| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
Listo 
Bronze Level
Joined: 15 Mar 2025
Location: Queensland aust
Points: 7
|
 Post Options
 Thanks(0)
 Quote  Reply
 Topic: Australian built grader
Posted: 15 Mar 2025 at 7:30pm |
|
Chasing info on Australian built forty five with the supercharged 516 engine and pressure feed gearbox .
|
 |
|
Sponsored Links
|
|
|
Ian Beale
Orange Level
Joined: 03 Oct 2011
Location: New South Wales
Points: 985
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 16 Mar 2025 at 2:33am |
What info?
I nursed a 1959 one back to going. Posts on here start back maybe 15 years and have tapered off since.
Last one I recall was responding to a bloke who needed information on access the power steering unit. Caused the thought that I might have been the only bloke in the world who had been in there in the last 15 or so years. Now there are at least 2 of us.
IIRC the Oz model number is 124 which you won't find in AC part books of the era.
Edited by Ian Beale - 16 Mar 2025 at 2:42am
|
|
Listo
Bronze Level
Joined: 15 Mar 2025
Location: Queensland aust
Points: 7
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 16 Mar 2025 at 1:24pm |
|
Gday Ian Beale , I have s/n 524/112 . Got it running last week but broke a chain 100 m from where it sat for a few years . Got it onto the drop deck and off then up a good hill to the workshop but after a day cleaning up pto controls and shafts I found the a few nasty bits in the gearbox drain hole . From what I can work out from a 45 Australian parts book is it must be high and low with reverse on one stick then 1-2-3 on the other . Has an oil pump on the top shaft of gearbox . Have you seen that as the 45 manual didn’t have it or the ad40 one I found .Appartently 5500 hrs on it , all gauges look genuine and generator still charging , came from Emerald- gemfields way over to near Miriam vale 14-15 years ago . I have fiat dozers so I know the most likely parts supplier but you haven’t seen any about for a gearbox and a brake assembly . Thanks
|
|
Ian Beale
Orange Level
Joined: 03 Oct 2011
Location: New South Wales
Points: 985
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 17 Mar 2025 at 1:22am |
Hi Listo
Situation is that we did a family succession of the property a couple of years ago. I'll have a look at parts books and grader when I'm out next - likely next week.
I got within a couple of hundred relative to US serial numbers by playing "has this, doesn't have that" with the parts book.
IIRC you are right on the gear sticks - gears on the inside one.
And bow reverently to that PSB injection pump as about everything is "Unobtanium". US recommendation is to make absolutely sure that the pump is free before attempting to start one that hasn't been used for a while.
I got an Oz parts book when we collected a short motor from Allis Dozers in Tamworth when they folded. I seem to recall that there were 3 somewhat different gear boxes but I don't remember seeing one with a pressure feed. I'd guess that would indicate a very late one - yours being model 524 and ours ours being model 124 if I read and remember correctly
45's were followed by the M100 series - what did they have?
More memory rust flaking off - you could have a bitsa there. The series started at "AC Forty Five" from about 1953 which has the 516 supercharged engine. That engine has Lanova injection with injectors on the fuel pump side of the head squirting across the pistons. Then about 1960 became the "AC 45" when it got the AC 10000 engine (also 516) with direct injection and no supercharger.
Engine parts like bearings etc harder to find now for the supercharge ones.
A contact got a fair bit of Allis stuff when Tillys went "Komatterpillar" but he didn't get the grader stuff. I never found another one as a parts source.
Re brakes - ours has none. One brake backing plate is torn off the tandem box from somewhere in its history. But it looks like by the mountings they might be basically the same as some of the older Cat 12 ones - never got to checking shoe width though. The crew that made the master cylinders Allis used was still in business when I was looking back then. A neighbour got parts for the one on his 1946 Cat 12.
It is easy to put a Bosch 24 volt alternator on one.
And when you go to grease the front U joint on the PTO which looks like a curse-worthy job from underneath.
There is a raised section of the floor front LHS which has a rectangular hole at the outside back of it. By positioning the PTO "just so" you can get a grease gun on the nipple through there. That was a find by accident.
And Minnpar is now basically history as a US source
Regards
Ian
Edited by Ian Beale - 17 Mar 2025 at 1:35am
|
|
Listo
Bronze Level
Joined: 15 Mar 2025
Location: Queensland aust
Points: 7
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 17 Mar 2025 at 5:24am |
|
Ian Beale thanks for that , engine in this one seams good cut a full mouldboard this arvo with it but I’d say I’ve lost a bearing on 1st low . Love to see the parts brake down that your book has .
Thanks
|
|
Ian Beale
Orange Level
Joined: 03 Oct 2011
Location: New South Wales
Points: 985
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 17 Mar 2025 at 7:11pm |
IIRC if it is good that engine is about 120 hp. Will probably "roll coal" under load.
If you ever need to do any serious work on the engine you'll need the engine section from a HD 11 service manual.
Next trip I can bring the Oz parts manual back and copy.
I got a Jensales service manual as a starter. It covers basic grader things - scantily in parts. There is not much on the engine for example. And a parts manual which does not cover things Australian. Like the hydraulic pump here is Hydreco - I guess they had a plant here
Ian
Edited by Ian Beale - 17 Mar 2025 at 7:31pm
|
|
Pusher
Bronze Level
Joined: 04 Jul 2023
Location: Victoria aus
Points: 11
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 19 Mar 2025 at 3:30am |
hi Listo, I’m the one Ian refers to about the power steering, he was a great help. I have similar to yours 1959 524 Allis forty five ex vic roads board, operational and not bad condition for age, same engine super charged 516.. runs well had the injectors done great improvement as if not good then the Lenova system doesn’t work well. Can’t speak for gearbox issues but do have some good service manuals and parts book. So message any questions and I will help if I can, not on here often but will check, will exchange mobile number if you need. Cheers Michael L. |
|
Listo
Bronze Level
Joined: 15 Mar 2025
Location: Queensland aust
Points: 7
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 19 Mar 2025 at 6:40am |
|
Thanks Ian and Michael . Found the main issue today , bear failure on the bottom shaft and front pinion bearing also , took out the pinion carrier as well . Waiting on prices for parts . Could be a lost cause I’d say . I’ll keep you posted ,
|
|
Ian Beale
Orange Level
Joined: 03 Oct 2011
Location: New South Wales
Points: 985
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 19 Mar 2025 at 3:37pm |
Hi Listo
Not good news. But not a lost cause if it is only the bearings. Allis seemed to use mostly off the shelf ones so, if you can get numbers off them, they'll be around.
I needed needle bearings for the power steering in ours. Our local supplier had a paper IBR catalogue that went from Allis part numbers to bearing numbers which helped find them though.
Ian
Edited by Ian Beale - 19 Mar 2025 at 3:38pm
|
|
Pusher
Bronze Level
Joined: 04 Jul 2023
Location: Victoria aus
Points: 11
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 19 Mar 2025 at 6:26pm |
hi listo, Bearings generally will be generic and available, unlikely to be a special, worst case discontinued but rarely. The carrier is possibly best 2nd hand may be from…philhunt parts you probably know that already. Not cheap but definitely is wrecking these models. Failing that may be cost effective to repair sleeve or have the carrier made if possible. Tried to identify in my parts book what you called the pinion carrier. Is it the carrier for front bearing. Part no.631128.
Cheers Michael L.
|
|
Ian Beale
Orange Level
Joined: 03 Oct 2011
Location: New South Wales
Points: 985
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 20 Mar 2025 at 3:36am |
|
I don't have a parts book ATM so will just follow till I do
|
|
Listo
Bronze Level
Joined: 15 Mar 2025
Location: Queensland aust
Points: 7
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 20 Mar 2025 at 5:07am |
|
The pinion is 057810 , and the carrier is 065540 . May have found a replacement gearbox and diff centre down south but not sure condition yet or price , and found a parts machine near Brisbane and another up north a bit .Bearings I found last night easy enough . Spoke with mark at hunts today , very helpfull . But still waiting on a quote for parts . Hand brake disc non existent so might have to cut and shut a button clutch that’s sintered . Hopefully know more next week .
|
|
Pusher
Bronze Level
Joined: 04 Jul 2023
Location: Victoria aus
Points: 11
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 21 Mar 2025 at 5:09am |
listo, Part no. Not in my parts catalogue, must be slightly different box, may be Ian’s parts book. Pretty sure there won’t be much difference, will do photos of relevant pages if you wish. The machines you found may be good for me after you have sourced what you need, lm chasing 1 replacement gear shift, and some bits for the mechanical controls handles and cogs etc. Cheers Michael L.
|
|
Ian Beale
Orange Level
Joined: 03 Oct 2011
Location: New South Wales
Points: 985
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 21 Mar 2025 at 6:10pm |
My current rehabilitation is a 1950's Cyclops style pedal tricycle for a grand daughter. The 8 inch pedal wheel is "NLA" and I'll likely have to make one - which means a run back to the property workshop - likely in the next couple of days.
So I'll have a look.
|
|
Ian Beale
Orange Level
Joined: 03 Oct 2011
Location: New South Wales
Points: 985
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 24 Mar 2025 at 3:24am |
I made it out to the property today.
First - I was wrong on the model - it is 524 - 204
And there was only the Jensales parts book in the office.
That shows 3 eras of gear box -
Straight cut gears to #784 (not including #779 which must have been the test mule for helical gears)
Then helical top shaft #779 and #785 up
Bottom shafts
Pre #785, # 785 - 1548, # 1548 up
None shows anything that would drive an oil pump off the top shaft or anything about one in the parts detail. All the shafts just have a front cover.
And I don't recall any mention of same in the original Allis parts book with Oz modifications either. - just that the power steering pump in them was Hydreco.
057810 is the pinion and shaft (18 teeth) - not 2 separate items.
065540 is the partial pinion carrier assembly which came as carrier, with front and rear bearing cups plus bevel pinion and shaft.
091444 is the complete carrier assembly with pinion, cups, cones, seal, shims etc
Crown wheel (Officially gear, bevel, cross shaft, 45 spiral teeth) came as a separate item and not in a matched set.
I made some more progress on the tricycle
Cheers
Ian
Edited by Ian Beale - 24 Mar 2025 at 3:25am
|
|
Listo
Bronze Level
Joined: 15 Mar 2025
Location: Queensland aust
Points: 7
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 26 Mar 2025 at 5:59pm |
|
Righto thanks Ian . May have had a win but not 100% yet , ad3 has same pinion carrier and bottom shaft as ad40 and the forty five , found a possible parts machine not far from home , or a full tandem and gearbox out west but will be flooded for the next month or so after this weeks rain . Ad3 is a different set up with clutch housing but the main case is very similar but has a few c clip groves for front top bearing etc , diff case is the same but crown wheel and pinion are a straight cut but will fit . Front tandem axle is the same but rear is different . Ad3 has the electric brakes in it but the looks too .
The old pedal cars were a big thing a few year back , good to see .
I’ll keep you posted .
|
|
Ian Beale
Orange Level
Joined: 03 Oct 2011
Location: New South Wales
Points: 985
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 26 Mar 2025 at 6:51pm |
Hi Listo
I'd guess that the AD3 / 4 stuff might have been in the early straight cut gear trains in the Forty Fives so you might need a look around that.
The straight cut bottom shaft and assembly is different to the later forty five ones
Have you got the parts diagram for that?
Edited by Ian Beale - 26 Mar 2025 at 6:58pm
|
|
Ian Beale
Orange Level
Joined: 03 Oct 2011
Location: New South Wales
Points: 985
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 28 Mar 2025 at 8:28pm |
|
And I notice that the gearbox case part number changes (3 times) with those shaft changes so something else to watch out for
|
|
