D21 issues

hello!
we pull with a D21 up here in Canada and seem to have a lot of issues trying to get this thing to be competitive. the tractor has a stock 426 , 450 roosa .93 lines CDS 4.21 injectors and a off the shelf s300 .88 housing, class rules are 3100 rpm 10500 weight and no speed limit. this tractor weight around 9500 with me on it . issue is we seem to always be last around the IH and deere guys, I don't need to be first just would like to make this allis competitive! my first question would be the cylinder head, is there a better head to run other than the old D21 head? what kind of supply pressure can I run to the injection pump ? timing? we seem to start strong then run out of steam but never get under the turbo while running in 6th gear. if we move to 5th we spin out any help would be much appreciate as we have been pulling our hair out with this allis for 2 years now. no one up here builds Allis's so info is few in far between

If you never get under the turbo in 6th gear (9.5 MPH), I don't know why you'd think dropping to 5th gear (6.5 MPH) would be a good idea or get you any farther down the track.  You are probably at least 40 cubic inches smaller than your Red and Green competitors, and at 1 HP per cube, that's 40 HP. Cylinder head isn't your first concern.....more fuel ( hard to do with what you've got) and a better camshaft, (which would probably require notching piston tops) would be up pretty high on my list. I used to run an HX-50 Holset with the small exhaust housing with similar pump and injectors and that would be a step-up from an S-300. Also a 7060 OEM intercooler with ice water flowing thru it will help too.

Sorry if I was being a little unclear lol , we run 20.8 38 field and roads at 20% if we run In 6th gear we snuff out around 250 on a good clay track , in fifth we spin out at 235 or so , as far as cam and cutting pistons that's no problem the guy that builds my tractor runs a very got 466 in his 1086 and can do Any machining we need .. Who would you recommend for cams? Or what specs on a cam? We are looking at doing the 200 psi feed on the pump over the winter and hopefully getting closer to 400 ccs of fuel
Thanks again guys!
Oh also we have a roush double disc springer clutch and needled rear diff so that should be good lol

injpumped from this forum runs a supper strong ac 210

7040 wrote: injpumped from this forum runs a supper strong ac 210

thanks for the plug! To me it sounds like your pump is not all it could be. The injectors are a little short on size as well. My Roosa .450's lay down 400+cc, and I do NOT use a hi pressure external pump. I use a black Holley 815 pump at 15psi. My guess, is someone built you a .450 pump, and put everything in the stock D21 6 degree housing. pm me if need any help. Ed.

After reading the rules it's even worse than I thought. If I read right an IH with a 466 C.I. engine can legally run a 15mm rotary pump and a 3 1/2 X 2 3/4 inlet turbo. A Deere with a 466 can run an inline pump which is able to produce 600 plus cc's of fuel and the same turbo. You are stuck with a Roosa pump which might produce 400 cc's at 2000 engine RPM which will not spin the same turbo that the others most definitely can. The only way it could get worse is if it's an open RPM class which reduces the output of your pump even further. I would have a sit down if you have a rules meeting this year and ask for the same pump your competitors get to use at least. Not even close to fair for your AC the way the rules are written.

Edited by O.P.S. Heads - 10 Sep 2013 at 9:33pm

I am the President of the OTTPA for the remainder of the year. There was talk in that class of allowing A pumps across the board, but the group voted it down. There is no way an AC can compete in that class. You must have the original cast head. It is a red/green or maybe blue class....

At the very least they should allow you to update to a ambac pump. After all it was used on the 8000 series tractors, had you gone to allis in the 80's and wanted to buy a new complete 426, thats basically what you would have had to order, they didn't make the old 426 parts anymore .

Red and green go figure  its always a chalange to build an allis and when you do good ppl change the rules to let the other pos tractors get the upperhand   it happened to me with my pump turned all the way up on the xt i could win a few then they said 3000 rpm and 466 engine ???  well i cant farm and pull the same tractor any more    i just pulled it last saturday and in the 11500 i was 218' winner was 330' ih   in 13500 i was 173' winner was 290' jd    now come on people this aint at all fair   ill stick with the 17 i guess.

                                   Shawn

Would be but at the same time if your within a few feet of the guys that have a rotary and p pump that's awesome . We do this for fun and the crowd always gets a kick out of this allis that's good for us I just wanted to be closer to the red and green guys

How much money you willing to spend? I am in process of building out of field/hot farm puller and right now the head is getting massaged. After talking with Ed about fuel this is where I would start. My head magician is very confidant after putting in bigger valves and porting we will have 250 cubic feet per min. This is not a bad number compared to the red and greenies that flow 270 to 280 cfm with same work. If I were to ad block filler 280 to 300. I highly recommend bigger valves especially intake only 11% bigger than ex, should be 35%. Your ex manifold is pretty restrictive lots of meat on top of ports to grind off and shorten corners towards turbo, also noticed 7080 ports bigger than my 8050. Max of Simpson perf used to do this work not sure if he still does? He also would help with cam. If u are real crazy recast head for 11gs, the Canadian dollar is higher?! Another thing about Allis heads the valves are widely spaced so they get schrouded by cylinder walls so maybe bigger 4-3/4 bore = 540??? Just some ideas for ya good luck

As earlier mentioned it has a 450 roosa head, however would an ed built 450 pump improve this 21's performance,  or does everyone think this class is too far ahead of any Roosa fueled 426 Harvey to compete. . 

Edited by Beirnesy - 24 Aug 2016 at 5:31pm

I would definitely call Ed over at heritage diesel, he'll take care of you, he was able to get 380cc of fuel out of a 310 roosa for me on our 21, runs real hard, he had my injectors cut to 4-24 also, something else you can try is the roller rocker arms that Murphy's motor service sells, he designed and manufactures a 1:75 ratio rocker, kinda pricey at $550 but if u have to keep it stock appearing ever Lil bit helps, just check piston clearance, I think it made a difference, the engine rpms are a lot more crisp

I wouldn't bother with a rosa in that class.