Rebuilding an eng., need help
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Other Topics
Forum Name: Pulling Forum
Forum Description: Forum dedicated to Tractor and Garden Pulling
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=126464
Printed Date: 28 Nov 2024 at 3:25am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Rebuilding an eng., need help
Posted By: NDBirdman
Subject: Rebuilding an eng., need help
Date Posted: 28 Jul 2016 at 9:41am
|
I am in the process of rebuilding a WD45 eng. After reading all the threads, my head is spinning. So I'll ask for help here. The plan for this tractor, use will be around farmstead, light work and for raking/baling small square straw bales. I doubt this tractor will be entered into tractor pulls but I won't say never, may do it some day for the experience. So, not needed to be a speed queen, torque monster, etc. I would like to see it running 50-55 horsies just so she has a little more umph, but I will be very happy with what I get. IF I can find a place to test/rebuild ginnys and starters, would be nice. I have not decided if I will stay 6v or go to 12v. I'm wanting to stay original if possible. One has good paint, another one if I decide to put her back together has nice patina, not rusted out bad. Mostly will be workers so show queens they will not be. Don't take offense for those that paint them up, I like those too, I just don't see doing that then working them hard in the hay-field again. I also want to keep it good on gas usage. Head is being machined/rebuilt to stock specs. Crank is getting turned to stock specks, no stroking. I'm in the process of tearing down another eng. to get a good cam/gear as the first one was rusted too bad, lobes pretty much gone. What grind would be best? Stock, D17, 175, etc? Eng block has been checked by machinist, says it's good to go, no cracks, deck flat. No sleeves/pistons yet. Block did not come with sleeves and my pistons were bad shape, tossed them. Should I get 4 1/8th over pistons/sleeves, stock 4 inch, I've read propane sleeves/pistons? No flat tops, dish pistons wanted. Hot rod need not apply is how I will put it. What size/setup, brand, etc and who has them? Cam bearings are also rusted/bad, will need new ones. Also do not have eng. gasket kit yet, get from who? Agco or one of our site sponsors, good set need apply. Note: I used to rebuild engines, mild hot rods, 40 years back. I have forgotten most of that info I once had. This is the first eng. I'm rebuilding in 40 years so I'm sure if ya'll don't mind I'm going to have LOTS of questions as I go. I'm reading/learning from the 201 eng. build thread. Is the 226 eng. pretty much the same? Thanks for ya'lls help, it is and will be greatly appreciated! ------------- 1955 WD45 S#205467, 190XT #6652 DXT |
Replies:
Posted By: CAL(KS)
Date Posted: 28 Jul 2016 at 9:52am
|
per Dr Allis post the 4'' agco pistons will use less fuel and have more power than the after market 4 1/8 with reduced compression ratio the 175 grind I believe is best of the 226's but dont know if it would matter much in a stock engine. building a 226 almost identical to 201 ------------- Me -C,U,UC,WC,WD45,190XT,TL-12,145T,HD6G,HD16,HD20 Dad- WD, D17D, D19D, RT100A, 7020, 7080,7580, 2-8550's, 2-S77, HD15 |
Posted By: DSeries4
Date Posted: 31 Jul 2016 at 9:50am
|
I would go with any of the kits offered by vendors here, I am sure they would be of good quality. Since you are not planning to do any heavy tillage, I would not bother trying to reach for 55 hp - don't need it for haying, you will just end up using more gas. Talk to people around your area to find someone that works on starters and gennys. There is an auto electric place close to me that I take all my starters and generators to (first thing I do with every new tractor I get). Then you know what you have. I converted my WD45 to 12 volts - I got the generator rewired to 12 volts and replaced the cutout with a voltage regulator. No muss no fuss! I don't believe in putting on alternators on old tractors. ------------- '49 G, '54 WD45, '55 CA, '56 WD45D, '57 WD45, '58 D14, '59 D14, '60 D14, '61 D15D, '66 D15II, '66 D21II, '67 D17IV, '67 D17IVD, '67 190XTD, '73 620, '76 185, '77 175, '84 8030, '85 6080 |
Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 31 Jul 2016 at 12:51pm
| if you put higher comp pistons than original you will likely find 6V wont start it hot. |
Posted By: WF owner
Date Posted: 31 Jul 2016 at 4:50pm
|
The 201 engine is very similar to the 226. The 201 has a 4" bore and 4" stroke with (usually) a 3' head. The 226 is also a 4" bore but the crankshaft is a 4.5" stroke and the 226 has a 4" head. The 201 has a removable cover on the right side that the 226 does not have. Many of the parts are interchangeable between the two engines. Judging by your post, I would recommend a 7.25/1 compression, 4.125" bore piston set, like the Reliance kit that has been discussed in the forum a lot, specifying the main and rod bearings that your machinist says you need based on the crankshaft resurfacing. It's a good quality rebuild set that will have a little more power than the stock, 4" kit. As far as a cam goes, I would look for a direct replacement for the engine you have. Make sure the cam gear is the same number as your present cam. (Some later 226 engines used different cam/crank gears.) If you want an aftermarket cam, you will probably need to have a cam ground to 175 specs and it will cost you about $250. If max power is your goal, it may be worth it, but, based on your post, I would look for a used replacement cam for the engine you presently have. THese engines don't mormally wear cams much, but you definitely need to change the cam bearings while you are rebuilding it. The 4", 8.25/1 (propane) set will cost you about $900 (or more) for a rebuild set. If maximum power was your goal, it might be worth paying the extra, but you don't indicate that is your goal.
|
Posted By: NDBirdman
Date Posted: 31 Jul 2016 at 7:20pm
I've tried, no one in my area does them. I've talked to the auto parts stores, they all say the last place to rebuild them no longer does it. I'm not giving up, I *might* have found a guy bout 80 miles from me that will check the ginnys but says if it's bad, I'm outa luck. Not going to give up, gotta be someone out there that still knows how. ------------- 1955 WD45 S#205467, 190XT #6652 DXT |
DSeries4 wrote:Posted By: NDBirdman
Date Posted: 31 Jul 2016 at 7:21pm
Kinda my thought, I think I'm leaning real hard on just going back together as stock as I can, now to just find the parts. ------------- 1955 WD45 S#205467, 190XT #6652 DXT |
Posted By: AaronSEIA
Date Posted: 31 Jul 2016 at 7:30pm
|
Starter will be fine for years running 12v with no change. Steve at B&B Custom Circuits here can do anything you want done to the starter or Genny. Just as well bolt on as much power as you wish you had. No point opening her up in a year because you decided to pull a time or two and wish you had dropped those better pistons in. A WD45 making stock horse isn't going to be any more efficient than a WD45 making 55 horse to notice the extra gas. Without looking, Id bet a D17 is more fuel efficient than a WD45 anyway. AaronSEIA |
Posted By: WF owner
Date Posted: 31 Jul 2016 at 7:32pm
|
For your starter and generator needs, contact Steve at www.bb-customcircuits.com/
Steve is a supporter of this forum
and does quality work.
|
Posted By: Allis dave
Date Posted: 01 Aug 2016 at 7:37am
|
I don't think a 175 cam will help you unless you're going to up the rpm's a lot and run a bigger carb. Bill Deppe on here has a lot of used parts and has cams reasonably priced. If you need his contact info send me a PM. A generator or alternator is your decision. Alternators aren't original, but they are cheaper and work well. This really should be in the farm section since this isn't a pulling tractor. |
Posted By: NDBirdman
Date Posted: 01 Aug 2016 at 8:01pm
Your right, my bad. Moderators feel free to move it. Thanks. ------------- 1955 WD45 S#205467, 190XT #6652 DXT |
Posted By: NDBirdman
Date Posted: 01 Aug 2016 at 8:08pm
That brings up another question. I've been offered a new set of sleeves/pistons, etc that are for a D-17. These would drop in like the 45 sets and be close to the same, maybe a few more horses without killing the fuel bill? And if it's a good thing to do, what should the cam be ground to, D17 specs? Or just use the cam stock as is? I'm removing the cam from a donor eng. I have. Besides hay'n, she will probably end up with a snow blower for winter duty. I want to have plenty of power for that also without going hot rod. ------------- 1955 WD45 S#205467, 190XT #6652 DXT |
Posted By: AaronSEIA
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2016 at 5:56am
|
The WD45, all D17's and 170 used the same cam. I'm not sure they changed the profile until the 175. Unless you are going to turn more rpm's I'm not sure you need a regrind. AaronSEIA |
Posted By: NDBirdman
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2016 at 9:20am
No, I don't have any reason to increase rpm so I'll just make sure the cam I'm removing is in good shape and re-use it. It has been a long time since I have worked a 45, last farm work I did on an allis was with the 100 series. I do remember the 45 had plenty of power for the tasks it was used for at the time. From all the reading and comments on here, I will use the oil pump and cam gear from this eng also. The head and crank from the old eng is being rebuilt/ground so those will be good to go. I'll also use the pushrods/lifters from the donor eng. ------------- 1955 WD45 S#205467, 190XT #6652 DXT |
Posted By: WF owner
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2016 at 10:50am
| Just a word of caution about mixing parts from another engine. Some later engines had different cam gears, oil pumps, crankshafts, etc. Make sure the parts you are switching are the same as the ones you are replacing. |
Posted By: NDBirdman
Date Posted: 03 Aug 2016 at 8:13pm
Thanks. I have all those in an engine I'm tearing down for parts. I will make sure to use all the parts so there is no problem if need be. I am having a crank turned, I will have to make sure it's right, if not, I'll have the other crank turned. The crank getting worked is out of a '55, the engine parts are out of a '57. I bought a bare block from a guy in Michigan, I will have to find the numbers on it and see if I can figure out what year it is. I'm hoping the differences are all visible? ------------- 1955 WD45 S#205467, 190XT #6652 DXT |
Posted By: AaronSEIA
Date Posted: 04 Aug 2016 at 5:24am
|
If both engines are WD45 engines, then you are fine. When you start talking about using D17, 170, or 175 parts in a WD or WD45 block, then you need to worry about what fits. AaronSEIA |
Posted By: Don(MO)
Date Posted: 04 Aug 2016 at 6:05am
|
If you are still trying to sort-out what parts to use in your rebuild send me a PM and I will help you out. Don ------------- 3 WD45's with power steering,G,D15 fork lift,D19, W-Speed Patrol, "A" Gleaner with a 330 corn head,"66" combine,roto-baler, and lots of Snap Coupler implements to make them work for their keep. |
Posted By: NDBirdman
Date Posted: 07 Aug 2016 at 9:56am
Thanks, might have to do that. I have not had time to pull the donor apart yet. Had a garage roof self destruct in a storm, almost finished repairing that. Barley is getting cut here now, boss man wants me in the field, might be winter before I can get back to it. ------------- 1955 WD45 S#205467, 190XT #6652 DXT |