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I got the WD! |
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Jacob (WI,ND)
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Kenmare, ND Points: 1246 |
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Posted: 17 Oct 2009 at 6:50pm |
Hi All,
This was the weekend, I went to check out the WD I told you about here:
Well, my collection is growing! My parents suprised me by meeting me there, and Dad had the trailer behind the truck. So in about half an hour from now it will be back in WI with my other tractors. To bad I'm out here in ND, LOL!
My relative Lela was happy to see it go to a good home where it will get the attention it deserves, since it hasn't since her husband died. I gave her 500$ for it, but she would have just about given it to me just to be in good hands kind of thing. That, and the barn that it was in is in really rough shape, and might not make it through the winter, so it would be really bad to see it get cruched by the barn.
About the tractor, its a 1950 WD. They have had it since the 70's when they got it at an auction. It has the front end loader and big bucket. We'll have to get the bucket on another trip, it didn't fit on the trailer. The only thing I can see is missing is the fenders and seat. It never had fenders since they had it, I'm thinking they were in the way of the loader. The seat they took off (but may still have, she has to look around) because it was cracked and pinched her husband butt, so she got this seat for him, LOL!
It does run, but like she told me, and mentioned in previous post, dosn't stay running long. Still got me stumped. We cleaned the fuel bowl, checked the tank (not rusty really, I was expecting it to be), fuel line, loosened gas cap (to eliminate vacuum), and took apart the carb. All looked clean. seem to be getting fuel. Good spark, both on wires and plugs (at least outside engine).
It starts up when pulled (starter dosn't work) but only runs for a little while and then dies like you turned the switch off. (there is no electics currently hooked up, so can't be electrical unless its something internal on the mag??)
It will then start right back up when pulled.
What is going on? Dad and I spent most of yesterday monkeying with it, and can't see why he dosn't run. Any suggestions welcome!
I got the original manual with it too.
The original spinout rims are both there (I found the one he took off in an outbuilding) but both need patching. The set of combine rims with it are a matching pare too. So I have two sets of rear rims/tires for it.
The one front rim is frankenstined (all welded up).
The other front tire is like brand new, still got stickers and nubbies on it.
He's got the pin hitch, not the snap coupler.
The correct plate on the manifold is missing, and three of the bolts are broken off in the manifold.
We kept it rinning long enough to see the hydrolics work, the rear arms go up. never did get to check the loader cylinders.
A few questions.
What kind of loader is this?
The big thing is to figgure out how to keep it running so we can move it around under it's own power.
Here is me and Lela, before we left today.
Thanks for any help and advice in advance!
Edited by Jacob (WI,ND) - 17 Oct 2009 at 6:51pm |
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Jacob Swanson
1920 6-12; 1925,1926 20-35 longfenders; 1925,1926 15-25's; 1927,1929 20-35 shortfenders; C; B's; IB; WC's; WD; WD45 |
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Dave(inMA)
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Grafton, MA Points: 2398 |
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Jacob, congratulations on getting the WD. It's great that you have given it a home. Can't help you with the loader, but I have a thought about the engine dying. The symptoms you describe sound as though the needle valve may be sticking in the carb so that only a small amount of gas gets through. If so, the bowl would fill up if the tractor is left to sit for a while, providing enough gas to start it and run for a short time. Then the engine would be looking for gas as the bowl wouldn't refill quickly enough. Try this:
1. disconnect fuel line at carb to see if there is a constant, good flow of gas.
2. reconnect fuel line and remove plug at bottom of the bowl - see what sort of fuel flow you have over time - let it run for at least as long as it takes for the engine to die.
3. if the fuel flows steadily over time, then I am wrong! If not, the carb needs cleaning - likely varnish from gas sitting there for some period of time.
Let us know how you make out.
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David Gantt N.C.
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: North Carolina Points: 379 |
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not a bad looking WD, I would unscrew the bowl out of the tank and look down the stem to see if it is about clodded up, sometimes a bug down in the stem will cause this, thanks for showing
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CTuckerNWIL
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: NW Illinois Points: 22823 |
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Sure sounds like a fuel starvation problem. If you have a good flow to the carb inlet, then do like Dave says and take the plug out of the boom of the carb and see if you get the same good flow. You should have a good solid stream continuously. Looks like a keeper as soon as you figure out how to make her run all day.
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http://www.ae-ta.com
Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
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CTuckerNWIL
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: NW Illinois Points: 22823 |
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Bottom not boom.
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http://www.ae-ta.com
Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
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Jacob (WI,ND)
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Kenmare, ND Points: 1246 |
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Thanks for the advice guys. I was leaning towards a fuel problem, but the sudden stop made me think electrical, but I have never heard of that problem with just a mag on it, I could understand if it was a short if hooked to the wiring system, etc... but it isin't, so.
I'll let Dad know that you all are thining gas too, and to try your suggestions. Mabey with any luck tommorow when he tinkers with it before he brings it to the woods, he will find something we missed today.
Any other suggestions or opinions welcome!
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Jacob Swanson
1920 6-12; 1925,1926 20-35 longfenders; 1925,1926 15-25's; 1927,1929 20-35 shortfenders; C; B's; IB; WC's; WD; WD45 |
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allischalmerguy
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Deep River, IA Points: 2880 |
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Enjoy the WD I have a 1950 and I really like it.
Pastor Mike |
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dannyraddatz
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Plainfield, Ill Points: 848 |
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Jacob,
It's always a proud day when a new tractor is on the way home with you. I have learned so much from the members on this site with help on our 1954 WD45. Good Luck with your new tractor! Here are my pictures of the first day of owning a WD45 Danny President's Day 2009 (1 year of work to buy this one) Presidents Day 2009 (1 year of work to buy this one) IMG]http://i577.photobucket.com/albums/ss212/dannyraddatz/MarchthruApril192009136-1.jpg[/IMG] Good Friday 2009 (1st day with Lift cylinders working) |
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Danny Raddatz
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dannyraddatz
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Plainfield, Ill Points: 848 |
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Danny Raddatz
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Bill Long
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Bel Air, MD Points: 4556 |
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Jacob, Wish I could help you with the loader. There were a lot made to fit the WD. If they used the WD hyd. they had to have a good ram since popping pressure was 3200 lbs. Also, they had to have a reserve oil tank to handle the low oil supply from the WD.
As to the tractor dying don't forget the gas tank. A tractor this old can have a bunch of junk that can clog the opening but will float away and let the tractor run for a bit later.
Looks like a good WD. You can really tell by the straight gear shift. Let us know how it goes. Great pictures.
Good Luck!
Bill Long
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Jacob (WI,ND)
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Kenmare, ND Points: 1246 |
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A couple of quick updates:
The WD, which is named Wayne because that is what they called it. Lela's husband was Wayne, so this was "Wayne's Dandy" because of the "WD" model. Anyway, it's home in Ashland, WI.
Dad monkeyed with it today in town before bringing it to the woods to meet the other Allis's. He adjusted the breaks, and cleaned "a couple of pounds of gunk off the break lock mechanism" so he could find it and use it now. I guess the breaks seem to work much better now, and we'll really know once it gets off the trailer and drives it around,
Which he should be able to do easer now, since he took the starter off and cleaned it up and took apart the switch and cleaned it up, so now the starter works, so we shouldn't have to pull start it. Yipee!
I conveyed the message about the fuel possibilities, so he will probably fiddle with that some more too. Then we can move onto other issues, LOL!
I'll probably have some more updates tonight once he unloads Wayne.
I thought it was funny that Mom mentioned that "now the barn is evened out, two boys and two girl tractors." Dad's "Allis" D15 II, my "Lil' Allis" C, "Frank" C, and now Wayne. We had a good laugh about that.
OH!, I have another question I ment to ask earler. When we could keep him running long enough to test drive it a few feet, I couldn't get him into 3rd gear. All the other gears I could. Any ideas? Thanks again!
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Jacob Swanson
1920 6-12; 1925,1926 20-35 longfenders; 1925,1926 15-25's; 1927,1929 20-35 shortfenders; C; B's; IB; WC's; WD; WD45 |
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Thad in AR.
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Arkansas Points: 9524 |
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Jacob first off I loved the first pic with the 50's chevy farm truck and late 50's ford pu truck and the wd and the barn. I also think you have a fuel problem abd I would make sure you pull the sediment bowl assembly completely out of the tank and clean it good. I once had a d14 do the same thing from an acorn in the tank. It would let a small stream of gas through but it wasn't enough. I also wonder if the coil in the mag could do this? I have had it happen on dist. systems that the coil would get hot and break down. Good luck and keep us posted.
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Jacob (WI,ND)
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Kenmare, ND Points: 1246 |
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Hi all,
I just talked to Dad, and him and my brother just unloaded and parked Wayne with the other tractors. Instead of monkeying with a battery, they just pull started him for this time, and limped him back since he is still not running continually yet. We're almost certain that its a fuel problem now, just need the time to work on it more later. I'll be going home in two weeks, for Halloween, so hopefully if the weather holds out I'll be able to get the kinks out of the fuel system then (if Dad dosent get to it before then). Then mabey I can play with him a little.
The breaks worked good Dad said, it even suprised him how easy it was to adjust them he said.
On another note, Dad brought Frank's carb out to me this weekend, so I can go through that so mabey I can get him running good to for Halloween weekend. A lot of the same symptoms, runs and then dies, so a fuel issue we think. We have gone through the rest of the system on that tractor, so it has to be the carb there. The tank was taken off, cleaned, fuel bowl pulled off, cleaned, line cleaned and all look good, but still acted up, and again time ran out, so I didn't get to the carb then. I'll keep you all posted though...
Question about the manifolds on WD's. There should be a metal plate over that hole on the side of the manifold right? There is a piece bolted on there that is not correct now. Is there anything special to that plate? Just make a piece that fits? And I assume there should be a lead like gasket seal behind it to seal it to the manifold? Any words of wisdom there?
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Jacob Swanson
1920 6-12; 1925,1926 20-35 longfenders; 1925,1926 15-25's; 1927,1929 20-35 shortfenders; C; B's; IB; WC's; WD; WD45 |
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Jacob (WI,ND)
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Kenmare, ND Points: 1246 |
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Another question:
In this pic is the strap iron piece that is bolted to the bottom of the steering post, and runs parellel with the shifter just an added on piece of garbage? If not, what is it? It dosn't appear to have orange paint on it.
Edited by Jacob (WI,ND) - 18 Oct 2009 at 5:38pm |
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Jacob Swanson
1920 6-12; 1925,1926 20-35 longfenders; 1925,1926 15-25's; 1927,1929 20-35 shortfenders; C; B's; IB; WC's; WD; WD45 |
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Dakota Dave
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: ND Points: 3960 |
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Might want to pull the cap off the mag and look. Usually a fuel problem will sputter when dying. I've had a couple mags that would die, when I took them apart a rivet head was floating around inside. when it got between the Magnet and field it would short and die. If you turned it over a few times it would restart and run.
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LouSWPA
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Clinton, Pa Points: 24345 |
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Jacob,
in ref to the strap metal fastened to the steering post support, I have a WD that came with a piece very similiar, that has a valve mounted on it ti isolate the loader from the rear lift. Can't say if it is "origional" or not
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Dean(IA)
Silver Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: NE Iowa Points: 430 |
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That strap by the steering wheel is most likely a strap to support
a Heat Houser, where the framework under the windshield goes. |
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Gerald J.
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Hamilton Co, IA Points: 5636 |
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There may be a screen on the back of the fuel inlet adapter at the carburetor. That is known to clog and also give the short run symptom.
You can check for fuel starvation by pulling on the choke when its dying. If it recovers for a few seconds, its running out of fuel in the carburetor. Gerald J. |
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Jay-IND
Silver Level Joined: 15 Sep 2009 Location: Greensburg, Ind Points: 55 |
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that IS a heat huaser bracket. I have one exactly like it on my 45. I has been on there since 1967. Have FUN !!!
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Allen Dilg
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: NE IL Points: 820 |
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Heres the Skinny on fuel starvation. You need a 3/8" pipe plug, adjustable wrench, coffee can, remove fuel line at the sediment bowl, loosen the sediment assy with the can in place, let it some, install the pipe plug in tank, clean the sediment assy, make a screen out of fine mesh like the round mesh filter, roll it up like a cigarette and bend the top, insert in the top of the sediment assy and reinstall. pour most of the gas back into tank, check for crap in bottom of can.
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Freewheelin
Silver Level Joined: 29 Sep 2009 Points: 60 |
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Had the same problem with my WD a couple years back. Knew it was a fuel problem so checked and cleaned everything including the carb. Would run for various periods of time then die. Finally took a flashlight and looked into the tank. Hmmm something silver in there. The cap seal from a plastic bottle, probably Stabil. It was just the right size to cover the outlet hole. So keep looking, you'll find it. Be thankful you don't have to replace the brake shoes. That job would make the Pope cuss.
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Jacob (WI,ND)
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Kenmare, ND Points: 1246 |
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Hi all,
I have some updates! I was home for a long weekend on halloween, and I had a chance to work on the tractors. The weather just barely held out.
I got both of the "dead" tractors running, but I'll focus on Wayne here.
I went out on thursday afternoon and took off the gas tank, fuel line, carb, air cleaner, lights, and brought them to my parents place and cleaned the tank, line and carb up. We went back out on Friday and after putting the fuel system back on Wayne, he poped right off after a few cranks! And ran good too! I almost couldn't believe it!
I took him for a test drive to the road and back (good 1/2 mile) and after a little tweaking with the power jet on the carb, he didn't miss a beat! I couldn't be happier, unless, of course I could have had more time to play with him. But I had to go back to work.
I also descovered the hand clutch will need attention. It dosen't have good "snap" and likes to disengauge itself if you hit a bump or something.
Next was the job of narrowing him up, so he'd fit in the barn for the winter. We swaped out the spin out rim for the combine rim (until I can patch the spin out rims up). But before I took it off, I thought I would try the eccentic block bolts to see if by any chance they would move. By golly, they all came loose and I could actually spin the rim in and out! I couldn't believe it, I would have thought they'd be rusted stuck. A guy gets lucky every now and then.
So with the rear end narrower, I moved to the front. The adjustable wide front was set out really far, and we wanted, and needed, it narrow. So out came the PB Blaster and wrenches. Again, suprisingly, everything came loose with out much of a fight. The Right side tie rod was stubborn though. The tube half must have a slight bend or kink or something in it, because no matter how much lube and cleaning I did, it would not slide in all the way. So out came the block of firewood and sledge hammer to "purswade" it in. That did the trick. Not looking forward to taking it apart some day, but we needed it in for now, LOL!
Got the loader cylinders off to take home (parents) to rebuild, right side leaked like no other.
Then we reshuffled the tractors to get everyone under cover for the winter. Boy, there is no room to wiggle in the barn anymore. We need to expand!
All in all a good weekend!
Here are some pics!
And I have a video, but it's so big I'm having problems getting it on the web. If I succeed, I'll post it.
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Jacob Swanson
1920 6-12; 1925,1926 20-35 longfenders; 1925,1926 15-25's; 1927,1929 20-35 shortfenders; C; B's; IB; WC's; WD; WD45 |
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Max(ia)
Orange Level Joined: 15 Sep 2009 Location: Polk County,Ia Points: 536 |
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Enjoyed your update, Jacob. Had your ambition at one time. lol
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Dave(inMA)
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Grafton, MA Points: 2398 |
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Jacob - sure glad to hear that you've conquered the dying engine issue! Enjoy that tractor.
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WC, CA, D14, WD45
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Jacob (WI,ND)
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Kenmare, ND Points: 1246 |
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Hi all,
I just wanted to bump this back to the top to see of anyone could ID the loader? I can't find any tags, etc... to tell what it is. And I figgure knowing what it is might make finding new seals for the hydrolic cylinders easer, since they need to be replaced before the loader can be used.
There are reminants of red paint on it, if that helps any?
Thanks!
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Jacob Swanson
1920 6-12; 1925,1926 20-35 longfenders; 1925,1926 15-25's; 1927,1929 20-35 shortfenders; C; B's; IB; WC's; WD; WD45 |
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CTuckerNWIL
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: NW Illinois Points: 22823 |
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That loader looks like a Freeman that somebody extended the arms on. The sub frame looks home made. A freeman sub frame would have the top pivot point 18 inches forward of the unit you have. You might be able to tighten the packings on the cylinders, if not I believe they will have a chevron type packing inside the top end. These are readily available from people like Motion Industries. Of course new chevron seals won't last if the cylinder rods aren't smooth. Charlie
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http://www.ae-ta.com
Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
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norm [ind]
Orange Level Joined: 16 Sep 2009 Location: BOURBON,IN. Points: 667 |
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no problem with clutch [hand] turn the washer inside and adjust for snap with shims
1-574-342-4545 for more info.
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Jacob (WI,ND)
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Kenmare, ND Points: 1246 |
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Hi all,
I had my sister (my computer teckie) help me, and I think I got the video thing figgured out.
If this works, it should be a video here of me crank starting my 1950 WD Wayne.
Of course, the time she videod me, he didn't wana pop right off like he did before, LOL! Usually it only takes a few cranks..... This time, what, like 20?! ,but instead of editing it down, I'd show how it goes sometimes. If this goes good, I'll have more videos in the future...
Oh, and thats my Grandpa you see and hear in the background. Bud was his brother.
[TUBE]4rPkYRPFVPM[/TUBE]
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Jacob Swanson
1920 6-12; 1925,1926 20-35 longfenders; 1925,1926 15-25's; 1927,1929 20-35 shortfenders; C; B's; IB; WC's; WD; WD45 |
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Bob D. (La)
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Louisiana Points: 25529 |
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Sometimesthey do that to you, especially if you have an audience. Thanks for posting God Bless.
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When you find yourself in a hole,PUT DOWN THE SHOVEL!!!
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Jacob (WI,ND)
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Kenmare, ND Points: 1246 |
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Hi all,
I finally have some time for some belated updates, this has been a busy week!
When I was home for the Thanksgiving holiday, I got to spend some quality time working on Wayne with my Dad and brother. Got some things accomplished, and found more problems...
I got the engine oil changed first, and a new oil filter. But that begins the questions. According to the manual, the engine takes 6 quarts of oil. So I added 6 quarts. started it up, waited for the oil filter to get saturated and build some pressure on the gauge again. Then checked the dipstick. Not even to the low level mark, hummm? Added some more oil, thinking it must just need a little bit more. Ended up adding a full quart more and still just barely to the low level mark on the dipstick? What is up wih this? As far as I can tell, its not leaking out anywhere, and dosn't burn oil I don't think (don't smoke). Is it common to have to add more than what the manual states of 6 quarts? Is it possible the dipstick was changed? Anyone have a measurment of how long there WD dipstick is (to full and low mark range lines) to check mine? And I noticed that when I put the dipstick back in the engine while the engine was running, it felt like it hit something moving inside the engine. Is something wrong? What could it be hitting? I'm not really framiliar with the internals of this size engine yet.
Then we moved on to the shifting tower. As you may remember, when I got the tractor, I could not shift into 3rd gear. Everything else worked fine. So I took the shifting tower off and brought it to town and inspected it. Everything looked good, no rust, crust, or worn parts. With the exeption of the little sheet metal splash shield, which was no longer spot welded together where it once was.
So we clamped it back where it should be, and welded it back together. cleaned it all up and made a new gasket, took it back to the woods, and put it back on the tractor. Shifted like a dream!
That little splash guard piece was just gamming things up inside because it wasn't being held in the right spot. Once it was in the right spot, vala! No more problem!
Then we took the battery box tray off, and removed the top cover to look in the hand clutch to see what that looked like, and to see if we could figgure out why the hand clutch dosn't work quite right.
Again, everything looked pretty good, and clean (for an old tractor) not rusty, or crusty. Found the shims on the clutch to adjust it. Dosn't look like any have been taken out ever. There are a couple of "thick" ones and a "shim pack" of "little ones". We opted to not tackle this at this time though (short on time), but know what to expect when we have more time.
But the big question I think I know the answer to, and don't want to hear the answer to....
While checking out the wet clutch, and engauging, and disengauging to see how everything worked inside (with engine off) we noticed the bearing going forward to the engine end of the tractor moves front to back in the casting when you engauge and disengauge the wet clutch (the whole bearing). I assume it should NOT do this. What does this mean? I really don't want to hear that the whole shebang will have to be taken apart to fix this. Is it going to hurt anything to run it this way?
Could this be what is making the noise when the wet clutch is disengauged and the handle is all the way forward, you can hear a drag or strain on something?
Then we drained the hydrolic oil. Put new in. Once the system got all the "burps" out of itself, it worked good (pump still needs to be adjusted to "hold" better) I just need more time to do these things, LOL!
Then drained the wet clutch, tranny, differential oil. Put new in. That took the right amount of oil. Why can't the engine be more like this, ha ha! Did find a few flat metal shavings of various sizes in the differential compartment oil though.... Like pieces of thin sheetmetal sometings-or-others. The biggest about the size of your pinkey finger nail. Not thick chunks like gear teeth or anything, just thin stuff. What could these be from? Anything to be REALLY concerned about?
Then took the hood off, and tried to take the radiator grill off, but didn't finish that. I asssume you have to loosen the bottom bolts of the radiator to get the sheet metal grill out? This must be what is still holding it in place. Ran out of time.
Then we discovered some more problems. Once the hood was off, and we could see more of the radiator, we found that it needs some SERIOUS help. The overflow tube is broken off at the neck. The metal shroud around the fan is basically just dangling there, flopping around. One of the top hood bolts was too long and was rubbing the top of the radiator and basically wore a hole right threw it. And it is in general crusty, and needs to be cleaned up and patched.
But the good news is that once I take the radiator off, then I can put the right size fan belt on and get the generator working right again!
Then we looked at the manifold closer since the hood was off. It really needs help too, which we knew, but now know more! Two of the ports where the exaust goes to the block are missing there gaskets. So I'm going to have to take the whole manifold off and replace the gaskets, and while off, fix the hole where the square plate should bolt on where the muffler should bolt to. The plate is missing (a piece of junk is currently bolted there with one bolt) and that is because three of the four bolts are briken off in the manifold. I'll have to get them out.
Who has the manifold gaskets and gasket for the muffler square plate when that time comes?
I think that about wraps up the progress on Wayne for that weekend.
Thanks in advance for any help and advice, I know I asked a lot of questions today!
Edited by Jacob (WI,ND) - 05 Dec 2009 at 11:17am |
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Jacob Swanson
1920 6-12; 1925,1926 20-35 longfenders; 1925,1926 15-25's; 1927,1929 20-35 shortfenders; C; B's; IB; WC's; WD; WD45 |
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