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Butch(OH) 
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Location: Lucerne Ohio
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 Topic: Got a tractor w/alternator tach drive?
Posted: 26 Feb 2010 at 9:01am |
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I need a favor of one of you guys that has a tach or proof meter drive on the rear of the alternator. Part number is 70246764. This would be on certain 190s and 210/ 220 and maybe more I didnt look them all up. I might have found a very economical alternative source for the tach drive gears but I need a tooth count on an original drive to be sure they are the correct ratio. WOuld one of you guys pop the cover of yours and count? I will post info after I have made sure they are the correct parts and fit is OK. Thanks in advance.
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jmm
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Joined: 06 Dec 2009
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Posted: 26 Feb 2010 at 9:38am |
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Would you be willing to share your economical alternative? I'm in the same need for a 170. Thanks
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orangereborn
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Posted: 26 Feb 2010 at 9:43am |
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Butch..I have one in the shop drawer and I think it is 13/45 but I will recount and post later. I know those numbers are within 2 teeth if it is not correct. Give you an idea anyway...Dale
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Butch(OH)
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Posted: 26 Feb 2010 at 10:22am |
 jmm wrote:
Would you be willing to share your economical alternative? I'm in the same need for a 170. Thanks |
That's the plan man, first I will make sure the ratio is right, then I will order a set and make sure they fit and fuction, then I will share the source.
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orangereborn
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Posted: 26 Feb 2010 at 11:13am |
Butch...I did the recheck and it is 12/45. With that I have 3 3/8 (?) inch pulleys. I know the pulleys on my diesel 180's, 190, 210, 220's, D21's are all the same. I don't know if they should be but they are. We are playing with adopting the gear box system with a intergal unit to get rid of the external regulator. You are checking on gears or different gear box? Was the mention of the AGCO kit to include both gears? Dale
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Butch(OH)
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Posted: 26 Feb 2010 at 11:54am |
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Dale, The 220 we bought has a replacement alternator with no gear box on it and no place to bolt one on. I Was just doing some checking around pricing alternators etc and came across some drive gearboxes for sale complete. The seller is getting a tooth count for me. Someone posted that the two gears (if avaialable) are about $90 from AGCO. If these are the same they are about 1/3 the cost. Didnt want to get too many fired up and callling the guy untill it's checked out.
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Eldon (WA)
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Posted: 26 Feb 2010 at 7:31pm |
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The tach on one of my 175Ds runs about 500 rpm faster than it should....wonder if it is different and this one has a set of gears for the bigger tractors.....
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ALLIS EXPRESS!
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Butch(OH)
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Posted: 26 Feb 2010 at 8:30pm |
Eldon (WA) wrote:
The tach on one of my 175Ds runs about 500 rpm faster than it should....wonder if it is different and this one has a set of gears for the bigger tractors..... |
It can be checked out at AGCO partsbooks online Eldon but the darned site loads so slow I didnt check out all the possible models. I checked with the biggest/oldest auto electric rebuilder in Columbus and they acted like they are all the same, we will see when the tooth count comes in.
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Adam Stratton
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Posted: 26 Feb 2010 at 9:09pm |
Well Butch, you got me all excited too. We went years and years and never had problems, but it seems like our 210 developed a taste for eating them. We changed alternators, cables, and replaced the gears I dont know how many times, and it needs done again. Please let me know what you find out. Thanks for doing the legwork!
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Adam Stratton
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Posted: 26 Feb 2010 at 9:11pm |
Eldon, We got in a pinch and had to swap pulleys on our 7580 last year. Ended up with a different size pulley and the tach (electric) hasnt read right since. You might make sure your pulley is stock size
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JoeO(CMO)
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Posted: 14 Mar 2010 at 2:24pm |
Butch, did you get all the information you needed for the tach drive on the back of a alternator?
The crank pulley diameter is 7-5/16, 12/45 tooth count in the gear box and like Dale already mentioned the alternator pulley is 3-3/8.
I had made a note of this in my 185 service manual.
Edited by JoeO(CMO) - 14 Mar 2010 at 4:59pm
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Butch(OH)
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Posted: 14 Mar 2010 at 2:46pm |
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Funny you should ask Joe as I was going to post about it. What is going on is there are now reproduction drives out there for sale, Most are sold as Massey Ferguson proof meter drives. Thought it odd that others who have been looking much longer than me did not see them for sale. Our local auto elctric guy told me that as far as he knew all the drives were the same ratio. but I asked here and got an A-C tooth count which is as you say 12-45 and just the other day finaly got one of the sellers to give me one from the repro drives being sold and they are 14-43, so iy looks like the repros are going to do us A-C guys no good, it also expalins the "fast tachs" that we read about on here eevery now and then,, Oh well, I tried.
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ALinIL
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Posted: 14 Mar 2010 at 3:27pm |
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Butch - Not trying to confuse you, but if you changed the Alt pulley to 4.125 with the new gear set the speed overage should correct itself. You will be lowering the alt speed by approx 20%, but I don't think that should hurt you. My $0.02. - AL
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DougG
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Posted: 14 Mar 2010 at 6:54pm |
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I need a couple sets of these gears, was hoping for a good out come on the search; but ; I was just at Yesterdays Tractor looking for 200 parts and they have -proofmeter gears for a 170 thru 200 , Delco gen,[alt.] ; the photo looked like what bolts on the altenator; all steel gears for 41 bucks ; isnt that what we,re looking for ? It beats Agco prices , and Im not buying thru Agco less I have too !!!
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Joe(TX)
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Posted: 14 Mar 2010 at 7:09pm |
My 200 has an alternator withe internal regualator. The armatuere was drilled and tapperd to accept the drive gear. The box mounting holes were tapped into the end of the case.
Adam
If the tractor is eating the gears, it is most likely either mismatched gears, a bad cable or a bad meter.
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Butch(OH)
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Posted: 14 Mar 2010 at 8:03pm |
DougG wrote:
I need a couple sets of these gears, was hoping for a good out come on the search; but ; I was just at Yesterdays Tractor looking for 200 parts and they have -proofmeter gears for a 170 thru 200 , Delco gen,[alt.] ; the photo looked like what bolts on the altenator; all steel gears for 41 bucks ; isnt that what we,re looking for ? It beats Agco prices , and Im not buying thru Agco less I have too !!! |
Doug from what I have gathered the ones sold as Allis fit but are not the correct ratio. The ones sold at YT are the same as the ones on Ebay, Stieners etc
Edited by Butch(OH) - 14 Mar 2010 at 8:08pm
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Butch(OH)
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Posted: 14 Mar 2010 at 8:07pm |
ALinIL wrote:
Butch - Not trying to confuse you, but if you changed the Alt pulley to 4.125 with the new gear set the speed overage should correct itself. You will be lowering the alt speed by approx 20%, but I don't think that should hurt you. My $0.02. - AL |
Al, That is exactly what I intend to do but I have the capibilities to machine a pulley to whatever spec I need. I was trying to locate a bolt up deal for those that don't. If the the pulley needed to correct the ratio turns out to be a stocked size I will post that info later.
Butch
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Gerald J.
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Posted: 14 Mar 2010 at 8:18pm |
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Back before the car makers had used so many different speedometer drives from the transmission someone used to make a little gear box that allowed a wide selection of speed correction to correct car and truck speedometers. Often the tach cable and connectors are the same as speedometer cable and connectors so that little gear box might fit. It was intended for hot rodders that had change axle ratios or tire sizes or both. At least up through early 1998 in Fords it was still necessary to change the driven gear and sometimes the driving gear in the transmission to correct for gear or tire changes. Since then its done in the computer. I couldn't get the right gear from Ford when I went from 3.08 to 4.10 but I found one that was close enough in a hot Mustang shop or two. I bought two in case I wore one out. So far the first one though spindly with thin teeth hasn't broken in about 85K miles.
Anyway once upon a time there were gear boxes for just such problems. Which is not to say that changing the alternator pulley is totally out of line with a 3 wire alternator. Alternator pulleys do come in various sizes and often take the same bore as a generator that tended to be turned slower.
Gerald J.
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