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Kohler k241 carb issues?

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Ryan310 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan310 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Kohler k241 carb issues?
    Posted: 23 Nov 2021 at 9:13am
Hello this is my first post on here. I just bought an allis chalmers 310. The guy said he had I running and was using it this past summer before he parked it. When I went to look at it the only way I could get it started was with a rag soaked in gas held over the carburetor. I got it home and drained all the old gas pulled all the fuel lines off, blew them out. I replaced the fuel filter. Also I took the bowl off of the carburetor and cleaned it up. With some fresh gas it fired up and ran great. Now this is where I'm stumped. After it warms up it no longer wants to idle and when I try to throttle it up it tries to dye and backfires. I've tried adjusting the carb to factory settings and can to get it to run fine for a little while. After a bit it will start running rough again. I was able to get it to stay running by turning the main needle on top of the carb in to 3/4 of a turn out and it ran fine that way for a little. Do I need to rebuild this carb? Find a new one? Or is there anything else I should try?
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Steve in NJ View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve in NJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Nov 2021 at 5:58pm
Sounds to me like you need to stick a new spark plug in it. Then see how it runs. If it has a Champion in it, throw it away no matter what and put a real spark plug in it like an NGK, Autolite, or AC equivilent.
Steve@B&B
39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife
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AC720Man View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AC720Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Nov 2021 at 9:12pm
Good point Steve, they are junk. I have had an air leak cause the same issue. Check the gasket where the carb attaches to the block or at the carb/air cleaner. Or if it has a vacuum line going to the block.
1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Ryan310 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan310 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2021 at 7:59am
Thanks for the replies. I believe it has an autolite in it already but I planned on getting a new one. They were sold out of the ngks when I stopped the other day. And I did have the carb off so I may not have got the gasket back in the proper place so I will check that out as well.
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Dusty MI View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dusty MI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2021 at 8:43am
What happened to Champion plugs? Back in the late 50's and into the 60's, Champions were the plugs to have. 
917 H, '48 G, '65 D-10 series III "Allis Express"
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PaulB View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PaulB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2021 at 6:31pm
In the early 70s we could go to a local wholesaler in town and get a box of 10 Champions. You could bet that at least 2 would be bad new in the box, you had to find out which ones yourself. Now you might be lucky to get 1 good one from 10. 
If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere. If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY
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DaveKamp View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DaveKamp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 6:50pm
Most carbeurator problems are ignition related.  Most ignition problems are fuel related... Wink

Champions used to be great, they're are absolute junk now.  If you have one in a running engine, take an oilcan and drip a little oil at the base of the insulator while it's running, you'll see it leaking compression right through the crimp.  I had one crimp fail on the 350 in one of my boats, it spat MOST of the core out into the bilge, but a fragment did NOT go out, instead, it buried into the piston, and opened up the #1 cylinder wall.  Ruined the engine, bent the rod and crank.  No more!

The K-series Kohler has other habits that you should be aware....

The ignition points and condenser are frequent suspects.  The points are unique in that the SPRING for the points, are IN the ignition circuit.  THat means, when the points are CLOSED, current flows from the coil, through the screw terminal, through the SPRING, to the moving contact, which then contacts ground.

The problem here, is that if you leave the key on for any length of time, AND the engine is NOT running, AND the points are closed, that spring represents a load resistance, hence, it gets hot.

When you heat up a spring, it becomes un-springy.  This results in an engine that will start, and run, but not run much past idle, all because 1) the points don't close tight and 2) will not cycle FAST ENOUGH to speed up... instead, they 'FLOAT', just like valve float.

Solution here is... at LEAST... replace points and condenser.  Usual warnings of modern ignition 'kits' being low grade import, and frequently the condensers are junk right out-of-the-box, so don't be surprised if you get a bad one.

The ignition COIL of a K-series looks like any OTHER cylindrical coil, but it is NOT.  a 4, 6, or 8 cylinder coil operates in an entirely different electrical circumstance than a single-cyl... a 4, for example, fires TWICE in each revolution... a SIX fires THREE times, while an 8 fires 4 times.  The K-series single fires ONCE... EVERY OTHER ROTATION.  This means, that at any given speed, the K-series coil is spending a considerably larger amount of time with the points closed (longer dwell) than any other application.

Longer dwell time at slow speed means considerably more heat developed... and the K-series is a vibratory torture platform for ignition coils and carbs, so don't use a generic coil... it will die very young.

The K-series, like any OTHER flathead, is subject to carbon gak buildup on the exhaust valve stem.  When the engine is cold, it will seem okay, but once you get it warmed up, that gak will start to bind up the valve stem to guide, and the valve will fail to SEAT... and the result is a loss of compression pressure, poor scavenging, and no power.  This usually happens when you're doing real work, and once it starts fussing, if you throttle it down, it'll idle (because the valve has more time to close), but you just can't get it back up to working. 

Solution:  Get yourself a bottle of Marvel Mystery Oil... and dump about three shot-glasses worth into a gallon fuel tank.  When you run it, the whole yard will smell 'minty', and the mosquito population will go away soon... it WILL clean up the valve stem about halfway, and if you do that every 6-10 tank fulls, it'll be perpetually fine.  If you choose to pull the engine down partially for a cleanup, yank the exhaust valve, chuck it in a cordless drill and introduce it to the wire wheel with a spritz of carb cleaner... and if you can find a proper guide cleaning tool, that'll do well for getting the ID of the guides clean.

Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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DaveKamp View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DaveKamp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 6:51pm
BTW... don't let anyone tell you that the K241 can't make power... Wink  But don't stand too close to my Cub Cadet 109 when I wind it up for a pull...  just sayin'...
Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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Ryan310 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan310 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2021 at 10:35am
Thanks for the replies guys. I just pulled all the gas line off, carburetor, and spark plug out. I noticed some of the gas line is deteriorating and the carb has some junk in it. And it has a champion plug that looked pretty rough and does not seem to be getting spark all the time. So I am going to start with those things and see what happens. It was running fine when I first got it so I think coil condenser and points are all fine.
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