Evaluating and researching

Message Topic Search Topic Options Post Reply Create New Topic Printable Version Translate Topic

Hi guys, I have been doing a great deal of research here lately as the rails on my 7G try to drive me out of what little mind I have left.  I did find six links from General Gear and have them here but the rails are and what I have are not sealed just regular old standard link with full length bushings that set into the next link ears. 
I had the replacements broken down to singles for inspections and to ready them for installation to the old rails, pretty weak and there is no way after watching a 100 ton press work to move the pins that I can do anything in the shop at the farm with a sledge to move they or the bushings.

That is when I set to work, I will still rework these for the money it will cost just to keep the machine working but at some point I will have to replace shoes and bolts and eventually the rails.  As you all know they are 7.00 pitch just as the HD6s' and 7's as well the HD11's, the closest I have found of a similar bushing diameter and width of rail I.D. is Cat for a 953.  They are 6.906 pitch, 3/32 shorter from pin to pin than the OE Allis rails, they will be 1/2 inch shorter around the sprocket at 5 links(ten pins) in new condition, a little less closer to 3/8 short with a little bushing wear.  Pins are smaller diameter at 1.44" and the better aspect, SALT rail.  Shoes can be 15" and two or three bar with 5/8 bolting as well they come as a split master link where you don't have to drive pins out to remove.  I am currently working with a contractor that has a few older 953 machines, he has stated they usually trade Cat for the new replacement rails with the old but may allow me to try a set to see if they can work.  The rails will have to be shortened from 40 link to the 37 or maybe I can get away with 38 if the adjusters will manage a 4"(overall) longer rail set, sprocket wear should allow for the slightly shorter pitch without much if any binding.

Thoughts?

	This site is not affiliated with AGCO Inc., Duluth GA., Allis-Chalmers Co., Milwaukee, WI., or any surviving or related corporate entity. All trademarks remain the property of their respective owners. All information presented herein should be considered the result of an un-moderated public forum with no responsibility for its accuracy or usability assumed by the users and sponsors of this site or any corporate entity.
	The Forum	Parts and Services	Unofficial Allis Store	Tractor Shows	Serial Numbers	History

Author	Message Topic Search Topic Options Post Reply Create New Topic Printable Version Translate Topic
DMiller Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Hermann, Mo Points: 29563	Post Options Post Reply Quote DMiller Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: Evaluating and researching Posted: 09 Apr 2012 at 8:29pm
	Hi guys, I have been doing a great deal of research here lately as the rails on my 7G try to drive me out of what little mind I have left. I did find six links from General Gear and have them here but the rails are and what I have are not sealed just regular old standard link with full length bushings that set into the next link ears. I had the replacements broken down to singles for inspections and to ready them for installation to the old rails, pretty weak and there is no way after watching a 100 ton press work to move the pins that I can do anything in the shop at the farm with a sledge to move they or the bushings. That is when I set to work, I will still rework these for the money it will cost just to keep the machine working but at some point I will have to replace shoes and bolts and eventually the rails. As you all know they are 7.00 pitch just as the HD6s' and 7's as well the HD11's, the closest I have found of a similar bushing diameter and width of rail I.D. is Cat for a 953. They are 6.906 pitch, 3/32 shorter from pin to pin than the OE Allis rails, they will be 1/2 inch shorter around the sprocket at 5 links(ten pins) in new condition, a little less closer to 3/8 short with a little bushing wear. Pins are smaller diameter at 1.44" and the better aspect, SALT rail. Shoes can be 15" and two or three bar with 5/8 bolting as well they come as a split master link where you don't have to drive pins out to remove. I am currently working with a contractor that has a few older 953 machines, he has stated they usually trade Cat for the new replacement rails with the old but may allow me to try a set to see if they can work. The rails will have to be shortened from 40 link to the 37 or maybe I can get away with 38 if the adjusters will manage a 4"(overall) longer rail set, sprocket wear should allow for the slightly shorter pitch without much if any binding. Thoughts?

Sponsored Links

Tracy Martin TN Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Gallatin,TN Points: 10557	Post Options Post Reply Quote Tracy Martin TN Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 09 Apr 2012 at 8:38pm
	Simplest thing to do is machine the sprocket pitch. You will be decreasing the diameter a little bit. Not a big job if the shop's machine has the travel where you take it. Tracy Martin
	No greater gift than healthy grandkids!

steve(ill) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 77840	Post Options Post Reply Quote steve(ill) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 09 Apr 2012 at 9:04pm
	Normal wear might be enough and thats worth a try. If you use new rails, i agree with Tracy, maybe some machining on the sprocket teeth will alllow the pitch to come in close. SALT tracks were a big improvement as are the bolted end links. That 100 ton push stuff is for the birds. Have all that done at the factory and just do the bolting in the field... much easier.
	Like them all, but love the "B"s.

Ian Beale Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 03 Oct 2011 Location: New South Wales Points: 934	Post Options Post Reply Quote Ian Beale Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 10 Apr 2012 at 4:00am
	Have a look at the chains for Fiat Allis 10's. Pitch 6.93", Bush OD 2.28", Pin 1.456" Chain width from roller dimension 6.417 - 6.496" and Rail width 1.653 - 1.673" The track bolts are 5/8" (in an otherwise metric machine) so I suspect Fiat liberated an existing chain set - not sure what exactly.

DMiller Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Hermann, Mo Points: 29563	Post Options Post Reply Quote DMiller Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 10 Apr 2012 at 5:12am
	Sounds like they were trying to move away from the off size even then, some rails interchange Cat/Deere/International, a few of the older rails did in fact interchange on the bigger machines for Cat and Allis, I suspect this was to minimize inventories for the owners as to repair parts for multiple machine varieties. Anything FA or Allis is now discontinued from all of the associated manufacturers as I have been in contact with, Berco, Trex, ITR and others dropped them as the manufacture of Fiat Allis is now gone when CNH bought it up. FA is no longer built or serviced for parts overseas either, pretty sad day to find this out with all the machines still in service or still available to work for a living. I also posed the question to the parts men at our local Cat shop on their rails, I did so as they offer used parts as rails off traded in dead machines they are scrapping out, I have not heard back yet from them.

Jay Tyrrell Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 28 Jul 2011 Location: Staples Points: 65	Post Options Post Reply Quote Jay Tyrrell Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 10 Apr 2012 at 6:01am
	For some advise you may want to give: Dennis Quade a call at Northern Tracter is Osseo, Minnesota. I was amazed at the inventory of Pads, Rails and Pins he keeps onhand. He's been rebuilding tracks for years. He's not afraid to tell you some shortcuts to save money either. Good Luck

Coke-in-MN Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Afton MN Points: 41211	Post Options Post Reply Quote Coke-in-MN Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 10 Apr 2012 at 8:22am
	On my D6-9U when I went to replace the track I found a set of D5 salt rails . I welded the D5 sprocket ring to the D6 spokes - then used the segmented bolt on teeth on the ring. Gave me new track- pads and replaceable sprockets. To bad the trany and brakes and steer clutches went bad next along with spun bearing in engine , but the undercarriage was good when scrapped.
	Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something. "Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful."

Mactractor Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 20 Jun 2011 Location: New Zealand Points: 652	Post Options Post Reply Quote Mactractor Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 10 Apr 2012 at 1:50pm
	Coke is on the right track (so to speak). If you change to readily available chains that need different sprocket teeth, welding a disc drilled to take segments for those chains to your 7G hubs is the way to go. 7G chains are same as HD9 and dry steer clutch HD11, but not HD6. Some dry steer HD11s got converted to D5 tracks, and HD6s to D4 tracks down here, but there was a lot more to the conversions than just sprockets. On the HD6s, the truck wheels had to be spaced off the frames, lifting the tractor a bit.

Lazyts Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 05 Feb 2012 Location: Manitoba Points: 627	Post Options Post Reply Quote Lazyts Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 11 Apr 2012 at 9:42pm
	I know where there is a set of used rails for the old dry clutch HD11 down your way, if you are interested in going that way. The pads wouldn't do, as they are the single grouser type for a dozer, but the rails would be cheap.

DMiller Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Hermann, Mo Points: 29563	Post Options Post Reply Quote DMiller Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 12 Apr 2012 at 6:25pm
	Hey there Lazyts, My rails are 'reasonable' just the shoes are shot, and the master links are going to take some serious work to change out. Thanks though. If I come up with a interchange set from something else I get access to more repair parts.