turbo
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Other Topics
Forum Name: Pulling Forum
Forum Description: Forum dedicated to Tractor and Garden Pulling
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=114288
Printed Date: 25 Nov 2024 at 9:47am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: turbo
Posted By: 200 allis
Subject: turbo
Date Posted: 05 Nov 2015 at 6:51pm
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Anyone run borg warner s300 turbo on Allis 301. Any advice on it.
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Replies:
Posted By: jwbigbaddodge540hp
Date Posted: 06 Nov 2015 at 9:16am
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I have been looking at the same turbo for my 301 with 7080 tips and pump set at 250cc of fuel and turning 3000rpm, here's what I have looked at its a Borg warner s300gx its for a 1994-2002 dodge Cummins it will support up too 400hp I have a friend that big in the truck and diesel drag racing industry builds lots of turbos for people out there sized this up for me on my specs it looks like it would do fine, I think injected ED on here runs a s300 on his allis 220,here's what I have ran in the past t04b480 airesearch clamp on v band style compressor housing junk!! here's what I have been running the last part of the season airesearch t04b35 its a 62mm inducer 70mm exducer 57 trim wheel with 60 to 1 housing, turbine side is 70 mm inducer to 65mm exducer p wheel with a 81 air ratio housing seems to run strong it was build for the 6.2 chevy diesel as a aftermarket turbo kit by ATS and Banks some IH dt466 used them as well, it would be nice if some people shared there set up on there 301 as well not like we all live with in 50 mile from each other and pull against one other, for sure theres someone out there that has some info on this for us. ps this turbo I am run looks factory as well, same look at a t04b80 with the 60to1 compressor housing.
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Posted By: 200 allis
Date Posted: 06 Nov 2015 at 12:37pm
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I am running holset hx35 with 12cm exhaust housing ran really well just think I would have to increase if I go with 450 head.
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Posted By: O.P.S. Heads
Date Posted: 06 Nov 2015 at 3:04pm
If you go with a .450 pump I would move up to an HX40. At least two different turbine wheels to pick from, a few different turbine housings, and a few different compressor combinations. If you use a .450 pump, an intercooler, have the cylinder head ported and run open RPM you might even try a 65mm HX50 but that would be pushing it with the Roosa pump. Use a tight turbine housing on whatever you choose.
Nothing wrong the a S300 either, I'm just a fan of the Holsets.
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Posted By: 200 allis
Date Posted: 06 Nov 2015 at 5:29pm
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Has anyone used the hybrid hx40 with hx 35 exhaust side
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Posted By: jwbigbaddodge540hp
Date Posted: 06 Nov 2015 at 5:56pm
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Just about any way you go you will be a head of a airesearch turbo hers the specs for a hx35 57mm inducer with a 60mm exducer 574cfm max power it can support 330hp hx 40 flows 763cfm it will support 440 hp max according to holset what you want to run is up to you, if it was me I would go no bigger than a 62mm inducer and a 14cm housing the hx40 would give you the best of both worlds really 60mm inducer and a 14cm housing should run pretty sweet what kind of power are you make with your hx35 know? p.o.s heads has the right idea on the exhaust housing stay small with the hx40 stay around 14cm a 12cm housing you may drive it to the choke point or worse pop one of the wheels in it from over driving it, stay away from the hx35 40 hybrid's they are famous for busting shafts when they get barked seen several die this death in my early diesel truck pulling days its not very pretty at all, what makes them do this is you have a big wheel on the inducer side and a small shaft from a hx35 on the exducer side im not say you could break it but not worth the chance of really messing up a good engine,they are well know to be weak.
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Posted By: 200 allis
Date Posted: 06 Nov 2015 at 6:54pm
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Thanks u been big help maybe I try hx40 I have one off are magnum that dropped a valve. I'll have it rebuilt and try it.
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Posted By: O.P.S. Heads
Date Posted: 06 Nov 2015 at 6:57pm
The shaft size for a 35 and 40 are the same. Same rebuild kit, same 7mm compressor wheel bore, same thing. The turbine wheel(s) for a 40 are larger.
I would not use the 35 / 40 hybrid. Not enough turbine wheel to turn it effectively. Dodge pickup and Jap car tuner forum pipe dream.
It all depends on fuel delivery, cylinder head flow, intercooler or not, open RPM vs. 3,000. There are a few important variables for deciding the correct turbo.
If you stay with the same pump I wouldn't change a thing. If you go to a .450 then a larger turbo would do you some good or at a minimum a looser turbine housing should be used on your existing turbo.
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Posted By: jwbigbaddodge540hp
Date Posted: 06 Nov 2015 at 9:47pm
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Hey o.p.s I'm sorry I just caught a mistake in one of my writings on here and called you p.o.s I'm sorry I was not bad mouthing you at all I don't want to make any enemy's on here we all share two loves on this form allis chalmers tractors and pulling them we all have some knowledge in ares some of us don't and that's what makes this site so good we can learn from each other,I have learn from you today after all this year that the hx35 and hx40 use the same shaft didn't even know that I have mostly messed with s300 turbo in my past thanks again for share your knowledge I didn't have and again I'm sorry for my miss spelling of your user name, James Walters
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Posted By: 200 allis
Date Posted: 07 Nov 2015 at 9:58am
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Would a hx40 with 16cm housing be to much with 450 pump apparently 14cm harder to come by
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Posted By: O.P.S. Heads
Date Posted: 07 Nov 2015 at 10:27am
I have heard (never done it) that a T04 turbine housing with minimal machine work can be made to fit the HX40 turbo. Not sure of the TO4 but I am guessing one from a 7080 - 7580 tractor. If that is the case I would use a .81 or .96 A/R housing if using a .450 pump. If you Google this topic you will find it. Again, it depends on open RPM, vs. limited RPM.
Otherwise If you use the Holset housing, anywhere from 12 - 17mm would be the range.
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Posted By: 200 allis
Date Posted: 07 Nov 2015 at 11:11am
Posted By: 8070
Date Posted: 08 Nov 2015 at 7:21pm
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I am run a 301 in my 17 with a DM 4 pump from 7580 and a set of 509 inj a turbo off 3594 case it not in cool it it runs 2650 rpm I run7500 to 8500 out of field and 5000 to 7000 open class here and it does good thinking I going to got to a db 37 on it to get more fuel to it the DM is max out and need more or would u got to a A pump just asking I just start running it this yr
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Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 08 Nov 2015 at 8:55pm
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You need bigger injector tips than "509"'s....you need 4 hole .020" and bottom out the internal leaf springs on that 7580 pump.
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Posted By: 8070
Date Posted: 08 Nov 2015 at 9:10pm
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The pump is build there one more to get the spring or out and gone . What number on the 4 by 20 the 509 or out of a n6 250hp tipes and044 or 275 . That y I was thinking a bad 37 I can get more out that I know or a inline .
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Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 09 Nov 2015 at 7:04am
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4 hole X .020" are custom made and adjust to 2500 to 2800 psi. Bad 370(I think) isn't any better than what you have.
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Posted By: O.P.S. Heads
Date Posted: 09 Nov 2015 at 7:42am
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Ed can get us all right on this but a good DM4631 (7080 - 7580 - n6) injection pump should pump around 300 - 320 cc's I would guess. I seriously doubt a DB370 or even a DB390 would get past 250cc's. Either way I would recommend bigger injectors than the 509's or any stock injector AC would have to offer if you are over 250.
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Posted By: 8070
Date Posted: 09 Nov 2015 at 6:08pm
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OK try guy I look in to it this winter on get bigger inj and see if that will help it out some .
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Posted By: injpumpEd
Date Posted: 10 Nov 2015 at 7:15am
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[QUOTE=O.P.S. Heads]Ed can get us all right on this but a good DM4631 (7080 - 7580 - n6) injection pump should pump around 300 - 320 cc's I would guess. I seriously doubt a DB370 or even a DB390 would get past 250cc's. Either way I would recommend bigger injectors than the 509's or any stock injector AC would have to offer if you are over 250. [/QUOTE
Mike, you are pretty much spot on. BUT, I have done a lot of things to the 310 DM's that did those kinds of numbers. The one Todd(8070) is running is NOT one of my builds.
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210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
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Posted By: Big Orange
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2015 at 10:28pm
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In my area there's a D21 with 3LM466 box turbo, 450 roosa pump, externally pressured, PSI ? 5 hole .020 custom Bosch dual feed injectors, custom registry,hold down plates .093 lines, custom cam. 1.75 rocker arms, stiffer valve springs 3,000 rpms, 12.5 mph, 10,500 lb. class. It rules this class,against IH 466 cu. Am. Bosch pumps, case 504 cu. cases with A pumps.
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Posted By: O.P.S. Heads
Date Posted: 08 Dec 2015 at 1:28pm
The 3LM turbo is a good, durable turbo but they are not efficient by todays standards. You could find a few upgrades that would spool up just as easy if not easier and run much better.
Glad to hear the AC is winning. Be prepared when the red ones and the Case and the Deere's and everyone else with inline pumps figure out how to use what they have. The Roosa is very impressive for something that is just a bit bigger than a beer can, but it won't compare with a properly tuned inline.
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Posted By: Big Orange
Date Posted: 12 Dec 2015 at 12:00am
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The rules for there association,is limited to A 3LM466 box turbos, so that limits the amount of fuel you can burn, to make the HP. So the engines have to be more efficient to make the HP. More cubic inches isn't the answer here, as the turbo, won't have the CFMs. To my way of thinking, it's making the guys with the most engine building ability the winners, as long as the tractor can get the power to the track.
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