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Anti freeze in oil on 7020 question.

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MN Dean View Drop Down
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    Posted: 17 Mar 2011 at 6:45pm

I have a 7020 that is giving me fits. I overhauled this engine quite a few years ago. I sold the tractor to a friend of my sons. Last fall they got it hot and now it is getting anti freeze in the oil. It appears to be burning most of it. I had 27 psi on the cooling system with the block heater plugged in for two weeks. Had the pan and the oil cooler lines off and no water leaked out any where. I took off the turbo to intake pipe and there was moisture in it so I had the intercooler tested. It leaked from the middle of the cooler only if I had 50 psi and hot water in it. The replacement did not. I put the whole thing back together, heated it with pressure again. No problem. I have been running it for a couple hours an am still getting steam out of the breather. My Question for you guys is what are the symtoms of a leaky copper injector sleave or is there somthing else that I am missing? I have no external leaks. If I pull the injectors will water show up when I crank it?

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Brian Jasper co. Ia View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian Jasper co. Ia Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2011 at 6:48pm
Is it steam or blowby fumes? Are you constantly adding coolant to it?
"Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hurst Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2011 at 7:01pm
Leaky injector sleeves is what turned out to be the problem on my 7000.  I guess it could show on top of the sleeve and in the sleeve itself if the top o ring is leaking, but if it's the bottom o ring leaking, like mine was, it will look a lot like a head gasket leak.  It will get hot, have compression bubbles in the radiator, and after a few hours, it will collect some coolant in the bottom of the pan.  That could be your problem, as it may only be leaking when you have compression in that certain cylinder causing the sleeve to be under a different load than when it is just sitting stationary with pressure in the coolant system (think of how the pressure differentials will be with compression vs without, they will be opposite).  Hope this helps.  I would pull the head and have it checked out by a shop or someone with the proper testing tools for that head.  It's not cheap to replace all those sleeves, so you want to make sure that's your problem before you start throwing money at it.

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1979 Allis Chalmers 7000
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MN Dean View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MN Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2011 at 7:06pm
I have just ran it idle for a couple hours after reassembleing it. I have condensation under the fill cap and a puddle of water under the breather. Anti freeze is down slightly but could just be getting air out of the system. The top end was cleaned up and the pan was off long enough to dry it all out. New oil and filters. The oil is starting to cloud.
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Tony Elo View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tony Elo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2011 at 7:08pm
what you can try to do is take off the oil pan,put pressure on the cooling system with a pressure tester and look around all the cylinder liners,look for coolant leaks
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MN Dean View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MN Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2011 at 7:12pm
Been there done that! Nothing out of the base of the sleves in two weeks with heat.
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MN Dean View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MN Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2011 at 7:17pm
Looks like the head must come off! I can't remember if I had new sleaves put in this one or not. I know I put them in the 7000 but this one I can't remember.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ncrc5315 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2011 at 7:18pm
With the oil pan off, let the tractor sit over night with NO Heat, then check around the base of the sleeves. Sometimes the o-rings will seal if they are warm. Try it both with pressure on the system, and with the cap off.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2011 at 7:20pm
If they got it HOT, the copper sleeves have probably loosened in the head and are leaking.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MN Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2011 at 7:35pm
I am reasonably sure it is not the cylinder sleeves. The tractor was apart for more than a month with pressure cold and hot and also no pressure at verious times. Also when they were loosing coolant most of it went somewhere other than the pan.
Thanks for all the replies. I hate to sell things and find out the people have problems with them.
While I have your attention, any one looking for a 5020 AC? I bought it new and sold it to my brother inlaw. He got some jobs mowing forclosed  properties and needs a zero turn to get them all done. The tractor has a 60" deck and a loader. 2wd turf tires. I will post it after iget some pictures.
Thanks again.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hurst Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2011 at 8:30pm
When the copper sleeves leak, most of the fluid will be burnt up, it's what washes past the cylinder walls that will make it to the pan.  If it gets bad you'll start to have a lot in the pan.

Hurst
1979 Allis Chalmers 7000
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MN Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2011 at 1:21pm
Update... The head is off. Two cylinders have pits in the head. One copper sleeve came out with the injector. One cylinder has some fresh rust around the sleeve in the chamber side of the head. I think the problem is found.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Larry B Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2011 at 7:26pm
what kind of money for the 5020 ?
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MN Dean View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MN Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Mar 2011 at 12:46pm
 He would like to get 5000$ but he is open to offers.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MN Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Mar 2011 at 5:12pm
Machinist just gave me the bad news. Its cracked around the injectors also.
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