WD45 Cam Degreeing
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Other Topics
Forum Name: Pulling Forum
Forum Description: Forum dedicated to Tractor and Garden Pulling
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=131382
Printed Date: 24 Nov 2024 at 6:13am
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Topic: WD45 Cam Degreeing
Posted By: MMWD45
Subject: WD45 Cam Degreeing
Date Posted: 15 Nov 2016 at 3:29pm
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I am currently building a WD45 and had a cam ground by cam crafters and now its come to put the engine back together. I have built a few engines in my life and I am familiar with the concept but I am not confident in degreeing this cam in this engine. I have the cam with the bolt on style gear and not sure how to adjust cam timing other then jumping a whole tooth and I am sure that's going to be too much. I live in eastern PA near Reading or Allentown. Anybody know of any Allis Mechanics who could help out with this?
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Replies:
Posted By: CAL(KS)
Date Posted: 15 Nov 2016 at 3:40pm
I have yet to do one but I was going to have the holes in the cam gear machined to allow for adjustment and lock it there
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Me -C,U,UC,WC,WD45,190XT,TL-12,145T,HD6G,HD16,HD20
Dad- WD, D17D, D19D, RT100A, 7020, 7080,7580, 2-8550's, 2-S77, HD15
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Posted By: PaulB
Date Posted: 15 Nov 2016 at 4:04pm
The bolt on gear just needs the hole made into slots to get things were you want it. Then drill for a pin to keep it there. I'm in Maryland just below Gettysburg if you want to come here for help.
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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY
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Posted By: dgerth
Date Posted: 15 Nov 2016 at 7:47pm
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Paul, Would it be possible to mill down the crank gear to be able to rotate the gear the correct direction, with helical gears, not straight cut. dan
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Posted By: PaulB
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2016 at 6:02am
That may possibly work, although I've made a jig to cut a new keyway in the gears. This works for all the BE, CE, 138, 149, 160 engines as the cam gear is the same for all. I have to assemble everything check what the degree is, calculate the change is needed, then skip a couple of teeth and cut the new keyway. You could also use an offset key like is available for racecars. I've found that generally about a half a tooth is needed.
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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY
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Posted By: WF owner
Date Posted: 16 Nov 2016 at 7:45pm
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I saw a recent post about using an offset key instead of advancing a full tooth. Where would a person find an offset key?
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Posted By: mgburchard
Date Posted: 20 Nov 2016 at 7:18pm
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purchase a chevy cam dowel and set of degree bushings drill cam and gear while bolted together then remove gear slot holes in gear install dowel in cam drill gear to accept bushing and you can advance or retard up to 8 degrees , If you have any other questions facebook Andy Broome.
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Posted By: wi50
Date Posted: 21 Nov 2016 at 9:31am
I've made offset keys, its not that hard. I bought a bag of keys from mcmaster carr, much thicker than the original, the correct diameter. I think a bag of 50 or 100 was only $7 or something. Now I can simply mill one side and the other side to get the desired offset and thickness to fit the original keyways. On larger keys of odd size, I'll make them from scratch from a peice of round stock and mill away half.
The other option is cutting a new keyway in the gear or camshaft. I made a little fixture to fit in the bore of the gear, it has a small degree wheel and a pointer, the fixture has a slot for a broach. Now I can simply cut a new keyway at the desired degree marking, but I cut them off by several teeth. But I engrave the gear as per the new timing marks and cross out the old ones to eliminate confusion.
On the bolt on gears, I just take a stack of gears and put them on the turn table and slot the holes, then simply set it where I want and lock them down.
You MUST take the shaft diameter into consideration when making the offset keys..... or using a bushing. Some people aren't bright enough to realize this and will try and argue that a chevy bushing is 2,4,6, or 8 degrees no matter where it is placed, with no reguard to distance from center. (we've covered this before) On a chevrolet camshaft, that bushing is .785" from center, (if memory serves me correct). You can't place it that close on the allis camshaft, as the hole in the center of the gear is to large, it must be placed out further, so it's advertised offset will be something else other than what it's advertised to be.
For some examples,
If a shaft is 1" in diameter, it has a circumfrence of 3.14", there is 360 degrees in 3.14" so .008722" is one degree. Or say a shaft has a 2" diameter it would take .01744" to make one degree of offset.
If my memory serves me the allis cam nose is 1.625" on these engines. Meaning that .014" is one degree, (1.625" X 3.14 = 5.10" divided by 360 degrees in a circle = .014") so to move the camshaft 6 degrees I would make a key with a .085" offset.
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"see what happens when you have no practical experience doing something...... you end up playing with calculators and looking stupid on the internet"
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Posted By: mgburchard
Date Posted: 21 Nov 2016 at 10:46am
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Andy Broome has one of the famous run straight up cams from bullet his cam installed that way was so retarded the header glows red at idle .with simple hand tools he was able to degree cam in on 105 using dowel and bushings
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