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The bloody b almighty
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2011dandd View Drop Down
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Joined: 25 Jul 2018
Location: Northants uk
Points: 106 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2011dandd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: The bloody b almighty
    Posted: 16 Jun 2019 at 2:15pm
Hi folks I don’t want to bore you about a topic I have already covered. So if your not a fan of my posts you might be best to move on

Hot starting the b!! Whattttt the bejesus! Tried absolutely all sorts. I did 15 miles on it the other day without fault.

100m on it today then had to knock it off to tend to the kids being mental then tried to start It again, no chance.

Tried every trick I know learnt from here.

I don’t understand when other useres have posted about timing, if it starts when cold then it will start when hot? How can timings be the issue?

Please help!! At the point of starter conversion or being sold
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steve(ill) View Drop Down
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
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Points: 81065 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jun 2019 at 2:23pm
I would pull one plug and make sure it sparks when you crank it over.. Are you saying it runs fine when COLD...just hard to start when hot ? ......... normally has more to do with the coil ( mag) getting hot and open circuit... no spark then.
Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
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Points: 22823 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CTuckerNWIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jun 2019 at 6:16pm
What kind of ignition system does it have? If it has a MAG and the impulse spring is weak, magnets are weak or the coil isn't up to par, you could have problems starting when warm.
 If it has a distributor, it could be in need of bushings or the advance may be froze up.
 The advance changes the timing of the spark, kinda like the impulse does on a magneto. These things all need to work for proper hand cranking.
http://www.ae-ta.com
Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF
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MACK View Drop Down
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Does it not start or does it just don't over good enough to start?     MACK
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2011dandd View Drop Down
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Joined: 25 Jul 2018
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Points: 106 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2011dandd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jun 2019 at 3:41am
It’s a magneto ignition
When cold it starts lovely 2-3pulls no problem and almost faultless.

When trying to start it when it’s hot, for me it’s completely impossible, Im best to just leave it where it is and go back to start it the next day when it’s completely cold.

I’m at my wits end because I’m not enjoying it. It’s a shame. I need to get to the root of the problem. I will certainly investigate the magneto but I don’t really know what I’m doing on that.
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
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Not starting hot is often a sign of a bad coil.
AaronSEIA
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
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Points: 22443 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jaybmiller Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jun 2019 at 6:46am
It might be easier/cheaper/better to 'upgrade' to a 'points and coil' ignition system IF there's a starter....??

Since everything to do with start/running' is in the mag 'unit', it does seem it is the problem.

hmm. jusy an idea.simple test .. can you put a hairdryer or heat gun  next to the mag, turn on high BLOW( no heat !!), run for 10-15 minutes and then try to restart ?




Edited by jaybmiller - 17 Jun 2019 at 6:53am
3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)

Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
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Gerald J. View Drop Down
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
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Points: 5636 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jun 2019 at 9:38am
Shop manual and magneto manual may help the restoration process.

http://geraldj.networkiowa.com/Trees/Allis-Chalmers-G-B-C-CA-Service.pdf

http://geraldj.networkiowa.com/Trees/FM-Xmagneto.pdf

Gerald J.
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2011dandd View Drop Down
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Joined: 25 Jul 2018
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Originally posted by jaybmiller jaybmiller wrote:

It might be easier/cheaper/better to 'upgrade' to a 'points and coil' ignition system IF there's a starter....??

Since everything to do with start/running' is in the mag 'unit', it does seem it is the problem.

hmm. jusy an idea.simple test .. can you put a hairdryer or heat gun  next to the mag, turn on high BLOW( no heat !!), run for 10-15 minutes and then try to restart ?
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2011dandd View Drop Down
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Joined: 25 Jul 2018
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Points: 106 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2011dandd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jun 2019 at 3:47pm
I think it’s got to be something up with the mag.
Couldn’t get it started at all today.
I don’t currently have a starter motor it’s all just done of the crank handle alone.

I am certainly leaning towards a distributor, coil and starter conversion. Is this pretty straight forward?
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HoughMade View Drop Down
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Joined: 22 Sep 2017
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Do you have a battery on board already?
1951 B
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If you know for sure that the mag is the problem, replace it with a fresh rebuild. Keep it simple....
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steve(ill) View Drop Down
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Points: 81065 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jun 2019 at 4:22pm
my B use to die after an hour use when hot.... I could feel the mag and it was HOT... I could run a garden hose over it for 60 seconds, or pour a gallon of water slowly over the case and then it would start right back up... Try to COOL the mag CASE when hot and see if it restarts to confirm it is HEAT in the MAG that is a problem ( the fan blows hot air right at the mag.)

Edited by steve(ill) - 17 Jun 2019 at 4:23pm
Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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2011dandd View Drop Down
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Joined: 25 Jul 2018
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Points: 106 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2011dandd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jun 2019 at 4:35pm
Cheers guys.
Weird that it wouldn’t start at all today cold even. Got to be a mag problem.
Carb is rebuild and sound
Plugs are brand new
Leads brand new
Timing is spot on
Got to be mag on my mind.

I cannot be bothered to convert to battery and starter etc. Splitting to fit a ring gear etc, no time for that.
Guess I’m going to have to get the thing rebuilt. And as mentioned, keep it simple
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HoughMade View Drop Down
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Joined: 22 Sep 2017
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Points: 691 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HoughMade Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jun 2019 at 5:18pm
I agree.

I was getting at the fact that if you don't have a battery already, converting to a coil and distributor is going to be all the harder (not that you would have to add the electric start stuff).

Mine had somewhat similar symptoms and I found that a rebuilt mag was the answers.
1951 B
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