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Need generator specification

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max8176 View Drop Down
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Joined: 14 May 2022
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max8176 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Need generator specification
    Posted: 14 May 2022 at 7:21pm
Hi, anyone know where I can possible find the specification for this Allis Chalmers generator? Generator model is 649-T, serial# 49-11862 with spec#/ Cat# 1-7451-6786.
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steve(ill) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 May 2022 at 7:43pm
maybe 60 KW............. thats about 120 HP.

https://www.govdeals.com/index.cfm?fa=Main.Item&itemID=33&acctID=7522

some photos...




Edited by steve(ill) - 14 May 2022 at 7:57pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 May 2022 at 7:51pm
Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max8176 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 May 2022 at 9:49pm
Thanks but anyway I can verify it? I understand Allis Chalmer is just the motor but there are other components included, put together by another company, right? Will it say somewhere on the generator?
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steve(ill) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 May 2022 at 10:55pm
there SHOULD be a tag on the generator... Im sure it had one originally.  That size motor  "SHOULD" line up with a 60KW unit (generally).
Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max8176 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2022 at 12:49am
I am particularly looking for the weight of the existing generator. We are replacing the existing generator but also might need to replace the concrete curb which the generator is being sit on. Structural engineer wants to know the curb weight so they can compare with the new one if the existing concrete curb can accommodate the new generator. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DaveKamp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2022 at 12:59am
One could GUESS the output spec based on just the engine's horsepower, but that wouldn't be accurate without understanding the variables of circumstances.

First off, it's a diesel engine, but is it burning DIESEL fuel?  in stationary applications, it's equally common for the engine to be fueled by natural gas, in which case, it will be making significantly LESS power, and the generator unit will be derated for that circumstance.

Will it be operating at high altitude?  Generator sets are frequently identified with derating for higher altitude not just for thin-air horsepower reasons, but for thin air thermal-transfer of the generator windings and prime mover cooling system.

Generators made for low-altitude, foliage/swampy environments, will be insulated with special materials to reject fungus... the loss in thermal transfer as a result of those coatings will effectively reduce the cooling rate, thus, requiring a derate.


Finally, synchronous speed.  The engine may be capable of churning out 120hp at 2300rpm, when coupled directly to a 60-cycle synchronous generator, the shaft speed for the generator will NEVER be 2300... it would be 1800rpm for a 4-pole generator, or 1200rpm for a 6-pole, which means the engine's horsepower curve would be in some other realm... so a reduce in output as a result of that.

Nutshell answer, the generator's output is never MORE than the prime mover's output, it's usually substantially LESS.

When serious generator units are put into service, the output specs are usually identified in 'as-built' documentation based on all the aforementioned characteristics, AND others... and as part of commissioning, the unit is proof-tested before contract acceptance.

Lacking the machine's documentation, the best answer will be to look on the data tag inside the unit... as that's where the commissioned and proof-tested output will be identified.  IF you're very lucky, you'll open up one of the panels to find a copy of the documentation set inside a sealed metal compartment...

And I see you've clarified your question, narrowed it to weight.
Again, it's provisioning, you wouldn't find anything other than a 'range', because it depends on how it was fitted up.  All we could do, is 'wild guess'.  It'll be more than 3000, but probably less than 7000.


Edited by DaveKamp - 15 May 2022 at 1:03am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jaybmiller Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2022 at 6:29am
in the notes..... 'non piston cooled' ...
OK, I'm curious, WHAT does that mean ??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Codger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2022 at 8:17am
Originally posted by jaybmiller jaybmiller wrote:

in the notes..... 'non piston cooled' ...
OK, I'm curious, WHAT does that mean ??
No piston squirters on the underside cooling the piston crown. These usually are straight from an oil gallery internal to the cylinder block from the oil pump. 
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steve(ill) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2022 at 8:22am
cooling can be from water or oil... NORMALLY it is oil as mentioned above.



Edited by steve(ill) - 15 May 2022 at 8:23am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fjdrill Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2022 at 9:11am
You could contact Electro Motion in Fremont Ca.thats their badge on the gen set. According to their website they do swaps for your crazy state policies on CC.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jaybmiller Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2022 at 9:34am
thanks Steve.. man that coloured picture looks 'complicated' to make the parts,install and keep clean for good oil flow.....
at least today hasn't been a total loss.. I learned sumthin !!
Jay
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Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)

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