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bakwoodsfarm 
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 Topic: Anybody good at ac7050's problems?
Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 8:14pm |
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I have an Allis 7050 with hydr problems. Changed the suction and return filters, put about 10 gallons of hydrolic oil in, run it about 30 mins, the tractor's transmission over 1800rpm light come on and it will not pull, checked the hydro oil and none on the stick, no leaks. I AM LOST. put in about 5 more gallons of hydro and still none on the stick.
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Andrew(southernIL)
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 8:20pm |
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Welcome to the sight and there are many mechanics on here that will answer your question.
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jrjuday
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 8:23pm |
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This may be a dumb question, but, are you adding the oil to the opening on the rear housing of the tractor?
Edited by jrjuday - 02 Sep 2010 at 8:38pm
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bakwoodsfarm
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 8:35pm |
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Sure am. Thats where the dealer said to fill it.
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jrjuday
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 8:39pm |
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Unscrew the lower sight glass, and see if oil runs out.
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DrAllis
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 8:42pm |
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Transmission/clutch oil goes in the dipstick tube in the cab under the seat...fill until you are sure the oil level is correct on the dipstick.
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bakwoodsfarm
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 8:45pm |
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The problem started with the light coming on, then I smelled hot hydro oil, I stoped and it was running out the rubber cap on the rear-end. When I removed the cap, it shot hydro-oil up about 12 inches from the tube. I then replaced the filters and found the suction side stopped up. Replaced both filters and ran it for about 5 min. It was fine. Then I started to run it to mow hay and had about 5 rounds done when this happened. I will pull the sight glass off in the morning.If it is running out then what?
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bakwoodsfarm
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 8:46pm |
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I sure do thank yall, the dealer it no help here.
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bakwoodsfarm
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 8:49pm |
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When I changed the filters, I refilled the oil by pouring in the hole in the rear-end and the level came up on the dipstick. But it will not now.
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Joe(OH)
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 8:51pm |
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If its running out the bottom sight glass that means you are at the minimum fill level. I dont know a lot about 7050's. Any questions you have ask the Doc, he knows a lot.
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jrjuday
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 8:51pm |
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It just means you are not low on oil. Sometimes it can be hard for me to tell if oil is actually showing on the lower glass due to lighting conditions or the transparency of the oil. If you remove the glass, it's obvious whether you've got oil there or not.
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bakwoodsfarm
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 8:56pm |
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The dealer said that it is an open drive train. He said that means that oil goes in the engine and fuel in the tank and hydro-oil in everything else. Is this true? They said that everything from the trans to the rear-end is free-flowing between themselves.
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jrjuday
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 9:02pm |
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Uh oh, maybe I'm the "dipstick" here. Did the 7050 have a dipstick on the hydraulic fill or did it have the sight glasses like the 7045? Mine has a dipstick on the tranny fill tube in the cab, but none on the hydraulic fill.
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bakwoodsfarm
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 9:07pm |
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I think I'm the dipstick on here. I have a dipstick in the cab and sight glasses on the rear end. When I bought the tractor, the guy said he would have to drain fluid from somewhere and refill it somewhere else to make the tractor move again. I have had it for 2 years with no problems at all. The guy passed away this past spring.
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DrAllis
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 9:11pm |
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Your dealer doesn't know ANYTHING!! ..7010-20-30-40-45-50-60-80's are all the same. Transmission/clutch oil is in the cab under the seat with a dipstick and fill tube.....holds 7 1/2 gallons of oil. Rearend is the hydraulic system and fills using the sight glasses as the oil level gauge and holds 17 gallons of oil. If oil is disappearing from the front and going into the rearend, there is a serious problem and probably with the gerotor pump/steering pump is transferring the oil. The two compartments use the same type of oil but there are seperate from each other.
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jrjuday
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 9:15pm |
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The differential housing is the sump for the hydraulics. Oil should not transfer from the rear housing to the transmission housing, but it can happen if a seal or seals are leaking.
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bakwoodsfarm
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 9:18pm |
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My dealer could not even tell me how many gallons of oil it takes! Is the pumps your talking about under the belly of the tractor. I have 2 pumps mounted underneath. So there is no quick-fix? I was thinking it was some internal seal between them, but the exploded veiw shows nothing.
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jrjuday
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 9:42pm |
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There are actually three pumps, piggy-backed on one common shaft. The rear one is recessed into the range transmission housing. Dr. Allis would know what has to be done if oil is being transfered from one sump to another. I'm better at breaking than fixing.
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Dave in il
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 9:57pm |
On the floor under the seat is a cap, pull it and check the dipstick. If the oil there gets too low the tractor won't move. If there is a bad seal or other leak the fluid from this compartment can transfer to the rear hydraulic resivor and would cause the overfilling you described. If you fill to the full mark and the tractor works and when it stops the level is low / not showing you are transferring fluid.
When filling the rear hydrualics, sometimes the rear site gauges are foggy or stained and hard to see through. Partially unscrew (just loosen) the upper sight guage in the rear housing, if fluid comes out the resivor is full.
Did you replace the cartridge type filters on each side of the differential? There are "doors" that are supposed to swing closed to keep all the fluid from running out when you pull the filters, I had one of these come off and it would plug the flow to my steering.
Hope this helps.
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bakwoodsfarm
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 10:03pm |
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I did replace the two cartridge filters but did not see any type of door, the fluid was free flowing. I got about 17-18 gallons out of the suction side before it stopped flowing.
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DREAM
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 10:15pm |
Welcome to the site!
I'm just putting my 2 cents worth in here, because i'm NOT an authority on anything made after 1950(actually, i'm not an authority on those either, just a tinkerer). It sounds like the tractor had this problem with the previous owner. What I think he was saying was that he would drain some oil out of the diff. housing, and fill the trans/ clutch housing. That means you are transferring oil between the two systems, which should not be happenning. If you need to finish mowing, drain down the diff. housing to the correct level, then fill the trans housing through the dipstick tube under the seat until it reads full. It sounds like it has been doing this for some time, so maybe you can get through this haying, but I would definitely tear into it come winter. I think the problem would only get worse. An agravating job now, but much worse to have to replace REALLY expensive and hard to find parts if it runs to failure. Just my opinion. Dr. Allis is the authority here. You can pretty much take what he says to the bank. SamT is also good. He worked for AC as a tech for over 10 years, and still works on all brands. Good luck!
Edited by DREAM - 02 Sep 2010 at 10:16pm
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jrjuday
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 10:16pm |
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There are check valves that are "supposed" to prevent losing more than about 3 quarts of oil when removing the filters. If you lost 17 gallons, something is amiss.
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bakwoodsfarm
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 10:19pm |
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My thing is, the previous owner had this problem, but I have run it for 2 years and this is the only time I have had this problem. I really thank everyone for this feedback, it really helps.
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Dave in il
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 10:28pm |
 DREAM wrote:
Welcome to the site!
I'm just putting my 2 cents worth in here, because i'm NOT an authority on anything made after 1950(actually, i'm not an authority on those either, just a tinkerer). It sounds like the tractor had this problem with the previous owner. What I think he was saying was that he would drain some oil out of the diff. housing, and fill the trans/ clutch housing. That means you are transferring oil between the two systems, which should not be happenning. If you need to finish mowing, drain down the diff. housing to the correct level, then fill the trans housing through the dipstick tube under the seat until it reads full. It sounds like it has been doing this for some time, so maybe you can get through this haying, but I would definitely tear into it come winter. I think the problem would only get worse. An agravating job now, but much worse to have to replace REALLY expensive and hard to find parts if it runs to failure. Just my opinion. Dr. Allis is the authority here. You can pretty much take what he says to the bank. SamT is also good. He worked for AC as a tech for over 10 years, and still works on all brands. Good luck! |
It sounds like you have a more drastic problem but I know of a guy that cut the end off of a hydraulic hose and would plug the other end into a remote outlet and transfer fluid back into the front compartment, he only needed to do it a couple times a year.
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jrjuday
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Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 10:32pm |
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If I were computer savvy enough, I would scan and send you the trouble-shooting procedure from my manual. The 7000 series hydraulic systems, in my opinion, were pretty sophisticated and complex compared to the hundred and "D" series tractors. It had to be a HUGE challenge for those A-C mechanics to learn to diagnose and service them back then.
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Adam Stratton
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Posted: 03 Sep 2010 at 7:17am |
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Im not smart enough to know this for sure, but maybe someone else will latch on. You said you drained 17-18 gallons by removing the cartridge filters (the ones on each side of the rearend that have the little puller bolts?) Those dont work like drains on my 7045 when I changed it, They are only supposed to leak a quart or so. Something makes me think that fact should tell us something?! I am thinking you have a seal out somewhere letting oil get from the compartment under the cab to the rearend. If your tractor still has the metal shield underneath the cab, you might remove the 4-5 bolts and let it drop, and you might be able to look up underneath your tractor to get a better idea of how things go together. Good luck!
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Lonn
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Posted: 03 Sep 2010 at 8:14am |
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When you re done mowing take it to a good repair shop that really knows Allis. Otherwise you could end up with the same problem if "fixed" by just anyone. Uncle had his "fixed" and before he got it home it was stopped again on the road. Took it to the former AC dealer and now it's fine. Was just a seal in his case. My repair book describes it perfectly if I get time but if I were you I'd just get it over with and get it fixed right before you cook something else. Good luck.
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bakwoodsfarm
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Posted: 03 Sep 2010 at 12:26pm |
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I can do the work with no problem, I just don't know where to begin to look for the leak. I figure someone out there has had this problem and can tell me where to begin, then I can figure it out.
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skipwelte
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Posted: 03 Sep 2010 at 2:23pm |
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Trans to rear end transfer usually is between the gerotor pump and the gear pump. The gerotor pump is inside the trans, the gear pump is on the outside hooked to the gerotor. could also be the pinon shaft seal betweent the range trans and the differential,. Ive only had one of those apart for a seal, the rest have been between the pumps. On the hyd filters under the tractor, when you take the filters out the internal doors should shut and prevent all the oil from draining, maybe the door seal is gone or maybe the door is gone or broken, also both filters have a baffle that goes in the end to open the internal door when you slide the filters in. Maybe someone lost the baffle and took the door off. Good luck.
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bakwoodsfarm
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Posted: 03 Sep 2010 at 8:39pm |
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is that accessable from the outside or do I have to break the tractor? I got an exploded view of the filters and the door has been removed behind the filters.
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