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Lonn 
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Location: Назарово,Russia
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 Topic: rear axle question
Posted: 04 Oct 2010 at 1:12pm |
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Is there any way I can repair a rear axle from a 7050? When I bought it the dual hub was run loose and it chipped the rear axle badly all the way around. Can it be built up and milled down? I suspect it can't. I want to keep the extended axles for duals I plan on running. Will I have to settle for band duals? $600 plus freight for a used axle is the best price I have found. $250 for a standard axle but I can cut mine down to standard.
Edited by Lonn - 04 Oct 2010 at 1:13pm
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darrel in ND
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Posted: 04 Oct 2010 at 10:29pm |
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How badly is it damaged, is it gouged out deep and wide, or mostly a little surface dammage? Darrel
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Lonn
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Posted: 05 Oct 2010 at 6:02am |
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Flaked off at the surface not deep but as wide as the hub. I have always figured the shaft would crystalize if you weld it up but maybe if it's heat treated it would work.
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firebrick43
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Posted: 05 Oct 2010 at 9:10am |
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The area might be able to be flame/plasma spray welded and turned down in a lathe. There are special torches that can spray powdered metal that builds up the surfaces of shaft. Its used in factories to repair large shafts all the time.
If its done while turning slow in a lathe and supported close by with a steady rest there would be little warpage as the heating is even. I do not know if that axle was heat treated originally or not but if it was it probably would have to be again or you would have possible problems in the HAZ
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Lonn
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Posted: 05 Oct 2010 at 11:35am |
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Thanks firebrick. Where would one go to get this done and would it be any cheaper than the $600 used one do you think? Again, thanks for your help.
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firebrick43
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Posted: 05 Oct 2010 at 11:47am |
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I don't know where to tell you to look locally. Probably the best bet is to call a machine rebuilding firm, or a shop that speciallizes in welding and lockstitching cast iron, as they sometimes use the flame torches.
I would imagine it could be done for under 600 but by how much, no idea. Specialized skills usually demand money.
Another option that might be better? How far from the ends does the dual adapter sit?
A local machinist might be able to turn down the axle and make an interference fit sleeve to fit over it that is the same diameter. Probably need a 4000 series steel. This is just an idea but would involve no heat treatment. I don't know if locktite would hold that much torque or if you should silver solder or pin the sleeve to keep it from turning. Again, just an idea.
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Kip-Utah
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Posted: 05 Oct 2010 at 12:23pm |
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Lon, I like the last idea of turning down the axel & doing a sleeve that is drilled & pinned. Kip
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HANSEN'S OLD ORANGE IRON. Showing, Pulling, & Going!!
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Lonn
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Posted: 05 Oct 2010 at 1:50pm |
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Thanks guys.
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CTuckerNWIL
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Posted: 05 Oct 2010 at 3:01pm |
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If you could leave the hub on, there is epoxy out the that will hold it. I epoxied a flywheel hub to a backshaft on a 25 hundred ton forge press once. It stayed till the owners decided to rebuild the machine. If you need to remove it all you have to do is heat it to about 600 degrees F and it softens right up.
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Coke-in-MN
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Posted: 05 Oct 2010 at 3:26pm |
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Quick answer on weld up on axel , DON'T. a smaller axel but bought 2 of them for HD4 that were welded and machined , when they broke the second time i looked close , could see weld and machine in cross section of broken parts, without proper heat treating it will break . Do a build up using devcon, belzona, or other such plastic steel , Lock-tite also makes a material for shaft fitting on worn shafts.
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Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful."
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CTuckerNWIL
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Posted: 05 Oct 2010 at 3:32pm |
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680 loctite will fill a .015 gap maybe a little more but it is rated for that.
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Brian Jasper co. Ia
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Posted: 05 Oct 2010 at 5:09pm |
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Tried Colfax Tractor Parts in Colfax Ia? How about Teubel's in Bloomfield Ia? In a book on Oliver tractors written by one of their chief engineers it talks about axles breaking on 77's with a mounted picker. They had to use a different grade of steel to tolerate the bending when the tractor was driven on a rough road in high gear. Can the same characteristics of the steel be maintained with welding? I'm no expert, just curious.
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Dnoym N. S. Can.
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Posted: 05 Oct 2010 at 6:57pm |
Lonn Another option that might be better? just an idea here something off the wall i know that they do it to build up a bad crank .020,.030 and it harder with no heat Chrome plating, often referred to simply as chrome, is a technique of electroplating a thin layer of chromium onto a metal object. The chromed layer can be decorative, provide corrosion resistance, and increase surface hardness. and then turning down the axel cost how much, no idea. what do you all think of this guy`s ??? hth B:-) Dnoym
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darrel in ND
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Posted: 05 Oct 2010 at 8:48pm |
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I'm with Coke-in-MN, do a belzona build up. I know that sounds lame, but sometimes it's the most feasable option. I've used belzona with some pretty positive results. Follow the belzona directions to a tee, and you should have good results. The stuff has very good compression strenghth, so if you clamp the hub onto it and keep it tight, I'd think it should work, Darrel
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CTuckerNWIL
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Posted: 06 Oct 2010 at 11:43am |
Welding could be done by someone who knows how. First you chuck the axle in a lathe, turn it to at least .06" smaller than what you want for a finished piece. Then heat the part and keep it warm while you weld it, you may need to post heat it too,cover with insulation of some kind to slow the cooling process. You probably won't find anyone to guarantee this process. Chroming might work but the shaft probably should be turned so it is round and the plating will be all one thickness. Then grind to finish cause the chrome is very hard. Epoxy would still be my choice, if replacement is out of the question. Mogolice I think is the brand name of the stuff I have used. The belzona or other brands probably would be fine too.
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firebrick43
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Posted: 06 Oct 2010 at 12:44pm |
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Moglice is for rebuilding ways in machine tools tucker. It works well for that application but it has some additives specifically for that. Belzona if used would be the one. I sort of cringe at that however as there is alot of abuse there but if you put them on tight, and leave them on, might work?
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CTuckerNWIL
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Posted: 06 Oct 2010 at 4:18pm |
There are many different kinds of Moglice. I have used it on ways and I also used it to attach the flywheel to that 25 hundred ton forge press. Here are a few of the ones not used on ways.
DWH grades are designed
for static fits in machine assembly so they do not include low-friction
fillers. DWH resins are produced in various viscosities and have more
than 80% metallic fillers. DWH is used to mold static machine components
in-place and to eliminate expensive machining and scraping. It can also
be used as a repair material in maintenance. Common uses for the
different grades are listed below. Its ability to mold to any shape
makes it possible to shim with 100% contact.
DWH 310 FL - has steel
fillers and is often used to produce bearing seats, align ball screws,
align columns to beds, locate hardened seats in identical pallets, etc.
DWH 311 FL - has aluminum
fillers with a lower specific weight therefore, is less expensive for a
given volume. It is frequently used for filling key ways and bolt
holes.
DWH 311 Putty - is a thin
putty used in applications where the sealing and injection method is
less practical; for instance, a segmented surface. A thickener powder is
available for vertical or overhead applications.
• Thickener Powder is available for all DWH grades.
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Gerald J.
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Posted: 06 Oct 2010 at 4:34pm |
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Last time I priced chrome plating to repair a pitted hydraulic cylinder the price was about twice the price of a new cylinder from the maker of the equipment.
Gerald J.
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CTuckerNWIL
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Posted: 06 Oct 2010 at 4:39pm |
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The flywheel hub and shaft had somewhere near a 1/4 " clearance. I made 6, 1/8 inch wedges to pound in equally spaced around the flywheel(3 in front and 3 in back). After getting the OD and face runnout down to an acceptable amount, I slide a plate over the shaft that had 3, 3/8" pipe tapped holes in it. I bolted the plat to the face of the hub and injected the Moglice, starting at the bottom hole. When it started coming out the back I used modelers clay or babbitrite to plug the gap. Then inject the filler in the top holes. Let it set up over night and it won't come apart till you heat it to somewhere near 600 degrees F.This hub had (2) 4"x4"x 18" tapered keys that evidently had not been fitted properly on a rebuild. After it ran for 6 months to get ahead on needed parts, the company that did the original rebuild had to get the hub off.
Edited by CTuckerNWIL - 06 Oct 2010 at 4:42pm
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