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FREEDGUY 
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Joined: 15 Apr 2017
Location: South West Mich
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 Topic: E 10 VRS E85 ??
Posted: 07 Nov 2020 at 8:30pm |
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Drove past a station yesterday that had regular(E10) for $1.87 and E85 for $1.89. At what price/gallon do you guys call it a draw ??
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shameless dude
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Joined: 10 Apr 2017
Location: east NE
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Posted: 07 Nov 2020 at 8:35pm |
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i always heard that E85 was cheaper than regular gas, but didn't give as many MPG as regular gas, so i figgered it about evened out. i don't use E85 in any of my vehicles.
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Lars(wi)
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Posted: 07 Nov 2020 at 8:36pm |
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E85, is 85% alcohol, 15% gasoline, correct?
At the prices you stated, you would be getting royalty screwed buying E85.
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I tried to follow the science, but it was not there. I then followed the money, and that’s where I found the science.
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FREEDGUY
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Posted: 07 Nov 2020 at 8:53pm |
 Lars(wi) wrote:
E85, is 85% alcohol, 15% gasoline, correct?
At the prices you stated, you would be getting royalty screwed buying E85. |
My truck can't run the 85, and that's kind of what I thought pertaining to the trade-off in MPG for those that can/do. I'm all for the blended "gasoline" fuels but wasn't sure where the cut-off $/gallon was
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Lars(wi)
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Posted: 07 Nov 2020 at 9:15pm |
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None of our vehicles can use E85. The cut-off will vary depending on the price per gallon. It is not a static set amount, as the price increases, each additional gallon you use due to lower mpg, changes the equation.
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I tried to follow the science, but it was not there. I then followed the money, and that’s where I found the science.
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Coke
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Joined: 30 Sep 2018
Location: MIdwest
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Posted: 07 Nov 2020 at 9:31pm |
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I had a flex fuel car, HHR. But the mpg on E85 was so poor, I lost money every time I used it. The performance boost however was very noticeable.
I ran E15 in my Honda as it was post 2001, until one day I got a check engine light after fill up. I think it had too much ethanol blended in the code was a fuel issue. Once I got the tank half empty and added some regular it was fine.
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1957 D17 Diesel w/ M&W Pistons
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Bill_MN
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Posted: 08 Nov 2020 at 9:00am |
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Break even price for E85 is 20% below regular gas, above that is a loss due to the reduced mileage with E85. Have never seen E85 higher than gas personally, but they might as well not offer it at that price. There is a sweet spot I have found with multiple vehicles that E30 actually gives better performance and mileage with cost savings over gas, but you need a gas station with a blender pump and those are not very common outside MN.
Edited by Bill_MN - 08 Nov 2020 at 9:04am
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1951 WD #78283, 1918 Case 28x50 Thresher #76738, Case Centennial B 2x16 Plow
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IBWD MIke
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Joined: 08 Apr 2012
Location: Newton Ia.
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Posted: 08 Nov 2020 at 10:57am |
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Paging DaveKamp. Dave has explained this in detail before, pretty sure. Has to do with the BTU's in each fuel.
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Coke
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Posted: 08 Nov 2020 at 7:49pm |
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Hey Bill, how do they price that out?
I've seen pumps with multiple blends, like 15, 30, 60 or so, but never one where you could pick your own, that would be cool.
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1957 D17 Diesel w/ M&W Pistons
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Clay
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Posted: 09 Nov 2020 at 7:25pm |
Pure gas is best. Keep that damn ethanol out of my engines as much as possible. Can't burn it in an airplane either.
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FREEDGUY
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Posted: 09 Nov 2020 at 7:33pm |
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Clay, I do keep E-blends out of the small engines as much as possible, but E-10 seems to be a "sweet spot" for MPG's in the last 3 trucks that I've run , just my observation though.
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PaulB
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Posted: 09 Nov 2020 at 7:44pm |
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E85 make for powerful pulling engines when tuned properly.
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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY
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Coke
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Posted: 10 Nov 2020 at 2:47pm |
So, I'm on a tractor forum, and people are against the fuel that you grow, in favour of the one you have to pay some other country for?
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1957 D17 Diesel w/ M&W Pistons
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Tbone95
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Location: Michigan
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Posted: 11 Nov 2020 at 7:56am |
Coke wrote:
So, I'm on a tractor forum, and people are against the fuel that you grow, in favour of the one you have to pay some other country for?
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On the surface, your observation would seem contrarian. However, if you dig a little deeper, there are 2 main reasons why the tractor guys and farmers think this way. #1, are all the maintenance and longevity issues with dealing with ethanol. In a car, where you're usually turning over the fuel regularly, not such a big deal. And the car has self-tuning adjustments to deal with different fuels and still run well enough. Older tractors that sit with a tank of fuel for a long time OR need to make power and run great if they're still in farming use, is a different game. #2, the vast VAST majority of farmers and tractor-country folk are conservative. As such, they in general don't like the government choosing winners and creating false markets and such. Yes, it props the price of corn up for ethanol; the price of beans, sunflowers, Canola, etc. for biodiesel. But it's a battle most farmers will choose to fight.
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tomNE
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Posted: 11 Nov 2020 at 4:18pm |
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in my world; i use the figure of .65. the cheaper the gas price is, the more it narrows up! BUT beware! you can't take mileage on e-85 until the 4th fillup in the mileage check. takes that long to burn out the wrong mixture of gas and let the computer catch it's breath and get the right settings!
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AC from the start of my families farming career till the end!
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DougG
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Posted: 11 Nov 2020 at 4:40pm |
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How can e85 make any kind of hp in a performance engine ?? That stuff wont burn with a lighter held to it,, lol,, must have to spend more money just to make it happen ,
Edited by DougG - 11 Nov 2020 at 4:41pm
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Lars(wi)
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Posted: 11 Nov 2020 at 6:57pm |
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Not only that, the mpg goes down, more gallons used to accomplish the same task, the State collects more fuel tax because more gallons purchased. Taxpayer funds money losing ethanol plants, taxpayer’s stuck purchasing sub-par fuel. Taxpayer gets it in the shorts both ways, miserable bast*rds in government created a scam of all scams.
Edited by Lars(wi) - 11 Nov 2020 at 6:58pm
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I tried to follow the science, but it was not there. I then followed the money, and that’s where I found the science.
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Bill_MN
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Posted: 11 Nov 2020 at 8:27pm |
Coke wrote:
Hey Bill, how do they price that out?
I've seen pumps with multiple blends, like 15, 30, 60 or so, but never one where you could pick your own, that would be cool. |
You are thinking of the same thing Coke, the blender pumps will usually have E15, 20, 30, 50, and 85. The 30% is the one that seems to work best.
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1951 WD #78283, 1918 Case 28x50 Thresher #76738, Case Centennial B 2x16 Plow
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Mnfarmboy
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Posted: 13 Nov 2020 at 3:09pm |
I have a flex fuel Tundra, using E-85 drastically reduces service intervals. Cuts them in about 1/2. Dave
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 13 Nov 2020 at 3:16pm |
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how does ethanol change your service interval DRASTICALLY ?
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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FREEDGUY
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Posted: 13 Nov 2020 at 4:30pm |
I can't speak of performance with E85 as my current vehicle does not support it, but when E10 came out in the early '90's, the Dakota I was driving got 1 1/2- 2 MPG better than straight regular fuel  .
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Lars(wi)
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Posted: 13 Nov 2020 at 7:46pm |
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My late ‘90’s Ford Taurus’s always got better mpg on ethanol free gas, by over 2+ mpg.
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I tried to follow the science, but it was not there. I then followed the money, and that’s where I found the science.
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PaulB
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Location: Rocky Ridge Md
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Posted: 13 Nov 2020 at 7:55pm |
DougG wrote:
How can e85 make any kind of hp in a performance engine ?? That stuff wont burn with a lighter held to it,, lol,, must have to spend more money just to make it happen , |
How do you ask: The same way serious racers use methanol alcohol to make serious HP. Sure it takes a lot more fuel, so what, racing or pulling is NOT an economy run. E85 is 85% ethanol alcohol which blends well with gasoline unlike methanol. Where rules specify "pump gas" E85 has to be accepted as a legal fuel. E85 is equivalent to 105 octane race gas (racing gas is not considered pump gas) and allows a higher compression ratio than you can have if you are restricted to 93 octane gasoline. E85 and methanol will cool the intake charge to make the air going into the engine denser than can be achieved with any straight gasoline.
Edited by PaulB - 13 Nov 2020 at 7:58pm
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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY
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