GENTLEMEN, take it ONE step at a time, IN ORDER........ IT RAN GREAT BEFORE IT SPRAYED Hyd oil all over..........THUS........it's in the dizzy somewhere. I'd suspect that the plug wires are coated with oil INSIDE the OUTLET of the Distributor cap. THAT is the place to start. VERY hard to get oil inside the cap unless it sprayed in such a way to get in there. REMEMBER, ONE STEP AT A TIME. The obvious FIRST... Cap,,,,,,wires,,,,,,,,,THEN inside.....CHANGE EACH PIECE AT a time then try starting it. IF after wiping off the plug wires and cleaning OUT the cap where the plug wires go,,,,,I'd look inside after that. CLEAN and INSPECT the points. Look shaky? Change em. Try to start it. How's it run? Go to the next step.... I'm betting it's step one but now, it makes it harder because you have changed things around and made things WORSE!! ONE STEP AT A TIME!! The ONLY way to troubleshoot ANYTHING, whether it be a tractor or a computer.... DOES NOT WORK with women...Take my word for it. ------------- "Allis-Express" 19?? WC / 1941 C / 1952 CA / 1956 WD45 / 1957 WD45 / 1958 D-17 |
papa bear wrote:Posted By: papa bear
Date Posted: 05 Feb 2018 at 10:47am
|
So as ted j pointed out I probably didn't need to do the points or condenser or the carb. However I had just got the tractor and wanted to do those things anyways even if I shouldn't have because it introduces another variable into the equation. Update After walking away from the problem I decided to check the timing I had a hell of a time finding TDC until I took off the valve cover and discovered it was on the exhaust stroke instead of compression when the rotor was on the #1 wire ( I know for a fact I didn't move the plug wires around) when I moved all the wires 180 degrees and timed it it ran great for a while I put the loader back on and parked it. About a day later I tried to use it and it started coughing and sputtering and wouldn't run all it would do was start cough a couple times then die. I then walked away until I came out a day or two later ready to dig in but when I started it up it ran fine for about an hour so I parked it again. a day or two later I was going to go up in the woods with it and it started fine and ran fine until I got to the hill then it started doing this all over again. I then got it back on level ground checked fuel and everything I could think and it still wont run or start just an occasional pop is all I get. Im thinking maybe it is jumping time somehow but haven't had a chance or motivation to check it yet. Any thoughts?
|
Posted By: DougS
Date Posted: 05 Feb 2018 at 11:09am
| Water in the gas? |
Posted By: papa bear
Date Posted: 05 Feb 2018 at 11:53am
| I don't think there is water in the gas I only say this because I had the tank emptied out at one point to clean it out then poured 10 gallon in and it has been inside for the most part since then and not run very much. I will also add that after the last carb rebuild I added an inline filter so it shouldn't be getting gunk in the carb either. |
Posted By: Stan IL&TN
Date Posted: 05 Feb 2018 at 12:10pm
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The in-line filter may not be helping. Sometimes these are too restrictive on a gravity system. If the sediment screen is in good shape then that is all that is needed to keep the carb clean.
To check that in-line filter I would open the drain on the carb bowl and see if you get a nice stream of gas for a few minutes. If flow stays good then no worries. ------------- 1957 WD45 dad's first AC 1968 one-seventy 1956 F40 Ferguson |
Posted By: papa bear
Date Posted: 06 Feb 2018 at 10:57am
| flow at the carb is fine the tractor has ran just fine the way everything is configured right now. Im hoping I will have a chance to look at the timing tonight then report back here after. |
Posted By: LeonR2013
Date Posted: 06 Feb 2018 at 12:44pm
| Run a jumper wire from the hot post on the battery to coil post opposite to the dist. side and see if it will start and run better. If you have it converted to 12 volt you'll have to run it thru. the volt-a-drop first. Be very careful to not leave the wire on and not running. It can burn the points very quickly. If it does have a volt-a-drop check and make sure it isn't about kaput. It could be the switch is about gone too. Did you check the ground wire from the switch box to the frame, clean and all that? Is the coil wired correctly? |
Posted By: papa bear
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2018 at 2:41pm
| leon Im not sure exactly what you are saying to do. It sounds like you are wanting me to basically bypass the switch and put wires direct from battery to the coil, is that what are you saying? I checked the timing and it should be close enough to start I couldn't get a light on it since I put the loader back on the day it was running good. I will check the switch wire when I get home but it seems to me since there is a good spark when you arc the wire to the block the ground wire shouldn't be the issue unless I am wrong. I will try all of these suggestions and report back. Thanks for the help guys. |
Posted By: JC-WI
Date Posted: 04 Aug 2019 at 10:43pm
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Papa Bear, Did you ever figure your problem out? Looks like Leon was thinking you were messing with a WD or something when he was talking about the switch box attached to the battery box. ------------- He who says there is no evil has already deceived himself The truth is the truth, sugar coated or not. Trawler II says, "Remember that." |
Posted By: frnkeore
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2019 at 1:16am
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No one has mentioned the coil. Try replacing it. I've had coil issues and they can be intermittent and frustrating. If you have another car or tractor, pull one off of it, to see if it correct the problem, before buying one. If the coil that you test with, takes straight 12V, then run a direct wire to it, while testing. ------------- Frank 1959 D17 Series I #24001+, '59 D14 '55 & '59 Ford 850 & 861 Ferguson TO 35 Deluxe, Oliver 70 and 5 more. |