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Tbone95 
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 Topic: Proof of Payment
Posted: 06 Jun 2018 at 2:23pm |
"ACH" "Electronified Check" "Electronic Clearing" Call it whatever, on bank statements, some checks clear the old fashioned way, where they simply list the check number and amount. Other checks are processed electronically, and are listed differently on the statement. Has anyone ever dealt with a billing dispute involving a check that cleared the electronic way? Company is demanding a "copy of the check". Bank tells me that there is no copy of the check when it's cleared by ACH. Only the electronic transaction number provides the trace to the bank....I've sent a copy of the bank statement, which shows the name, date, transaction number, amount, etc. Not good enough they say, our policy is a copy of the check is needed. Been in dispute 7 weeks so far!
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thendrix
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Posted: 06 Jun 2018 at 4:09pm |
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Would it help to have a representative from the bank call?
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shameless dude
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Posted: 06 Jun 2018 at 9:29pm |
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that's one of the biggest scape goats in a company....they say: "it's their policy". I tell them they need to change their policy, cuz they aren't gonna get what they want! then I tell them it's my policy to....(such and such) what ever it fits!
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DanWi
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Posted: 06 Jun 2018 at 10:04pm |
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If you did an electronic funds transfer you wouldn't even have a check number, the only thing you would have is a transaction or confirmation number. Tell them the funds were taken from your account by their business now they should figure out where they went, maybe a thief on their end. Good luck
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Tbone95
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Posted: 07 Jun 2018 at 6:35am |
 thendrix wrote:
Would it help to have a representative from the bank call? |
Maybe that might be next. Currently, I've written a good old fashioned letter to the physical address with the documents enclosed. Waiting on an answer from that......should have been by yesterday, but I know how that's gone so far. Even if I cancel the service from now on, bastards still stole $151 from me in my book and that P!SSES me off! 
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jiminnd
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Posted: 07 Jun 2018 at 8:15am |
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Had that happen, they wanted a lot of my bank info, I called my bank and they said it happens often, the only way to clear it up is to let them look at your account. With there instruction I gave them what they needed and they discovered they had credited it to some one elses account so it got cleared up, just my experience.
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1945 C, 1949 WF and WD, 1981 185, 1982 8030, unknown D14(nonrunner)
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Tbone95
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Posted: 07 Jun 2018 at 8:18am |
jiminnd wrote:
Had that happen, they wanted a lot of my bank info, I called my bank and they said it happens often, the only way to clear it up is to let them look at your account. With there instruction I gave them what they needed and they discovered they had credited it to some one elses account so it got cleared up, just my experience. |
"Let them look at the account". How exactly? I take it you mean more so than just a statement?
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Coke-in-MN
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Posted: 07 Jun 2018 at 11:09am |
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Was it a electronic transfer or one where you wrote a check and they did the electronic transfer - many places do that now and give you back the origional check with a transfer number on it .
Your bank should be able to also furnish more info on the transaction and electronic signature involved .
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Life lesson: If you’re being chased by a lion, you’re on a horse, to the left of you is a giraffe and on the right is a unicorn, what do you do? You stop drinking and get off the carousel.
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Tbone95
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Posted: 07 Jun 2018 at 11:31am |
I wrote a check and mailed it in. (Silly me) The check was then processed electronically. The bank tells me when that happens, they don't get the checks back, just a transaction name and number. Company insists they need a front and back copy of the check itself. Therein lies the problem, and I'm in a rock and a hard place sandwich.
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FloydKS
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Posted: 07 Jun 2018 at 2:50pm |
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in spanish the saying is between the sword and the wall.
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 07 Jun 2018 at 3:11pm |
re: The bank tells me when that happens, they don't get the checks back, Back? from who???!!!
I'd say either YOUR bank or the OTHER one HAS to physically have the cheque. If 'they' say 'no' , then say 'fine....time to call in the FBI ,cause there's a fraud going on,also someone's STOLEN your cheque with personal data on it !, Heck tell them ,you'll be contacting EVERY dang federal department concerning banking, wire transfers, internet,mail, etc. even the White House. Someone WILL get to the bottom of this PDQ.....
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klinemar
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Posted: 08 Jun 2018 at 6:01am |
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Something doesn't sound right! You mailed them a check and the bank shows they cashed it and the company needs more info? This reads like this transaction is over in my book! Did you receive what you purchased? If not I would demand my money back and inform any and all authorities!
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Tbone95
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Posted: 08 Jun 2018 at 6:54am |
klinemar wrote:
Something doesn't sound right! You mailed them a check and the bank shows they cashed it and the company needs more info? This reads like this transaction is over in my book! Did you receive what you purchased? If not I would demand my money back and inform any and all authorities! |
Well, exactly! That's what I'm demanding. It's a monthly service, so yes, I received the service. I don't get it either, bank shows their name on the transaction, their system doesn't show it in their records. Beats me what's going on, in my opinion I proved my case.
Edited by Tbone95 - 08 Jun 2018 at 6:57am
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klinemar
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Posted: 08 Jun 2018 at 7:09am |
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I would tell them their services are no longer required after the end of the month! That is my opinion! Tbone you are a full grown man you can do as you want.
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Tbone95
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Posted: 08 Jun 2018 at 7:20am |
jaybmiller wrote:
re: The bank tells me when that happens, they don't get the checks back, Back? from who???!!!
I'd say either YOUR bank or the OTHER one HAS to physically have the cheque. If 'they' say 'no' , then say 'fine....time to call in the FBI ,cause there's a fraud going on,also someone's STOLEN your cheque with personal data on it !, Heck tell them ,you'll be contacting EVERY dang federal department concerning banking, wire transfers, internet,mail, etc. even the White House. Someone WILL get to the bottom of this PDQ.....
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Jay, I don't know all the ins and outs as I'm not a banker or a clearing house or work in payment processing. All I know "so far", is the traditional way checks were cleared/processed, is that a check was received, the receiver sent the check via mail to a clearing house, who sent the check via mail to the check writer's bank, who stored it for some amount of time. The physical check made the circuit back to the bank of origination. That rarely happens anymore. It's all electronic. Images are taken, sent, codes created, sent, blah blah. It seems someone somewhere has an image of this dang check, but the paper one was likely destroyed within a few days! It's the way it is, and we the consumer have no say in how our checks are processed. ACH stand for Automated Clearing House, and it's just that, virtually completely automatic. When a check is received by a company, they take your account number and routing number and with your signature on the check they have a 1 time authorization to debit your account. Not much different than a credit card transaction really. I'll figure it out.......someday soon......I hope......
Edited by Tbone95 - 08 Jun 2018 at 7:22am
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LouSWPA
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Posted: 08 Jun 2018 at 9:14am |
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I'm no expert here, legal, or otherwise, but it does seem to me that the key to this is your bank. They should be able to resolve this for you and if they are unwilling or unable to do so I would be a bit suspicious of them, as well as the vendor.
Your bank should either be able to prove the check was covered by them, if not, then the money should still be in your account.
I do think I would waste no more time in contacting your state Attorney General's office
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I am still confident of this;
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be strong and take heart and wait for the Lord. Ps 27
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Tbone95
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Posted: 08 Jun 2018 at 9:54am |
Agreed Lou. I need to take it up the food chain at the bank a little and see what happens. I understand and agree with the bank employee that said they don't get ACH checks back. That makes sense. But I've been doing some reading, and there is a lot of mention of "images" being created of the check. Seems someone somewhere can obtain one more level of proof than is on my bank statement. That's the banks current explanation, that the information is there on the statement, what more proof would someone need? Getting old!
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Coke-in-MN
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Posted: 08 Jun 2018 at 10:26am |
Seems I can call up the immage of any check I have written in the last 6 years on my account . I can do this online - if I have the check number and know the date when written or cleared my account . This immage shows both front and back of check . Actual physical check is in never/never land now .
I just paid one account where they run the check through a device that takes all information from the paper - transmits it to unknown - then i get the check back along with a receipt showing it was credited against my owed balance - but I also signed electronically that the transaction was subject to same rules as a check in if the transaction was refused later .
Yep it's time to contact both your bank and the payee and say the next step you are going to take is contacting the Att General of your state to help resolve the FRAUD someone is trying to do against you as the funds were taken from your account by someone and it was not you .
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Life lesson: If you’re being chased by a lion, you’re on a horse, to the left of you is a giraffe and on the right is a unicorn, what do you do? You stop drinking and get off the carousel.
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 08 Jun 2018 at 11:02am |
re: but the paper one was likely destroyed within a few days!
um, I don't think that's legally allowed. Seems to me if all the bank's computers got 'hacked' and the check images were lost, the bank would be in big trouble. Up here I MUST have hardcopy, ie REAL invoices NOT 'statements' else the guv gets 'upset'. In fact I require real invoices to be sent to me NOT 'paperless' from hydro,gas, electric companies. Going 'paperless' only increase THEIR profits....
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Tbone95
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Posted: 08 Jun 2018 at 11:45am |
jaybmiller wrote:
re: but the paper one was likely destroyed within a few days!
um, I don't think that's legally allowed. Seems to me if all the bank's computers got 'hacked' and the check images were lost, the bank would be in big trouble. Up here I MUST have hardcopy, ie REAL invoices NOT 'statements' else the guv gets 'upset'. In fact I require real invoices to be sent to me NOT 'paperless' from hydro,gas, electric companies. Going 'paperless' only increase THEIR profits....
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Well maybe so Jay. I only read it this morning. It' son the internet so it must be true 
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Tbone95
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Posted: 11 Jun 2018 at 6:55am |
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Coke's information above about images for the past 6 years is very interesting. I ran this up the food chain at the bank with 2 phone calls, different departments, going as high as I could go. This time, I was calling headquarters instead of my branch. They say they don't have the image anymore of that check (April 11, 2018!!!) They show the same information as on my statement, and wonder why that isn't proof enough. The last person I talked to said the bank that the company used will have the image and they'll track it down for me, but could take up to 10 days! WTF!!!
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chaskaduo
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Posted: 06 Jul 2018 at 10:56am |
Craig, did you ever get your cleared check to a certain company disputing it, and needing the cleared check, cleared up? (wow a mouthful) I won't use autopay as companies seem to keep on debiting the account after you stop their services or what ever. I've had to close bank accounts before because of this.
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Tbone95
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Posted: 06 Jul 2018 at 11:10am |
No. And to be "clear" (hahaha), this was a mailed in check in the first place, not auto pay. So I guess ya' can't win no matter what.
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