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cwgage 
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Joined: 03 May 2022
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 Topic: 190XT pump timing
Posted: 03 May 2022 at 1:34pm |
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I have a 190XT that I recently put a low hour engine out of a generator in. I’m a IH guy and didn’t know a ton about AC engines going in, and didn’t know about Roosamaster pumps liking to fail when run after sitting a long time. Long story short, I had the pump rebuilt, and now I can’t for the life of me get it to run. It’s timing related, I’ve eliminated everything else. I know it’s got to be timed to 26 degrees advanced, and it there. The tractor will blow some blue smoke and sounds like it wants to fire, but just cranks. I’m stumped. Help please
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SteveM C/IL
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Shelbyville IL
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Posted: 03 May 2022 at 2:33pm |
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So did you align timing marks in pump window before removal and then NOT turn engine while pump was off? I think its possible to force pump on 180 out but not sure.
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cwgage
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Posted: 03 May 2022 at 3:16pm |
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Yes, the pump was pulled, rebuilt, and I re lined up the marks. Everything’s where it should be according to what I’ve seen online and in what’s left of my shop book for it. I’m honestly stumped. I’ve done pumps on 400 series IH engines before and never had a problem.
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CORLEWFARM
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Posted: 03 May 2022 at 5:04pm |
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180 out they turn 1/2 SPEED of engine
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orangefor life
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Posted: 03 May 2022 at 6:00pm |
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your timing problem out 180 degrees. Did you check timing marks on pump before you removed it ? .it got to fire on number one at 26 dg ,
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cwgage
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Posted: 03 May 2022 at 6:33pm |
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Thanks. I wasn’t the one who pulled the pump, my father was, and I’ve got it how he and the internet say to put it. I’ll try flipping it 180. That’s gotta be what it is.
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orangefor life
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Posted: 03 May 2022 at 6:46pm |
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They are tricky . i had a run in doing the same thing years ago ,you know young an know every think lol. Just Thinking out loud here I pulled number inj out hold my finger over the hole an crank easy till it blow my finger off the hole an check the timing mark on fly wheel degree an pulled the timing cover of the inj pump off it was off probley haft turn good luck
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orangefor life
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Posted: 03 May 2022 at 6:48pm |
 orangefor life wrote:
They are tricky . i had a run in doing the same thing years ago ,you know young an know every think lol. Just Thinking out loud here I pulled number one inj out hold my finger over the hole an crank easy till it blow my finger off the hole an check the timing mark on fly wheel degree an pulled the timing cover of the inj pump off it was off probley haft turn good luck |
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cwgage
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Posted: 03 May 2022 at 8:21pm |
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Thanks. I was planning on sticking a welding rod or somethin down the injector hole and watch till it was up. That probably a better idea than mine.
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SteveM C/IL
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
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Posted: 03 May 2022 at 9:15pm |
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I'd rather pull valve cover and see when #1 int & ex are both loose. #6 should have a tight pushrod. You are aligning the 2 marks inside pump right? Behind the little cover. Pointer and degrees on front should be @ 26 deg. Don't those have elastomer ring on pulley with timing marks? They can slip and move when old.
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injpumpEd
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Posted: 04 May 2022 at 9:27am |
cwgage wrote:
Thanks. I was planning on sticking a welding rod or somethin down the injector hole and watch till it was up. That probably a better idea than mine. |
above mentioned plugging the hole with finger, is the best method, because you know it's the compression stroke, not the exhaust. Just because piston is coming to top doesn't mean much lol! Dampener could have slipped.
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210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
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cwgage
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Posted: 04 May 2022 at 11:40am |
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Forgot to mention I pulled the valve cover off. Might be that that ring slipped too
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cwgage
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Posted: 04 May 2022 at 1:28pm |
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I hooked a timing light up and it’s way off. That ring must have slipped. Got it almost firing right now. Playing with it a couple teeth at a time
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injpumpEd
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Posted: 04 May 2022 at 1:31pm |
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A timing light on a Roosa is almost useless. The only way it is accurate is if you were loading it on the dyno to full load, then the roosa pump is at true beginning of injection. It will get you close though. I'd guess about 15* BTDC idling on a timing light. Pull the injector, use the welding rod trick to verify tdc mark on pulley. It's not exact, but it will tell you if it's slipped.
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210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
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cwgage
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Posted: 04 May 2022 at 1:38pm |
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Thanks will do
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SteveM C/IL
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Posted: 04 May 2022 at 2:01pm |
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If you determine the ring has slipped,you better replace it with a good one. Bad harmonics do bad things!
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cwgage
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Posted: 06 May 2022 at 1:27pm |
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As it turns out, Im stupid. The guy who rebuilt the pump for me left a sharpie mark on the pump shaft and o was using that as my pump timing mark. Thanks for all the advice anyways. On another note, after I had it running for a couple minutes, the pump shaft walked out. I’m not missing a trust bearing or anything to my knowledge. Any ideas why?
Edited by cwgage - 06 May 2022 at 1:42pm
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Alvin M
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Posted: 06 May 2022 at 2:03pm |
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In the end of shaft you should have spring and thrust button to keep the shaft in the pump
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cwgage
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Posted: 06 May 2022 at 2:15pm |
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Gotcha. Don’t have one. I’ll get my hands on one
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