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D17 question
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TS2386 View Drop Down
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Joined: 31 Mar 2020
Location: MN
Points: 10 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TS2386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: D17 question
    Posted: 31 Mar 2020 at 3:03pm
Looking for help in troubleshooting a couple problems I am having with my D17. It is a 1967 and I believe it is a series 4. It has a Paulson loader on it. I’m having a couple issues with this tractor. The loader arms will only lift to about halfway. I’ve checked to make sure the fluid is at the correct level and I have inspected the valve for this and don’t see anything stuck in side there. I changed the filter and that didn’t help either. The hydraulics for tilting of the bucket work fine. The other issue I’m having is the 3 point hitch stays up while the tractor is running. If I idle the engine down about as low as it will go and have something hooked onto the 3 point it will go down slowly. But as soon as I idle the tractor up at all the 3 point goes up and won’t come down. Any help is appreciated and thank you in advance.
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Stan R View Drop Down
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Joined: 03 Dec 2009
Location: MA
Points: 960 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stan R Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Mar 2020 at 5:42pm
There are two fill ports on the D17 IV. Hydraulics is the one with a 1 1/4' (??) tall fill port which is located in front of the seat between your legs. Is this where you added oil?
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Joined: 31 Mar 2020
Location: MN
Points: 10 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TS2386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Mar 2020 at 6:01pm
Yes I fill in front and left of shifter. Other one is a much bigger cap and smells like gear oil
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MACK View Drop Down
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Joined: 17 Nov 2009
Points: 7664 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MACK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Mar 2020 at 9:27pm
Sounds like you are using position control or traction booster lever for 3 point. Need more info. Has it been working OK and quit? Just put loader on? Does loader have it's own valve or using tractor valve?       MACK
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Joined: 31 Mar 2020
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Points: 10 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TS2386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Apr 2020 at 8:08pm
update. I figured out the problem with the 3 point tonight. I had a stuck valve. It was the valve for the drift control I believe. Still can’t figure out the loader problem. The loader was on this tractor when I got it. The previous owner said the loader lifted all the way up and then one day would only go half way up. Appreciate the help
And any info.
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Joined: 31 Mar 2020
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Points: 10 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TS2386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Apr 2020 at 8:10pm
Sorry Mack forgot to answer your question about loader. The tractor has 5 control levers on it. There’s a row of 3 in front and then 2 in the back. 2 up front control the loader and the 3rd moves the 3 point up and down. The 2 levers in the back I was told are for drift and traction. I’ve never used them yet and am still learning this tractor
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Joined: 26 Aug 2015
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Points: 405 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Travis2766 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Apr 2020 at 9:20pm
When you checked the hydraulic level were the lift arms for the three point up or down? If the arms are down the lift cylinders are retracted and all the extra oil from them is in the reservoir. When you start the tractor or idle up with the lift arm issues your having the arms get raised, that takes oil from the reservoir and lowers the oil level. The oil should be checked with the arms up, sounds like the lift arm problem could be causing a false reading on the hydraulic oil and you are actually low on hydraulic oil.
190XT Series III, D17 Series IV, D15 Series II, All Crop 66 and a whole mess of equipment.
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Joined: 17 Nov 2009
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Does it stop going up suddenly or slow and stop. Does it stop at exactly the same place every time?      MACK
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Joined: 31 Mar 2020
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Points: 10 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TS2386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Apr 2020 at 7:41am
Thanks for the responses guys. I checked the hydraulic level when it was up i do believe. I will check again today. Do I want to check the level when the loader is raised up? I would think there would be fluid in them and then my reservoir would be low. The loader goes up and stops in the same place every time. And stops suddenly as if the cylinders are fully extended but they aren’t. When it stops raising it bogs the engine down.
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
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Points: 1682 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joe(TX) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2020 at 5:32pm
If the engine bogs down, it sounds like the loader lift cylinders are fully extended. Have they ever extended further?
1970 190XT, 1973 200, 1962 D-19 Diesel, 1979 7010, 1957 WD45, 1950 WD, 1961 D17, Speed Patrol, D14, All crop 66 big bin, 180 diesel, 1970 170 diesel, FP80 forklift. Gleaner A
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Joined: 31 Mar 2020
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Points: 10 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TS2386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2020 at 10:39pm
The previous owner says it extended twice what it does now. The main barrel of the cylinder is roughly 26-28 inches long and the ram only comes out 13” so I think there’s a lot left to come out
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Joined: 12 May 2013
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Points: 4664 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WF owner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Apr 2020 at 6:21am
It sounds to me like you have some sort of internal damage in one of the lift cylinders. When it stops, does the loader show any sort of slight twist? If it does, the one that seems to stay lower could have a problem.

Can you remove the cylinders from the loader and try to extend them? That might show you which has a problem.
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Points: 20485 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Apr 2020 at 6:35am
Just disconnect the cylinders at the boom and lay them down on the axle to see if one can stroke farther than the other. Maybe set the bucket on a hayrack to allow more room to test. Just because you think they should stroke farther doesn't mean they should.
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Joined: 03 Mar 2018
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Points: 616 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Boss Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Apr 2020 at 6:42am
Do the lift cylinders have 2 hoses going to them or just one? If only one my guess would be there's oil trapped in the rod side stopping the cylinder from moving. 
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Points: 20485 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Apr 2020 at 6:46am
I think Boss Man has it figured out. Two-way rams with one hose, and missing a breather at the rod end.
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Joined: 31 Mar 2020
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Points: 10 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TS2386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Apr 2020 at 8:26am
The cylinders have a hose at each end. I have taken the rams off the loader and tried to run them out further to see if they both did the same thing. They went about one inch further than they did when the loader was attached. I could not get them to come back in without the help of a come-a-long. Seems like I need the weight of the loader to get the rams to retract back In. You wouldn’t think you need all that weight since there is a downward pressure hose on the cylinder
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
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Points: 288 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dave H (NE) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Apr 2020 at 8:42am
check your hose couplers. one is not opening
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Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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Points: 225 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pirlbeck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Apr 2020 at 8:43am
I would remove the coupler from the hose that comes from the rod end of the cylinder and put it in a bucket and then try it. I think you may be trapping oil on the rod end of the cylinder and that is stopping the cylinder movement. If the coupler is bad or if it is somehow plumbed wrong, or if you had a valve problem that would also keep the hydraulics from retracting the cylinder when it did not have the weight of the loader on it.
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Joined: 03 Mar 2018
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Points: 616 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Boss Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Apr 2020 at 10:09am
If your using the tractor hydraulics to extend and retract, the cylinders should retract on their own. There's either a coupler not functioning or a valve issue. I'm not real familiar with the hydraulics on these but the I & T manual states that the 3 valve stack has two double acting spools and one single acting. Any chance the lift cylinders are hooked to the single acting there fore not supplying oil to the rod side of the cylinders?
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Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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Points: 225 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pirlbeck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Apr 2020 at 10:51am
Originally posted by Boss Man Boss Man wrote:

If your using the tractor hydraulics to extend and retract, the cylinders should retract on their own. There's either a coupler not functioning or a valve issue. I'm not real familiar with the hydraulics on these but the I & T manual states that the 3 valve stack has two double acting spools and one single acting. Any chance the lift cylinders are hooked to the single acting there fore not supplying oil to the rod side of the cylinders?

I am pretty sure the single acting valve they are talking about would be the three point/snap coupler hitch valve.
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Joined: 31 Mar 2020
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Points: 10 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TS2386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Apr 2020 at 12:40pm
Thanks for responses guys. I will check these things and post back on the page with what I come up with. Pretty sure my 3 point is hooked to the single acting valve but not 100% sure.
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Points: 4664 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WF owner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Apr 2020 at 5:33pm
Any new info on this?
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Points: 10 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TS2386 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Apr 2020 at 10:09am
Update : the loader issue has been solved! After months of headache trying to figure out this problem it turned out to be something quite simple. Can’t believe This is what it turned out to be. A quick coupler on one of the hydraulic lines was not plugged in all the way causing the fluid to not have anywhere to go. The coupler appeared to be plugged in all the way and wasn’t leaking and I even pulled on it to check and didn’t pull out right away. After unlocking the collar and reinserting the coupler it snapped in that last little bit and fluid was able to flow again. The loader now lifts all the way up! This tractor wasn’t very useable to me before but now with the loader and 3 point working correctly I can really put this machine to use. Thanks for all the input and tips from
Everyone. It’s crazy how something so simple can be overlooked.
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