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difference between plows?

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Jeff(WC)(MI) View Drop Down
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    Posted: 17 Aug 2010 at 7:14am
whats the difference between say a 53 plow and a 63 plow?  i bought a 3-14 SC plow and i believe it to be a 53 but want to make sure before i start looking for a manual.....both lift arms have adjustments and the bottoms have moldboards and shins as opposed to just moldboards...i can post a pic later on
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Skyhighballoon(MO) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Skyhighballoon(MO) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2010 at 7:20am
Jeff - if the plow beams are vertical, it's a 53.  If they are slanted forward, it's a 63.  If they are slanted forward and the frame has adjustable holes to change between 14 and 16 inch width's, it's a 73...add spring trip bottoms to a 73 and it becomes an 83.  Mike
1981 Gleaner F2 Corn Plus w 13' flex
1968 Gleaner EIII w 10' & 330
1969 180 gas
1965 D17 S-IV gas
1963 D17 S-III gas
1956 WD45 gas NF PS
1956 All-Crop 66 Big Bin
303 wire baler, 716H, 712H mowers
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Jeff(WC)(MI) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeff(WC)(MI) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2010 at 7:25am
thanks Mike- i actually just found your post with pics on YT...i definately have a 53
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Brian F(IL) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian F(IL) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2010 at 8:01am
Mike,
Very well described definitions of the differences.
Brian F(IL)
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Gerald J. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2010 at 11:04am
Mike described the plow FRAMEs well. Plow bottoms fit all plow frames and were sold independent of the frames. At least the 60 through 80 families are covered in the same parts book while the associated plow bottoms (frog, landside, moldboard, shin, and share) are covered in a separate parts book. Its not possible to know which plow bottoms you have by knowing the model of the plow frame. Plow bottoms were made with different shapes for different soils and working conditions. Likely just for different local preferances where sometimes there was little difference in performance. Landsides tend to interchange the most, frogs, moldboards, and shins the least. Shares are sometimes shared between different plow bottoms, but not to a great extent. There were many different shares made of different materials and shapes for rocky or clean ground, with agressive tips to suck in better or short tips to keep from sucking in. Taking the available widths and share variations there might be a dozen share numbers to fit a popular bottom. And maybe ONE of those will be found in stock these days in the world.

Plow bottoms are occasionally identified comparing pictures with the plow bottom bookss, but more often by finding an AC part number on some component, like share, moldboard, or frog. At least one plow bottom has three vintages and three ways of holding the share on with both a welded and a cast frog that take different shares. The 125 which would be contemporary with the 60 plow family.

Gerald J.
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Bill Long View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bill Long Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2010 at 11:19am
Well done Mike and Gerald.  Yes the plow frame was sold as one unit and the bottoms were purchased separately.  Of course you always found a plow bottom that worked well in your area and that is what you purchased either cast iron or steel moldboards.
Of course it all came in a boxcar.  Funny, the heaviest part the plow frames were in the far corner from the center door.  No fork lifts and the like then just raw muscle - yes I had some then - and balance to get the parts out. 
All the dealers arrived at the rail yard together and loaded their plows and assisted each other.  Hard work.
You know, I watched someone load some Case IH tractors at the Delaware State fair.  It did not seem fair.  Had a large jerridan that just rolled back.  Drove the tractors on - at least three (holy cow) - then moved it to become a truck bed again.  Sooo easy.
Good Luck!
Bill Long
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R Aiken View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote R Aiken Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2010 at 3:11pm
Originally posted by Jeff(WC)(MI) Jeff(WC)(MI) wrote:

thanks Mike- i actually just found your post with pics on YT...i definately have a 53
A 53 plow is correct for a WD45, should look something like this one.
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Jeff(WC)(MI) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeff(WC)(MI) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2010 at 3:46pm
wow rich that looks familiar...that wouldn;t happen to be the one hitched to my tractor right now would it?
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Jeff(WC)(MI) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeff(WC)(MI) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2010 at 9:01pm
ok now since we know i have a 53...were cover boards ever available for them?  i looked in my plow parts books but didn;t find anything
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DREAM View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DREAM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2010 at 9:10pm
Hmm, I was just reading all of this good info. Suppose i bought a 2-14 trailer plow from, say, Ashley PA and brought it down to Elberton GA. Don't know how soil is around PA, but Elberton GA ain't called the Granite Capitol of the World for nothin.LOL! Soil is clay, usually hard as a rock, and full of rocks to boot. Just guessing, what kind of bottom setup would I most likely have on the plow, and how would that work here?
Just wondering if I need to start looking for some different plow parts.
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Gerald J. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2010 at 9:33pm
Cover boards I think were called moldboard extensions and would be in the plow bottoms book. Probably nearly common for all bottoms, but there might be variations in the mountings. Won't be in the plow frames parts book.

For rocky soil you'd want a share made for rocks, probably not a deep suck but steel rather than cast iron. And maybe not hardened steel. The other changes in shape probably were more local tradition than provable differences in plowing efficiency. I don't know where my plow manuals are at the moment, so I can't look up specifics. And with the plow bottoms book in hand I'd need to know what bottom because shares usually didn't share between different numbered bottoms and in the case of the 125 bottom, there were three different mouting methods for the shares, some didn't take wrenches to change. Shares were different for each of the mouting methods, sometimes and different for cast or welded frogs.

The common element is that the 9/16" bolts that hole the landsides and frogs to the plow frame shank have the same spacing on all plow frames so the plow bottoms can be moved around to find if there is really a difference in plowing from the shape of the moldboard.

Coulters were also in the plow bottoms book and came in a few styles that fit all plow frames between the frames having the same width bars and the coulter mounts being made to be very adjustable.

Gerald J.
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Jeff(WC)(MI) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeff(WC)(MI) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2010 at 7:11am
thanks gerald...i will check in my bottoms book tonight under extensions...i have that 3 book set so i will see what i can find
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Good Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2010 at 7:26am
Is the trash clearance the same?
B212,716,two 314H's,WC,WD,D19,190XT
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Gerald J. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2010 at 10:36am
Trash clearance is mostly set by the plow frame and the coulters. But some moldboards are longer than others which has to also affect trash clearance. A semi mounted like my 2000 clears trash much better than the long three point plow which tends to be closely coupled leaving little space for trash and so plugs easily if the corn stalks haven't been chopped and disked before plowing.

Gerald J.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Good Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2010 at 10:55am
I was considering height also in trash clearance. Didn't they change that in the different models?
B212,716,two 314H's,WC,WD,D19,190XT
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Gerald J. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2010 at 12:26pm
I think you had to go to the 9000 or the even later 2000 monobeam to get the frame significantly higher. I know on my 2000 that the bar for the coulter is mounted from the shank, and is a lot lower than the plow frame, giving more verttical clearance. The IH 720 was a plow that really has that vertical trash clearance. The shanks on the 80 might be longer than those on the 60 to give a little more clearance. That would show clearly in the snap coupler or three point hitch attachments at the front of the frame, but I don't know where my plow frame book is at the moment to look that up. Its in a box here somewhere, one of a couple hundred boxes.

Gerald J.
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Jeff(WC)(MI) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeff(WC)(MI) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2010 at 9:06pm
Gerald...i looked in my plow bottoms book...i have moldboard extensions on the plow already..the wings that come off the back of the moldboard...see Raikens picture..thats my plow i bought from him....but i think they call them in the book "trash coverer boards"  but it only lists them with the 60 series stuff...were they not available for the 53 plows?
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Gerald J. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2010 at 12:50am
The may not have been, I don't have data for the 50 frames and I don't remember whether some of my plow bottoms fit the 50. They called plow shares by more than one name in my bottoms book, and I'd expect that of the trash coverer boards. They likely are dependent on there being factory holes in the moldboard to mount them. You probably aren't going to drill a hardened face moldboard to mount them.

Gerald J.
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Jeff(WC)(MI) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeff(WC)(MI) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2010 at 6:58am
well i see they called them shares, bullets, etc....but the trash coverer boards were always called that and illustrated for the bottoms they were available for..but it seemed to all be for 60 series stuff....now would 60 series bottoms bolt to the 50 series plow so i could use those cover boards?   also i originally thought that the 50 series was for the wd and wd45 but i see in the book under 60 70 and 80 series they list all th tractors they are for and even include the b, c, ca, and wd's...probably for the 1,2,and 3 bottom 60 series?  so would a 60 series also be correct for a wd45?
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Bill(MO) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bill(MO) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2010 at 7:29am
Bill Long, sure brings back memories. I remember ordering a load
for 3-4 dealers and everything would be piled in a boxcar. Plows and planters were a nightmare to sort out and here in Mo it was usually 100
degrees or raining.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian F(IL) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2010 at 9:09am
This is my 1953 WD-45 and a #73 SC plow.  It has a tailwheel but you can't see it in the picture.  However, it does have the coverboards and moldboard extensions.  This was at the muddy Rantoul show last year.
 
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Gerald J. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2010 at 9:42am
I found my books overnight, though I wasn't looking hard for them.

Since the shank on the 50 plow frame is vertical and that on the 60, 70, and 80 tilts forward to fit angled bolt holes in the frog, I suspect plow bottoms that fit a 60 won't fit a 50.

Another way I see to get more trash coverage would be to use a jointer which mounts from the plow beam instead of the moldboard.

The 392 bottoms that I have used did a fine job of covering all the trash, especially when I pulled them at 5.5 mph where they tossed the dirt over and down so unless it was really wet, it crumbled leaving a level field for the most part.

Gerald J.
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