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Fouled plug |
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AveryD12 ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 05 Mar 2018 Location: Foxworth.MS Points: 117 |
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Ok…I know I have read on the forum about one brand of spark plug being better to use if you are having problems with plug fouling. I have searched and cannot find the post. Would someone educate me again please. I know it’s not champion but don’t remember which brand it is. I’m thinking NGK or Autolite.
Thanks Avery |
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Ky.Allis ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 31 Jan 2010 Location: Kentucky Points: 1021 |
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Autolite always worked best for me in an older JD Gator. NGK's were the worst.
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85960 |
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NGK B4 work good in the 125 inch motors for ALLIS..... your right, Champion are the ones to stay away from... Autolite is a good option also ( 295 and 303).
Edited by steve(ill) - 06 Sep 2022 at 5:37pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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estout81 ![]() Bronze Level ![]() Joined: 15 Mar 2022 Location: Utica Ohio Points: 34 |
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I thought ACs came with AC plugs.
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Ken McGregor ![]() Bronze Level ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Strathroy, Ont Points: 142 |
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NKG B2s made my WD45 run like a well-oiled top when nothing else could work. I seriously am planning to pull the Autolite 295s from my WD and put in the same NKG B2s. Someone suggested they weren't any good but they worked wonders for me!
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DSeries4 ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Ontario, Canada Points: 7448 |
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My local Napa steered me towards NGK plugs. They stopped carrying Autolite plugs because thy had been getting a lot of complaints about their quality. |
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'49 G, '54 WD45, '55 CA, '56 WD45D, '57 WD45, '58 D14, '59 D14, '60 D14, '61 D15D, '66 D15II, '66 D21II, '67 D17IV, '67 D17IVD, '67 190XTD, '73 620, '76 185, '77 175, '84 8030, '85 6080
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KJCHRIS ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 21 Dec 2015 Location: WC Iowa Points: 948 |
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My favorite parts store for last 30 years will sell you NGK's unless specify YOU want a certain brand/number. They still carry decent selection of Autolite but have cut the Champion to minimum that franchise control says they have to stock.
YES, even though they own the store/franchise they've got to stock certain parts to keep the brand name.
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AC 200, CAH, AC185D bareback, AC 180D bareback, D17 III, WF. D17 Blackbar grill, NF. D15 SFW. Case 1175 CAH, Bobcat 543B,
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AveryD12 ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 05 Mar 2018 Location: Foxworth.MS Points: 117 |
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Thanks for all the replies. Seems like NGK gets the most votes. What is the difference in B2 vs B4? I have noticed if I am pulling a disk or a bush hog the tractor runs a little hotter and I don’t have the fouling problem. But if I am pulling a trailer and not really putting a load on the tractor that’s when I start having the fouling problem. It’s always the same cylinder. Do you think engine temperature has anything to do with the fouling or is it just coincidence
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DaveKamp ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Apr 2010 Location: LeClaire, Ia Points: 5973 |
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engine temperature and load ALWAYS have EVERYTHING to do with fouling. Spark plugs live a terrible life of crazy variables, under the expectations of unwavering perfection... (kinda like being married...) Engines under low load, develop the least amount of waste heat. Engines under low load, and spinning fast, shed what waste heat they make, out the exhaust pipe. To work properly (meaning, not short out with carbon/oil deposits) The spark plug's center insulator must get hot enough to BURN OFF whatever soot tries to attach itself... which manufacturers do by making the ceramic insulating cone really skinny, as far up into the plug as they can... the path for electrode heat having a long way to travel, means it doesn't get cooled by conduction into the head. SOME cylinder heads have cooling issues... they have hot-spots that appear in the heads, and coolant boils there, turning into steam, and thus, steam 'pockets' can form, causing the head around those pockets to be extra warm (because they're not in contact with liquid anymore). Allis motors don't do that. The Ford 192 in my Hyster DID... until I performed a cooling-system mod on it... But on the other end, when the engine is under a heavy load, a hard pull, there's LOTS of heat there, and that electrode is right in the middle of it... and if it gets too hot, the compression and fuel circumstance, crammed around that hot electrode, results in 'autoignition'... which is the event of the cylinder igniting just because there's enough fuel, air, and heat. In other terms, it's called 'preignition'. The problem you've got, is clearly one cylinder that's just not running as well as the others. Mebbie it's got some unusual wear, or a valve stem that's a little leaky... another thing that will cause it to foul, is if the fuel-air mix is somehow uneven between the cylinders, like mebbie the exhaust port is partially plugged up with wasps, carbon, rust, and oil-soot... or you've got a leaky manifold gasket. Then there's times when a 'fouled plug' is mistaken for just a 'miss'. A cylinder can miss because the ignition isn't consistent... or because the distributor cap has a sneaky carbon track in it, or a plug wire is well-aged and develops a detour through a spot in the block where it happens to almost touch... Or you can have a plug that has an internal crack, and shorts under some instances... or the fuel-air mix is too LEAN (a really lean mix won't fire)... You can also have a point cam that's worn such that point lift/dwell is off, or distributor shaft bushing that's well worn, causing the shaft to 'walk' around the inside of the distributor a bit, and cause the points to open and close inconsistently... I would look into all those things FIRST, and if nothing clears up, do a compression test and see if that cyl is low. If so, give it a valve adjustment, and see what happens. If that cyl is just chronically low (but it's not WAY low), then drop in one-step-hotter plug and try that, but if you're gonna work it hard, put the proper one back in so you don't wind up with preignition damage.
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Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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EPALLIS ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Illinois Points: 1147 |
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Have to ask a silly question: Would those autolite 295 spark plugs be "non-resistor"? I'm looking at a set of 8 AC-45 and my they are high priced. If the autolite 295 is just as good, that would sure be the most economical way to go. Thanks in advance!
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85960 |
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Your set of 8 is obviously not for an Allis Tractor... The Autolite and NGK work great in an low compression Allis motor....... You mileage may vary in different types of motors...... Lot of small engines use Champion plugs... they dont do so well in ALLIS Motors for "some" reason.. Edited by steve(ill) - 06 Sep 2022 at 8:52pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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DaveKamp ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Apr 2010 Location: LeClaire, Ia Points: 5973 |
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The 295 is a copper core (non resistor) plug... so in conjunction with solid-core wires, an appropriate choice for magneto applications. Regarding price, quantify 'high priced'... I'm seeing them falling in the $3/plug range... up to $20 for a box of four (so $5.00 a plug)... I don't see that as being far out... if you're seeing a box of 8 for $40, then you've got enough to do TWO tractors... The reason why I don't use Champions, is simply because I experienced a catastrophic failure of one plug, that destroyed an engine. The crimp failed, and compression ejected MOST of the electrode's ceramic insulator out the plug hole, but the rest wedged against the piston and opened up the cylinder wall like a zipper. It cost me just over $10,000 to replace the power in my boat, and Champion was unwilling to lift a finger to repair the mess. They offered me a replacement spark plug. After discussing the failure with over two dozen well-experienced automotive technicians, and being told that crimp failures were a common story for the brand, I started testing everything I had which had a spark plug, and found that basically all but one that had a Champion plug, leaked compression through the crimp of at least 30% of the plugs. I replaced them all with other brands, retested for leaks (WD40 on the crimp while running just off idle will usually show bubbles when there's a leak) and found none... and they all ran better. One thing to consider- if the engine is missing on just one cylinder, spray some WD-40 on the plug crimp and look for bubbles. If it's leaking, change THAT plug, and try again. If it stops missing, and you have no more leak, you found your problem.
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Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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Phil48ACWC ![]() Silver Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 17 Jan 2013 Location: Vermont Points: 296 |
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I've tried all kinds of Spark Plugs over the past 50 years and the best I've found are NGK's and the best of the NGK's are:
NGK Iridium IX part # XR4IX, Stock # 7189 Best price is on line from Rock Auto Parts at about $6 Each. Click on below: I've used this plug in 201 and 226 Allis engines with excellent success. Set the gap at .035". They last practically forever. It will be the last set of plugs you put in your tractor.
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Steve in NJ ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Andover, NJ Points: 11926 |
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Seems like a lot of people are overlooking something here. What's causing the fouling? Is it oil? Fuel? Poor Ignition? Timing off? A lot of these issues cause a plug to foul one way or the other. Yeah, heat has a lot to do with engine performance and operation, but all the other variables that I mentioned about have to be taken into consideration. Is the plug fouled with oil? If so, you need to look into where the loss of oil control is. Maybe valve guides. Maybe the engine needs a valve job. Possibly rings. A tired worn out engine can foul plugs all day. Low compression. These engines already have low compression, Now its even lower cause it's tired. How bout' a high float? Hey, that'll foul not only one plug but maybe two. What I'm getting at here is just throwing in a certain mfr's plug ain't gonna cut it if there is a problem causing it. I always tell my customer's, if you use a certain mfrs spark plug and have good luck with it, there might not be anything wrong with the engine causing the fouling because the engine has been running great. On the other hand, you can go through 6 different types of plugs and still have the fouling issue. Gotta' get to the root cause of why the fouling occurs. Once you found the culprit, you can select a certain heat range of plug that works the best in that particular engine. And remember, engines are like people, they all operate differently from one another, so one type of plug may work in one 125 or 226 engine, and that same plug may not work as well in another of the same size and type..... HTH Steve@B&B
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39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife
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Ed (Ont) ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 08 Nov 2009 Location: New Lowell, Ont Points: 1429 |
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My WD45 has lived most of it's life on used Camaro and Chevelle plugs which at the time were AC44 or AC43. My brother and I changed plugs in our cars at least once a year. Then they usually got cleaned up a bit and ended up in the WD45.Worked great and dad had no problem with saving some money at that time. Doesn't take a real fancy plug to fire a 6.5 compression motor.
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AveryD12 ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 05 Mar 2018 Location: Foxworth.MS Points: 117 |
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I admit there are one or more underlying causes of the fouling. When I pull the plug to clean it up It has oil on it. It probably needs rings or a head reworked. Among other things. It’s old and tired just like me. I was just looking for what I had hoped would be an inexpensive fix to keep it running a few more years. Then I won’t need it anymore. Thanks for all the comments. I am always amazed at the information that can be gleaned from this site. Makes me realize how little I know about tractors.
Thanks again, Avery |
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estout81 ![]() Bronze Level ![]() Joined: 15 Mar 2022 Location: Utica Ohio Points: 34 |
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There are anti-foul things that will help. It looks like a spark plug with the guts knocked out and tapped for a plug to be screwed in. Keeps the plug out of the oil. As a note, I use AC45s in my WC and AC45XLs in my D17IV.
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