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Bobo Husker
Silver Level Joined: 28 Nov 2016 Location: Muscoda, WI Points: 96 |
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Posted: 13 Dec 2018 at 5:49pm |
Wondering if I can get some advice on a girdle for a 301. What rpm's and hp should a guy think about putting one on.
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bsallis180
Silver Level Joined: 29 Jul 2013 Location: Pennsylvania Points: 209 |
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I guess it depends on what all you have bolted on but I can’t tell you at what the point you will need one but after the bottom comes out I can tell you, that you needed one. to do it right you need to take and cut the main caps off flat and make spacers to fit between the cap and bottom side on the girdle. Leave a few thousands between the oil pan rail and bottom side on the girdle to keep a little extra clamping force and room for silicone. I use grade 8 cat bolts threw the girdle, spacers, caps and in the block. After that’s all done it needs or should be line bored. If you don’t cut the caps off you can just use spacers out of round stock but that’s twice as much machine time. Or you can make Billit caps that are longer/ One piece to take up the room. All said and done with the spacers and line boreded I say you be just under or around 2k with the girdle and bolts line bored and read to build
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 20528 |
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The 301 will take a lot before you actually NEED a girdle. I think we got by on a diesel up to 800 HP with twin chargers before we added it to the bottom end, and only because we were going up towards the 1200 HP range in the future. We never experienced any type of a failure. Always have used 15W-40 oil with no additives of any kind. The newer the block and crank, the better, as strength was improving with each generation of blocks/cranks. You leave a lot to be asked here. Gas or diesel?? What size turbo or HP/RPM are you dealing with ??
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Bobo Husker
Silver Level Joined: 28 Nov 2016 Location: Muscoda, WI Points: 96 |
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Thank you for 5he input. It's a diesel. Thinking of up grading to an a-pump. Goal is 3600-4000 rpms. Running a HX40 currently.
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 20528 |
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As long as your main caps fit the block OK, I wouldn't do a girdle for what you are doing.
I'd be a lot more concerned about bending a stock (non-heat treated) connecting rod.
Edited by DrAllis - 14 Dec 2018 at 9:08am |
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Bobo Husker
Silver Level Joined: 28 Nov 2016 Location: Muscoda, WI Points: 96 |
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I do have hardened rods. FPV. Also head work, pistons cut, fire ringed and hardened push rods. Cam work as well. All by FPV.
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Bobo Husker
Silver Level Joined: 28 Nov 2016 Location: Muscoda, WI Points: 96 |
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FVP I mean.
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bsallis180
Silver Level Joined: 29 Jul 2013 Location: Pennsylvania Points: 209 |
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Are you able to run an intercooler?
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Bobo Husker
Silver Level Joined: 28 Nov 2016 Location: Muscoda, WI Points: 96 |
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Yes have frozen boost ice over air.
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Bobo Husker
Silver Level Joined: 28 Nov 2016 Location: Muscoda, WI Points: 96 |
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Last year ran 51psi exh 48 psi boost.
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bsallis180
Silver Level Joined: 29 Jul 2013 Location: Pennsylvania Points: 209 |
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Are you limited to a turbo size?
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Bobo Husker
Silver Level Joined: 28 Nov 2016 Location: Muscoda, WI Points: 96 |
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Nope, no limits for turbo.
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Acllss puller
Bronze Level Joined: 02 Oct 2013 Location: Ny Points: 181 |
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No need for girdle , had twins over 1000 hp 100 lbs boost no girdle never a problem ! Rods are a must . We also drilled and tapped the outside of block made the cam pressure lubed great investment seem to “free” up the motor ! Also had squirters for Pistons two .
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Bobo Husker
Silver Level Joined: 28 Nov 2016 Location: Muscoda, WI Points: 96 |
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What kind of oil pump did you run for that?
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Acllss puller
Bronze Level Joined: 02 Oct 2013 Location: Ny Points: 181 |
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The front drive ac oill pump you need the wide crank gear for it , provided more than enough oil pressure for all of it!
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Acllss puller
Bronze Level Joined: 02 Oct 2013 Location: Ny Points: 181 |
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So we oiled crank , pressure lubed cam and two turbos off that ac oil pump you need the oil pan to go with and the wide crank gear . I think I have all of those still here , might be interestedi in selling , I used the 200 twin oil filter setup to , t d off the back of it for feed to all that stuff .
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 20528 |
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To have the "wide" crankshaft gear, you must have a newer crankshaft for it to fit. You cannot install a wide gear on an old crankshaft.
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Acllss puller
Bronze Level Joined: 02 Oct 2013 Location: Ny Points: 181 |
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I have a crank with one on it to , also have a gas crank with shorter stroke done for one also will sell cheap no longer need lol
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Acllss puller
Bronze Level Joined: 02 Oct 2013 Location: Ny Points: 181 |
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Upgrade the turbo to like s300 or s366 with tight exhaust theirs way more potential that the hx40 !
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Bobo Husker
Silver Level Joined: 28 Nov 2016 Location: Muscoda, WI Points: 96 |
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So I have the "older" 301. A 65. Will your crank fit on my motor with out alot of machine work?
Is it a simple swap? Does it come with a dampener pulley. I'm being told that's my next worry. |
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tbran
Orange Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Paris Tn Points: 3297 |
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you will have a long term issue as yo are about to put hardened gears running on non hardened gear in the front. Find a say, 6000, 7000, or 200 AC tractor engine...as gear donors ..
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When told "it's not the money,it's the principle", remember, it's always the money..
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bsallis180
Silver Level Joined: 29 Jul 2013 Location: Pennsylvania Points: 209 |
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Putting a newer wide gear crank drive oil pan in a older block is the question? The front timing cover backing plate needs some material removed. And an adapter for the pump to attach to and has to be right to get your gear to gear back lash.and oil pan will have to be changed or modified. As well
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tbran
Orange Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Paris Tn Points: 3297 |
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AS STATED - I would find a 200 , 7000 or 7020 block and front cover depending on whether you are running a hyd pump or not... back when,,,, we ran twin chargers with the old bayonet pump - had to add an oil lube jet to the gear drive on the cam gear/pump gear to prevent wear as we noticed some wear occurring. A customer we helped with a gas had the same issue. We did not run piston cooling. The idea of pressurizing the cam is a good idea especially on the front cam brg.
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When told "it's not the money,it's the principle", remember, it's always the money..
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 20528 |
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I had one twin-turbo setup that we ran the turbo drain right in on top of those gears thru the tach drive/ignition distributer hole in the block. We always ran 15W-40 oil and didn't have any gear wear issues BUT, I could see it if using straight 40 wt oil and not having extra lube added to the gears.
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NEVER green
Orange Level Access Joined: 28 Feb 2013 Location: MN. Points: 7498 |
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Do the 426's have pressurized cam bearings? |
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2-8050 1-7080 6080 D-19 modelE & A 7040 R50
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 20528 |
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YES.
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Bobo Husker
Silver Level Joined: 28 Nov 2016 Location: Muscoda, WI Points: 96 |
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Would any body know of an available A-pump for a 301?
Also I'm being told an a-pump is more realistic for a 301? Vs p-pump? |
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bsallis180
Silver Level Joined: 29 Jul 2013 Location: Pennsylvania Points: 209 |
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One wen your trying to make it on the block
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Bobo Husker
Silver Level Joined: 28 Nov 2016 Location: Muscoda, WI Points: 96 |
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??^^
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 20528 |
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Either an "A" pump or a "P" pump will require some grinding on the block and using three mounting bolts instead of four.
And if you use a "P" pump be sure to make a mounting bracket to secure/support the rear of that long heavy pump.
Edited by DrAllis - 05 Jan 2019 at 8:25am |
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