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theropod 
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Joined: 28 Sep 2017
Location: Arkansas USA
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 Topic: New Magneto on the Way!
Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 3:55pm |
Hey everyone,
I took the plunge and limbered up that credit card and ordered a new Fairbanks magneto for my B. I got tired of fighting the jerry rigged battery/coil setup, with completely wore our points, and suspect condenser, when the coil I just bought a month or so back went south yesterday. Even bypassing the points and grounding/opening the wire that goes to the points resulted in no spark to a clean plug on the central lead of the coil, and yes I had a ballast resistor in place. I am also ditching the carbon core plug wires and also ordered some silvered copper core bulk wire. I will solder the ends/clips directly to the new soild core wires. I also plan on giving the boots a small bead of red silicone sealer. The plugs I bought at the same time as the coil are Autolite 303’s. Since the engine is not a smoker will these plugs be OK, or should I look for a hotter plug?
Thanks.
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Put the bunny back in the box!
1938 B, 1977 Yanmar YM2200
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chaskaduo
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Joined: 26 Nov 2016
Location: Twin Cities
Points: 5200
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Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 5:23pm |
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How much is a new magneto?????
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dave63
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Joined: 01 Feb 2011
Location: Lineboro Md
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Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 5:30pm |
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New or rebuilt? I was not aware of anyone building "NEW" ones
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The universal answer to all questions is yes, how much do you want to spend?
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theropod
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Joined: 28 Sep 2017
Location: Arkansas USA
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Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 5:59pm |
 dave63 wrote:
New or rebuilt? I was not aware of anyone building "NEW" ones |
Well, rebuilt, but with all new parts. New bearings, points, condenser, coil, caps, rotor, gears and screws. Run tested for over an hour. New to me anyway.
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Put the bunny back in the box!
1938 B, 1977 Yanmar YM2200
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theropod AT yahoo DOT com
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theropod
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Location: Arkansas USA
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Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 6:07pm |
dave63 wrote:
New or rebuilt? I was not aware of anyone building "NEW" ones |
Here is a brand new one. Not a Fairbanks, but a Wico and brand new.
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Put the bunny back in the box!
1938 B, 1977 Yanmar YM2200
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theropod AT yahoo DOT com
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theropod
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Location: Arkansas USA
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Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 6:13pm |
chaskaduo wrote:
How much is a new magneto????? |
Well, mine is going to be rebuilt with all new parts found on ebay for $238.80 including shipping with one year replacement warranty. Run tested for over an hour. New to me, and tractor. Should be here on or before Saturday.
One can buy a NEW Wico, but for major bucks.
Now, does anyone have any input on the plugs?
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Put the bunny back in the box!
1938 B, 1977 Yanmar YM2200
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theropod AT yahoo DOT com
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Hubnut
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Joined: 30 Jul 2014
Location: Gainesville, FL
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Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 8:05pm |
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I'm glad you're getting a new mag. Did you consider going to a distributor? Furthermore, you could get an electronic pickup and do away with the points. I did this on two of my tractors. The distributor is less fickle than the mags--just my opinion.
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1940 B "Lucy"
1941 B w/ Woods L59 "Flavia"
1942 B w/ finish mower "Dick"
1941 C w/ 3-point "Maggie"
1947 C SFW w/ L306 "Trixie"
1972 314H
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Steve in NJ
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Andover, NJ
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Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 8:15pm |
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With Carbon core wires and a ballast resistor no wonder it didn't fire. Autolite 295's is what you want for a Mag fired Tractor. A little warmer plug to work with the Mag.
Steve@B&B
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39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife
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EPALLIS
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Illinois
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Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 8:26pm |
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Good to know that a "new" magneto can still be obtained for a Model B. Great post. Thanks!
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theropod
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Joined: 28 Sep 2017
Location: Arkansas USA
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Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 6:05am |
Steve in NJ wrote:
With Carbon core wires and a ballast resistor no wonder it didn't fire. Autolite 295's is what you want for a Mag fired Tractor. A little warmer plug to work with the Mag.
Steve@B&B
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It did fire. It ran. The resistor was apparently was not high enough ohms. Before the coil blew it made a nice bright blue spark on the plugs. Between a carb with both obvious and hidden freeze cracks, and the cobbled together ignition system, it’s a small wonder I got it to run at all. If nothing else I have beefed up my arms cranking the dang thing! With the water in the crankcase that inconsistent run condition was a blessing in disguise.
I will go buy those 295’s today if my parts store has them. If not it’s a 35 mile one way trip to a town with a real parts store. The reason I bought the 303’s was because that was what was in it. I just figured I needed to stick with what worked at one time. Remember that I started this project before finding this forum, and was completely on my own.
I would have bought the mag from you but I just forgot, to be honest. I am getting close to losing my weather window, and am in a rush/panic to get the old beast to make noise before it’s just too nasty outside. I have several other irons in the fire as living off the grid presents seasonal issues most folks never face. For example I need to drag out the ditches on our .6 mile private road with my Yanmar today as they are full of leaves. Then there is the fact that it is deer season and I am spending a few hours every day taking my rifle on a walk.
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Put the bunny back in the box!
1938 B, 1977 Yanmar YM2200
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theropod AT yahoo DOT com
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theropod
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Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 6:36am |
Hubnut wrote:
I'm glad you're getting a new mag. Did you consider going to a distributor? Furthermore, you could get an electronic pickup and do away with the points. I did this on two of my tractors. The distributor is less fickle than the mags--just my opinion.
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My main reason for going back with a mag is to do away with the battery. The ugly box/rack my father-in-law hung on the tractor is an eyesore I want gone. Since the 38 isn‘t really set up for attaching an alternator easily I would have to remove, recharge and reinstall the battery every time I wanted to start it. That’s hard on the battery, cables and my old back! I am under the impression that the impulse “snap” of a magneto allows for easier starting in my hand crank only tractor as there is a built in timing retardation at cranking speed. Is this feature even possible with a distributor?
Then there is the consideration of at least trying to put the tractor back to some semblance of an original state. A distributor, to me, would look out of place. No more use than I expect to put on the tractor this mag ought to outlast my old self.
I may well look into an electronic conversion at some point down the road, but as I mentioned to Steve I am facing a time window. We are experiencing an unusually dry fall or this whole effort would be on hold until spring. I am not confident the tractor’s engine will survive much longer without some run time to loosen up gunk and dry out the water I know is still hidden away in passages and stuck to various parts.
This is my first attempt at restoring an old tractor, and I am probably making all sorts of mistakes. It seems I learn best by screwing up, and this may be a glaring example.
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Put the bunny back in the box!
1938 B, 1977 Yanmar YM2200
No private messages:
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theropod AT yahoo DOT com
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Gerald J.
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Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 8:26am |
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A relatively modern distributor will have centrifugal advance and can retard for hand cranking. Varying the timing with the engine speed that the magneto doesn't do other than the extreme retard of the impulse starter give better engine performance over the working speed range. The magneto impulse mechanism not only retards spark for safer hand cranking, it shoves the rotor past ignition much faster than then cranking speed to generate more voltage in the coil for much better cranking ignition.
The resistor wires may have let the coil generate enough voltage that its high voltage insulation was overwhelmed and that is what failed, not a wiring.
Gerald J.
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theropod
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Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 9:10am |
Gerald J. wrote:
A relatively modern distributor will have centrifugal advance and can retard for hand cranking. Varying the timing with the engine speed that the magneto doesn't do other than the extreme retard of the impulse starter give better engine performance over the working speed range. The magneto impulse mechanism not only retards spark for safer hand cranking, it shoves the rotor past ignition much faster than then cranking speed to generate more voltage in the coil for much better cranking ignition.
The resistor wires may have let the coil generate enough voltage that its high voltage insulation was overwhelmed and that is what failed, not a wiring.
Gerald J.
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Sigh,
Now I have conflicting opinions to address. I was told that going back to a mag would be better, and safer, with a hand crank engine on this very forum.
The coil I bought from a NAPA dealer was supposed to be used with modern leads, and I bought the coil, wires and plugs all at the same time. The counter guys at that parts store listened carefully and seemed more knowledgeable than the kids usually found at such stores. If I had taken their advice and bought the matching resistor for the coil it would probably have been fine. I think the resistor I have was intended for a 6 volt battery and I used the 12 volt battery out of my pickup. I just went out and measured it’s resistance and it comes out at 2.1 ohms. The voltage drop across the resistor from a 14.12 volt power supply is only 14.09, which is WAY above what the coil can take. The coil resistance between the small leads is 1.7 ohms, and the resistance between either the positive or negative small lugs and the main discharge lead is infinite.
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Put the bunny back in the box!
1938 B, 1977 Yanmar YM2200
No private messages:
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theropod AT yahoo DOT com
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HoughMade
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Joined: 22 Sep 2017
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Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 9:25am |
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A good running, properly maintained and adjusted magneto will be just fine. Go with what you ordered.
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1951 B
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chaskaduo
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Joined: 26 Nov 2016
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Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 9:50am |
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Thanks Theropod. I knew what you meant by new magneto. I think that is a good price. I might have get one just for a spare.
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AllisFreak MN
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Joined: 07 Dec 2009
Location: Minnesota
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Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 5:44pm |
I was able to buy a brand new, not used, Wico from our local mag rebuilder for $325 with a core traded in. I liked it so much on my '49 WD that I bought another one for the '51 WD. They have never run so nice as long as I can remember and both tractors have been in the family since new and I'm no spring chicken! I was always told that a well tuned magneto will spark hotter than a 12 volt distributor ignition, is that true?
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'49 A-C WD, '51 A-C WD, '63 A-C D17 Series III, 1968 A-C One-Seventy, '82 A-C 6060, '75 A-C 7040, A-C #3 sickle mower, 2 A-C 701 wagons, '78 Gleaner M2
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theropod
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Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 6:12pm |
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After calling my local NAPA store today they informed me they do have the Autolite 295’s and have set aside 4 for me I will pick up tomorrow. Cleaned and tinned the terminals saved from my resistor wires in anticipation of soldering them to the wire core coming. Saved the new boots from those resistor wires too. Turned the engine to TDC on #1 after another extended cranking session. I also took the edge of a file and made small marks/notches on the crank pulley for both TDC and FIRE. Looking for the stamped marks through that hole in the torque tube is downright silly. A spot welded pointer on the front cover would have made that job a breeze. If I ever have that cover off one will be added, but for now I just used straight up from the center of the bore. The fresh oil is making a difference as without the plugs I can easily crank the beast with one hand, and that wasn’t possible a week ago.
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Put the bunny back in the box!
1938 B, 1977 Yanmar YM2200
No private messages:
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theropod AT yahoo DOT com
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