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rossinmich 
Bronze Level
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: West Michigan
Points: 187
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 Topic: frozen eccentrics
Posted: 19 Jun 2010 at 10:00pm |
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Need to loosen the eccentrics to spin the wheel in. I plan on using a torch as they are badly frozen and wont budge with penetrating oil. Is there any danger of damaging the tube or tire with the heat or anything I should be aware of in doing this? I need the wheel spun inward as prior owner had it spun out and then it stayed that way for who knows how long.
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DaveKamp
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Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Location: LeClaire, Ia
Points: 5816
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Posted: 19 Jun 2010 at 10:16pm |
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Everyone I've talked to, the universal response (and I suspect it's the result of experience) say to remove the wheel/tire assembly from the tractor, lay it down, unbolt the eccentric brackets from the wheel center... pull the center out, then knock the eccentric off the wheel with a sledgehammer, then put it in a vise, use heat, oil, and big wrench to free 'em.
I'm not looking forward to the task, but everyone agreed that if I attempt to unstick 'em IN situ, I'll dislike it even worse, and be twelve times-as-tired when I finally relent and pull the wheel center. <shrug>
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bluebanshee
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Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Points: 65
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Posted: 19 Jun 2010 at 10:43pm |
I had to do this the other day on my WD45. With the tire on the ground and the 2 bolts per clamp pieces are removed the center will pound out. The only way I could get them to loosen was to heat the clamps one at a time until nearly the whole thing was glowing. Once they cooled enough I melted wax into them and had to go forward and reverse maybe 30-40 times with a large impact gun. I did this when they were still at least 300F. I did sand blast them first, but I don't think it would make much of a difference. The eccentrics have a tight tolerance in the clamp even after they are cleaned up. I plan to moly paste them up before I put them back together. 
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GregLawlerMinn
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Lawler, Mn
Points: 1226
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Posted: 19 Jun 2010 at 11:18pm |
Best to remove the tire/rim as mentioned above. I am not a fan of using the heat wrench to get them loose and have found that soaking the eccentrics in your favorite paenetrating oil (I like a 50-50 mis of ATF/Acetone) and after removing the lock ring, use a shop press to get them to move and/or a good impact wrench. Link to a previous post on the subject below:
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What this country needs is more unemployed politicians-and lawyers.
Currently have: 1 D14 and a D15S2.
With new owners: 2Bs,9CAs,1WD,2 D12s,5D14s,3D15S2s, 2D17SIVs,D17D,1D19D;1 Unstyled WC
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bluebanshee
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Joined: 19 Jun 2010
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Posted: 20 Jun 2010 at 12:17am |
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Not a single one of mine budged after being sprayed with PB over a couple of days, smacking them back and fourth (attempting too) and a 1200 ft # rated gun. Not sure if a press would have pushed them out without breaking them. The shaft and wedge piece on mine are in fairly poor/very pitted shape.
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Ray
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Joined: 21 Sep 2009
Points: 1979
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Posted: 20 Jun 2010 at 6:22am |
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I have the eccentric brackets with the eccentrics in that work good with the two bolts that bolt to wheel. $12.50 each. Good,used,original 785-353-2392
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Jacob (WI,ND)
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Kenmare, ND
Points: 1247
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Posted: 20 Jun 2010 at 10:03am |
I must be lucky. On both my WD and WD45 and one spare rim, all of the eccentrics (all 20 between them) came loose with out much trouble. And neither had been moved in years, (although the WD was moved out by the previous owner in the 70's when he got the tractor, to make it more stable to mow ditches.)
Anyway, what I did was soak everything down with your favorite panther piss, in my case PB Blaster. After a good soaking, several times, find yourself a good heavy duty socket that fits the eccentric well. Regular old sockets will break (we have broke at least 2 of them) so use your replaceable craftsman ones, etc... Get a good strong (again replaceable one) breaker bar, and a big old cheater pipe. We got about a 3 footer. Assemble the getter-looser set up and put some good constant pressure on it. I have found (through the advice of some here) that a quick jerk won't break them free, but leaning on the pipe for a few seconds with steady pressure almost always pops them free! The reason being, it has been stuck there for a length of time, so it will require a length of time to break them free. We haven't had to use heat yet.
And once they move even a little, squirt with more oil, and work back and forth. Once you have movement, you're good, it's just getting to that point.
And for the record, taking them all apart is not a bad idea. I'll be doing this once I get around to restoring the tractors. I just wanted to move the wheels at this point.
Good luck, and let us know how you make out!
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Jacob Swanson
1920 6-12; 1925,1926 20-35 longfenders; 1925,1926 15-25's; 1927,1929 20-35 shortfenders; C; B's; IB; WC's; WD; WD45
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BobHnwO
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Joined: 16 Sep 2009
Location: Jenera Ohio
Points: 693
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Posted: 20 Jun 2010 at 10:13am |
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DO NOT HEAT RIM,TIRE COULD EXPLODE!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Why do today what you can put off til tomorrow.
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bluebanshee
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Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Points: 65
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Posted: 20 Jun 2010 at 12:30pm |
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Your right about using the craftsmen breaker bar, ours broke with a 5 foot pipe on the end. 3/4" should be the correct socket. Never had a single S&K impact socket break.
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TimNearFortWorth
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Joined: 12 Dec 2009
Points: 2014
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Posted: 20 Jun 2010 at 1:21pm |
Having just done this on my D15II recently, I can offer up some advice on how I loosened mine. Picked this tractor up near K.C. and Dave Maddux went along with me a couple of years ago. As my locks were frozen solid (rims pretty well shot as well), I decided to hit them with Kroil and try to turn them with a breaker bar; had no luck getting them to move. As the wheel spacing overlapped my A-C brush cutter, I smacked each one with a hammer from the outside once a month and gave them a shot (outside and inside) with PB Blaster. Kept cutting with this tractor and decided I would run the rims until they no longer would let the tubes hold air. Tried the breaker bar occasionally, but still no luck.
Decided to run by the local Good Year for a front tire repair recently and already had the tractor on my trailer; aired up the front to drive the tractor into the shop and asked if I could borrow their small impact and sockets while they installed a new tube on the front. Nothing moved on the eccentrics until I found which ones did not have full rail torque on them; those two broke, allowing the others to break very easily.
When the time comes to change the PAWs later this year, I know it will be a piece of cake as a buddy and I spun the rims in and out the next day by using a breaker bar in minutes. If you have the time and patience, they will break free, without damaging the hex on each lock.
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Bob-Maine
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Central Maine
Points: 922
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Posted: 20 Jun 2010 at 1:48pm |
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I have never been a fan of heat for these. In my railroad days, when heat was used on a frozen bolt, then tightened, it was never tight again. I think heat might soften the eccentric. Try to stick to "panther piss", tapping, torque and time. Bob@allisdowneast
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JimD
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Mounds, OK
Points: 2112
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Posted: 20 Jun 2010 at 4:36pm |
Since I always break them loose before selling, and I have sold more than a few, I'll jump in here.
#1 PB blaster is not the greatest penetrating oil. Try Kroil, or my favorite is Deep Creep
#2 Disassemble the rim. Trust me it's easier in the long run. I've used my 3/4" impact on the tractor with no gain, and pulled the ecentric and had it break loose in the vice with the same gun,
#3 Now that it's off the rim, you can get oil to a lot more of the friction points. Soak it well.
#4 Remove the snap ring, and press or drive out the pin.
#5 wire wheel it to a nice clean finish, coat with anti-seize and reassemble.
I mazke a point of spinning then rims on my working tractors every year. Just breaking it loose 1 time a year will make a difference.
Jim Danforth
Edited by JimD - 20 Jun 2010 at 9:00pm
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Brian Jasper co. Ia
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Prairie City Ia
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Posted: 20 Jun 2010 at 5:07pm |
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I agree with Jim D. PB Blaster is not good penetrating oil. It dries up sticky after a few hours. Once you have the wheel off the tractor and laying down and the clamp bolts out, It usually only takes a smack or two to get the center out. Once the center is out, the clamps will fall out too. Just having the tension off them is enough many times to get them loose.
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"Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford
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Calvin Schmidt
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Ontario Can.
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Posted: 20 Jun 2010 at 8:03pm |
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Last year I had to move the wheels on a WD-45 that a neighbour bought new and never moved the wheels. I was alone and short of time. I did the wheel removal, lay flat, and knock the center out routine but turned the center to the desired spot and reinstalled everything with the ecentrics still frozen. You need a good air impact and some tempory longer 5/8" bolts. It's a great originial tractor that will stay that way with the wheels in the same position.
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Nothing is impossible if it is properly financed
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j.w.freck
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Joined: 16 Sep 2009
Location: karnack texas
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Posted: 20 Jun 2010 at 8:07pm |
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jim...i agree with you,all it takes is to raise the tractor and remove all 4 of the eccentric locks and put them in a bucket of diesel fuel for a day.big vice and impact wrench.all you need i have freed up at least 15 wheel sets that way.dissasemble,clean and anti sieze..good to go
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