Has anyone fixed old gauges?

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   Hi all, 

Might be a silly question, but has anyone had any success fixing old gauges themselfs?
The reason I ask is on the 49 C I recently got, the oil pressure gauge dosn't work.  The needle dosn't move at all when you start tractor, rev the engine up, etc...  We unscrewed the gauge briefly while engine was running, and oil came out, so there must be some pressure, right? (has to be, or the engine would have seized by now, LOL!)

Has anyone cleaned up the gauge and got them working, etc...?  Mabey it's just crud on the back of the gauge?  How exactly do these gauges work?  I haven't had the oppertunity to check it out yet, but I figgured I'd ask to see of anyone had any tips or recomendations (besides replacing the gauge, which I will probably end up doing).

I also ask, because with the spare parts I got with the tractor, there is a temp gauge but the dial is 1/3 full of oil.  (I think there was oil in the bottom of the bucket it was in at one point) Any suggestions on getting it out?  The temp gauges don't come apart any way do they?  Would drilling the tinyest hole possible hurt anyting?  And on a kinda related note, can you check the accuracy of a temp gauge by putting the bottom in a pan of water and heating it up, etc...?

Just some random thoughts and questions I had today.  I really need to get a project out here to keep me occupied! LOL!

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Edited by Jacob (WI,ND) - 27 Sep 2009 at 3:14pm

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	The Forum	Parts and Services	Unofficial Allis Store	Tractor Shows	Serial Numbers	History

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Jacob (WI,ND) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Kenmare, ND Points: 1246	Post Options Post Reply Quote Jacob (WI,ND) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: Has anyone fixed old gauges? Posted: 27 Sep 2009 at 3:13pm
	Hi all, Might be a silly question, but has anyone had any success fixing old gauges themselfs? The reason I ask is on the 49 C I recently got, the oil pressure gauge dosn't work. The needle dosn't move at all when you start tractor, rev the engine up, etc... We unscrewed the gauge briefly while engine was running, and oil came out, so there must be some pressure, right? (has to be, or the engine would have seized by now, LOL!) Has anyone cleaned up the gauge and got them working, etc...? Mabey it's just crud on the back of the gauge? How exactly do these gauges work? I haven't had the oppertunity to check it out yet, but I figgured I'd ask to see of anyone had any tips or recomendations (besides replacing the gauge, which I will probably end up doing). I also ask, because with the spare parts I got with the tractor, there is a temp gauge but the dial is 1/3 full of oil. (I think there was oil in the bottom of the bucket it was in at one point) Any suggestions on getting it out? The temp gauges don't come apart any way do they? Would drilling the tinyest hole possible hurt anyting? And on a kinda related note, can you check the accuracy of a temp gauge by putting the bottom in a pan of water and heating it up, etc...? Just some random thoughts and questions I had today. I really need to get a project out here to keep me occupied! LOL!
	Jacob Swanson 1920 6-12; 1925,1926 20-35 longfenders; 1925,1926 15-25's; 1927,1929 20-35 shortfenders; C; B's; IB; WC's; WD; WD45

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Brian Jasper co. Ia Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Prairie City Ia Points: 10508	Post Options Post Reply Quote Brian Jasper co. Ia Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 27 Sep 2009 at 3:26pm
	Pretty sure they are "bourdon tube". If it's full of oil, the tube has probably ruptured. The chances of it being accurate if you were able to repair it probably aren't very high. Replacements with "Allis-Chalmers" on the face are readily available and not very expensive.
	"Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford

Coke-in-MN Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Afton MN Points: 41572	Post Options Post Reply Quote Coke-in-MN Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 27 Sep 2009 at 3:29pm
	Most gauges use a bourton tube on the inside that expands under pressure, as the tube is C shaped the one end is hooked by linkage to lever of the needle. The lower end of tube is open to the fluid or material being measured by being attached to the fitting on divice. As the tube moves outward the linkage pulls the lever and registeres the movement in increments on gauge face. Some have mult-linkage inside and may be hooked to a gear drive or just simple folcrum point. Most tubes are empty shells that are calibrated when made, some gauges use glicerine or oil to buffer movement internaly. On some the needle can be removed and re-adjusted to 0 but then a test stand is needd to be sure 0 is 0 and other readings are correct. Rebuilt gauges in the Navy for our fuel system for aircraft fueling stations.
	Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something. "Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful."

Jacob (WI,ND) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Kenmare, ND Points: 1246	Post Options Post Reply Quote Jacob (WI,ND) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 27 Sep 2009 at 5:06pm
	There, now I learned something today. So the oil in the temp gauge is from the gauge going bad then, huh? I would have never guessed that. Nice bit of knowledge to have. I just figgured it got in from the outside somehow. Not really sure I fully understand your explanation Coke without seeing it, but I have a genaral idea now, thanks! Since they don't work, I may have to "take them appart" to see how they is supposed to work, tee hee hee.... Guess I put new oil gauge on my list of things to eventually order... Thanks guys
	Jacob Swanson 1920 6-12; 1925,1926 20-35 longfenders; 1925,1926 15-25's; 1927,1929 20-35 shortfenders; C; B's; IB; WC's; WD; WD45

Adam Stratton Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: SW MO Points: 1363	Post Options Post Reply Quote Adam Stratton Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 27 Sep 2009 at 8:52pm
	I hadnt thought about the accuracy not being right after "fixing them" but I have squirted WD40 or similar in the gauges, then gently blow on it with an air gun (point it away from you in case you give it too much air!), then more penetrating oil, and made them act like they worked.

Chalmersbob Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Pennsylvania Points: 2122	Post Options Post Reply Quote Chalmersbob Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 27 Sep 2009 at 9:15pm
	First I would put the end of temp gauge in some hot water to see if it responds. A pan of water on the stove will work. Secondly, I have screwed a oil gauge into an increaser, then added some lacquer thinner and an air hose connection and gradually increased the air pressure to clean out the gauge. The shook out he thinner. It worked for me, Bob

Coke-in-MN Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Afton MN Points: 41572	Post Options Post Reply Quote Coke-in-MN Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 28 Sep 2009 at 1:59am

	Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something. "Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful."

Gerald J. Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Hamilton Co, IA Points: 5636	Post Options Post Reply Quote Gerald J. Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 28 Sep 2009 at 10:40am
	There are two schemes for a temperature gauge, one involve expanding a liquid in a fixed length tube, the other electrical. Old tractors will not have used the electrical gauge. The expanding liquid gauge expands a liguid in the bulb that is in the water jacket of the engine. If that tube is cut or broken it will not work. It is possible to shorten the thin capilary tube by freezing the liquid and keeping it frozen while cutting and soldering the tube. As for rejuvinating, the gears in a gauge are often tiny and the bearings simple. Little things to get corroded and gunked up. There is not much to damage if the gauge does not work. So while some rust cleaners may stain the scale, they might loosen things up, but the response may be off after a cleaning. These gauges were not the top of the line gauges used in military applications and these were not made to be opened up for repair because they are crimped together. If you can open the crimp and find a replacement you could open them up and fix them and there have been shops offering that service. Today a new gauge from China is ten times cheaper, though not necessarily as good as the original gauge and definitely NOT the original gauge. If you drill a hole to get clearer and lubricant in and out, it would be a good idea to close that hole with a short screw, drop of solder, or drop of epoxy. Solder or epoxy will require a clean surface. Gerald J.

bryani289swmi Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Dorr, MI Points: 491	Post Options Post Reply Quote bryani289swmi Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 28 Sep 2009 at 11:07am
	Jacob, Can't help you much on the intricacies of how the gauges work, but here's a source that might be worth investigating. Evergreen Restoration advertises in Two-Cylinder magazine and repairs, restores gauges. It might be worth a call to gain some information. The guys name is Jerry Trcka, phone 715-635-8629. Good luck. Bryan