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Tedin NE-OH 
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 Topic: Model B PTO
Posted: 03 May 2011 at 4:04pm |
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I know that AC made a sicle bar mower to be driven by PTO. What other implements were driven by the B's PTO ??
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GlenninPA
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Location: Ashley, PA
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Posted: 03 May 2011 at 8:07pm |
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40 combine
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Good judgment comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgment.
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GlenninPA
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Posted: 03 May 2011 at 8:07pm |
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PTO rake
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Good judgment comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgment.
From listening comes wisdom and from speaking comes repentance.
Wise men learn more from fools than fools from the wise.
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GlenninPA
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Posted: 03 May 2011 at 8:08pm |
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Orchard Sprayer
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Good judgment comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgment.
From listening comes wisdom and from speaking comes repentance.
Wise men learn more from fools than fools from the wise.
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Bill Long
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Posted: 03 May 2011 at 8:46pm |
Also, one has to remember that for an Allis Chalmers hydrallic pump to be installed it was necessary to have the PTO. There was an opening on the side of the PTO for the pump to fit. It was a two piston pump. Within the pto there was a shaft with two cams to operate the pump. The transmission rear end pto housing acted as the sump for the hydrallic system. At the time we used 20 w non detergent oil. Now they use transaxle oil.
The original PTO had a 1 1/8" spline and no opening for a hydrallic pump. Later models around 1940 had the opening for the pump. Even later PTO's had the 1 3/8" spline so that it could power almost any PTO equipment for which it had adequate plower.
Sorry I got a little windy.
Good Luck!
Bill Long
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GBACBFan
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Posted: 03 May 2011 at 8:58pm |
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That's great detailed information, Bill, and stuff I didn't know, thank you. Not windy from my perspective. Take all the words you need to share that kind of detail. There is no word limit here!
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"The trouble with quotes on the Internet is that you can never know if they
are genuine." - Mark Twain
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Tedin NE-OH
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Posted: 03 May 2011 at 9:11pm |
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Thanks to all who have posted.
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CTuckerNWIL
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Posted: 03 May 2011 at 9:33pm |
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OK Glenn and other B enthusiasts, I have an early B with the 1 1/4 PTO shaft and no provision for a hydraulic pump. Would it be possible and or an easy swap to put a late 1 3/8 shaft in my B so I don't have to add a coupler to run my Wood Brothers picker?
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pumpkin man
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Posted: 03 May 2011 at 9:59pm |
go get the pto with the 1 3/8 shaft & get your wrenches out can have it done in about an hour.
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ChuckLuedtkeSEWI
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Posted: 04 May 2011 at 5:57am |
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#3 mower had adapters to run behind the B/C and powered off of the pto also.
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1955 WD45 diesel 203322 was my dad's tractor, 1966 D15 23530, 1961 HD3 Crawler 1918, 1966 D17 IV 83495, 1937 WC 41255, 1962 D19 6221
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Chris/CT
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Posted: 04 May 2011 at 6:14am |
 Do these CA PTO units bolt up to B's OK? Seems to me Paul B [ does not post here anymore] said it was possible with a "shaft" change or something to that affect. Any thoughts appreciated. I have 2 to sell, was going to "gut" this one for shaft/brearings, etc and scrap balance. 
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Bill Long
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Posted: 04 May 2011 at 8:07am |
Charlie, If you can find a B pto with the opening for a hydrallic pump and the 1 3/8" shaft it would be an easy change. I can't do it now but I sure did enough of them. Also, I do not know for certain if the CA PTO would fit on a B tractor. Looks like it would fit.
Thinking it through I would not recommend it since the B is not set up for the CA hydrallic cylinders and other attachments such as tractor booster.
Note the double lobes on the cams. That gave the pump more piston action since on the WD - WD 45 pump the shaft turned faster. The WD - WD45 was single lobe.
Good Luck!
Bill Long
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Chris/CT
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Posted: 04 May 2011 at 3:28pm |
Anyone have a loose "B" pto shaft to measure? I was interested in knowing length and other Dim's to confirm/deny whether this shaft could be installed in a B PTO housing. 
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Tedin NE-OH
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Posted: 04 May 2011 at 3:30pm |
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It may fit but will the lobes line up. A B has only two hyd pistons.?
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CTuckerNWIL
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Posted: 04 May 2011 at 3:47pm |
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If I was using it, I wouldn't worry about the lobes since I have no hole to bolt a hydraulic pump to. If a guy wanted a hydraulic pump and had that shaft, just bolt a CA pump to it.
My next question would be "is the drive gear the same for both B and CA"? If not is the shaft size the same so the gears can be swapped out?
I was just thinking that the CA had a higher rpm rating than the C and early B I think, so maybe the driver and driven gears were different to make 540 rpm. ???????
Edited by CTuckerNWIL - 04 May 2011 at 3:49pm
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CTuckerNWIL
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Posted: 04 May 2011 at 3:50pm |
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Sorry about hijacking your post Ted, sometimes these things can get a life all their own.
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Chris/CT
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Posted: 04 May 2011 at 6:47pm |
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I don't have a "B" parts book to check part numbers on the gear. I was figuring more for the 1-3/8" feature and less for the pump [assuming the B had no pump anyway]. Looking at pictures the gear is similar, but possibly different tooth count.
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GBACBFan
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Posted: 04 May 2011 at 7:11pm |
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The shaft on a B without cams, prior to 1940, #206732, with 2 cams, 1 1/8", 1940 thru 1950, #211416, with 2 cams 1 3/8", 1951 and after, #224809.
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"The trouble with quotes on the Internet is that you can never know if they
are genuine." - Mark Twain
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Bill Long
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Posted: 04 May 2011 at 9:14pm |
Charlie, Check on e-bay. One finds the most unusual things there. Few days ago someone was parting out a tractor - I think it was a B - and had almost every part available.
At to attaching it there was a shaft that protruded from the differential. When we installed a PTO we would attach a slip gear on the spline. The installed gear has a slot for a small square on the PTO engagement leaver which fit there. That was the trick to get that square in the right place. Other than that it installed easy. Would that gear be the same as a CA I do not know since all CA's came through with PTOs factory installed.
Looks like it would be but I can't be sure.
Good Luck!
Bill Long
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