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Charlie175 
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Shenandoah, VA
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 Topic: TSX 464 JET SIZE
Posted: 20 Apr 2016 at 5:31am |
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What are you using for material?
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Charlie
'48 B, '51 CA, '56 WD45 '61 D17, '63 D12, '65 D10 , '68 One-Ninety XTD
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wi50
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Joined: 24 Sep 2010
Location: weegieland
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Posted: 19 Apr 2016 at 8:43pm |
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Those small series marvel schebler carbs were 1.19" throttle plate. Then the same bodies were also made with 1.31" throttle plates. I've bored quite a few and made custom aluminum venturies, but the biggest gain is in the bowl work adding material to shape it correctly. I'll flow test the carbs and take a reading, do different mods and see what the gains are. Weather I flow it at this test pressure or that I'm not going to get into here and now, but for comparison a bone stock one flows just under 100 cfm, one with a 1" or 15/16" poly venturi and a larger throttle plate will go about 115 cfm. But one where I've done the bowl modifications will go 145/cfm and if I build a different venturi 160/cfm through those little carbs. It's not about size, it's about the shape and the inlet and exit coefficients. Just because a venturi is of a certain size doesn't mean it will flow more air than a smaller one. It's about building an efficient approach to the venturi.
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"see what happens when you have no practical experience doing something...... you end up playing with calculators and looking stupid on the internet"
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wi50
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Joined: 24 Sep 2010
Location: weegieland
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Posted: 19 Apr 2016 at 8:33pm |
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You can just buy an adjustable load jet. Carburetors unlimited in auburn Washington had venturies, adjustable load jets, etc on hand, I get them there from time to time.
Edited by wi50 - 19 Apr 2016 at 8:34pm
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"see what happens when you have no practical experience doing something...... you end up playing with calculators and looking stupid on the internet"
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Bill_MN
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Sioux Falls, SD
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Posted: 14 Apr 2016 at 8:19pm |
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Be very disciplined when drilling out jets, you really should be using numbered wire size bits they go in increments of .001-.003. A tiny bit can make a huge difference, you may have drilled one out too much and now you're getting too much fuel, would explain why the higher octane runs better than pump gas. I drilled out the main on a TSX-561 for use with E85 on a bored engine and it was only about 2 bit sizes bigger than stock.
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1951 WD #78283, 1918 Case 28x50 Thresher #76738, Case Centennial B 2x16 Plow
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TennMatt1
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Joined: 12 Oct 2015
Location: Southern KY
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Posted: 06 Apr 2016 at 9:28pm |
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Well sorry I missed all the excitement today...Reason for asking about jet size is my jet is backed out so far that it's taped on and my exhaust pipe is still white..along with plugs.I had no more adjustment. The bits I use are propane orfice bits which go up in increments of .010 and less. I've had great success with them. As far as the fuel goes it's a huge difference in the way the tractor pulls and throttle response. I know I ran some pump gas in it at a pull last year and it ran like crap. Drained it out and ran the leaded race fuel and went back to normal operation. It just does not seem to want to pull at the rpms I run it at with regular gas. I have no explanation.
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1954 WD45
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Steve in NJ
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Andover, NJ
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Posted: 06 Apr 2016 at 10:59am |
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I always tell our customer's that pull occasionally not to drill out jets. These Carburetors run in a certain realm of their stoichiometric air/fuel range. When you start changing things, (especially drillin' things and removing things), you start going in the opposite direction of where you want to go. If the intake bore is smoothed out and a little venturi change is done where the air speed increases through the Carburetor to the engine, the torque curve is now improved in most cases. This doesn't mean you still don't need to fuss with it and dial it in to get optimum performance. Like anything, its the combination that makes things work well. The TSX-464 is a great Carb to work with and the engine will respond quite well with little mods...
Steve@B&B
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39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife
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DrAllis
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Posted: 06 Apr 2016 at 10:14am |
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I'm not arguing the merits of E-85 as a fuel whatsoever. I'm arguing the fact that it cannot just be dumped in a fuel tank and expect the standard carb to work. Any Antique Clubs I deal don't have anyone using it as a primary fuel that I'm aware of. Race cars don't run regular because their compression ratio's demand a better fuel than that. The classes you are running are clearly different than my neighborhood. A turbo class for a 3000 lb tractor?? not around here.
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PaulB
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Location: Rocky Ridge Md
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Posted: 06 Apr 2016 at 10:02am |
 DrAllis wrote:
Some guys swear by a lot of things, and have no real proof of what they claim. I don't see how just using E-85 would improve anything. I feel it would take a pretty big re-jetting of the carb to make it work right, as alcohol gallons per hour is substantially higher than gasoline. I challenge anyone to just fill their car gas tank with E-85 on a 70's vehicle and tell me how that works. Kind of like using 114 Octane gas with 180 psi compression....nice smell from the exhaust, but in reality, there can't be any real gain at the dyno. 90 octane would be plenty for 180 psi compression and far cheaper to purchase. |
Unless you gotten it right you will follow that logic. Local rules allow E85 for me as it's a consumer fuel, Alcohol isn't. Do you see and race cars running regular? E85 is the closest thing to Alcohol that is available to the average person. I have been running E85 for about 15 years. I had to do a lot of fine tuning of all the different circuits in the fuel side of the carburetors, but with the help of an EGT gauge, I'm making it work for me. When I was running Racing fuel I has problem over heating the turbo tractor, and the other one would really run hot, now both tractors need to be warmed up good before they will run right, I have shutters and 195 thermostats in both of them. I wouldn't ever consider pulling on gas. Checkout the link of my non turbo CA at a pull last fall. This is the 3000 pound class and the person flagging was standing where all the rest had stopped. I was the last puller in the class. I'm running 3rd gear in both CAs at 2500 pounds and 2nd at 3000. I'll challenge anyone with a 2500 pound tractor to come to any pull I'm at. http:youtu.be/Gt6FyDApako
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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY
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LeonR2013
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Joined: 01 Jan 2013
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Posted: 06 Apr 2016 at 7:28am |
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The main reason on an ordinary engine with a dist. to use a higher rated octane is because the internal timing in relation to the vacuum is screwed up. A well tuned dist. lets you get by with a lower octane under normal circumstances and driving. That being said, this ought to bring the hot rodders out of the closet. Leon R Cmo PS And I agree with the Dr. to much gas will just ruin your motor unless you drive a race car to work.
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Charlie175
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Location: Shenandoah, VA
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Posted: 06 Apr 2016 at 6:39am |
I would love to have a dyno to test settings.
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Charlie
'48 B, '51 CA, '56 WD45 '61 D17, '63 D12, '65 D10 , '68 One-Ninety XTD
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DrAllis
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Posted: 06 Apr 2016 at 6:35am |
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Some guys swear by a lot of things, and have no real proof of what they claim. I don't see how just using E-85 would improve anything. I feel it would take a pretty big re-jetting of the carb to make it work right, as alcohol gallons per hour is substantially higher than gasoline. I challenge anyone to just fill their car gas tank with E-85 on a 70's vehicle and tell me how that works. Kind of like using 114 Octane gas with 180 psi compression....nice smell from the exhaust, but in reality, there can't be any real gain at the dyno. 90 octane would be plenty for 180 psi compression and far cheaper to purchase.
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Charlie175
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Posted: 06 Apr 2016 at 5:43am |
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How about running E85? Some guys swear by it.
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Charlie
'48 B, '51 CA, '56 WD45 '61 D17, '63 D12, '65 D10 , '68 One-Ninety XTD
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DrAllis
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Posted: 05 Apr 2016 at 10:18pm |
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I'm not sure where you're going with this. The only really good reason to drill out any main power jet would be if you are running "lean" on fuel mixture. I know a guy years ago who completely removed the main power jet and adjusted the fuel mixture with the adjustable jet only. He liked to see smoke out the exhaust and thought for sure that meant more power(which it doesn't)...he never won any pulls either. The correct power jet size is .0625" to .0635" for a TSX464, which is the same size for WD45, D-15 II and D-17. No real reason to drill it out any bigger unless your venturi size gets larger, or if you have made engine changes to make things too lean.
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TennMatt1
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Location: Southern KY
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Posted: 05 Apr 2016 at 9:22pm |
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How big have yall went with your jets? I mean have yall bored them out?
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1954 WD45
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