Allis 8050 engine build

Easiest is to buy the adapter from Kcgrain on here. Pretty easy thatway. If you have the newer Dm roosamaster pump like on the 7000 series. What engine do you have in it? The old 426 that came in the 220?

Edited by peterson - 28 Apr 2015 at 9:09pm

No that would work fine for a stockish tractor. 4440 pumps have 9
5mm plungers with the timing retard notches. So you couldn't get much over 240-260hp.

Which engine series do you have? 3500?3500mk2 or 670? Because if its just a 3500 that came in the 220, I dont know if the pump would clear the oil cooler. See our 220 has a 670 from a combine in it.

That should be a 3500 engine. Then im not sure if the A-pump will clear the oil cooler on the side. you wouls have to do some measuring. Also then you couldn't use the adapter from Kcgrain either seeing the the stock 220 pump ont mounts with 3 holes. You would need to take the front plate off the engine and have it bored and drilled for the A-pump.

^^ ya i looked on the 21 today and no room. would it hurt to remove the cooler.? 

Well guys I finally got a 8070 air cleaner! Put it on and no more air filter light on the dash! lol

Yeah I've put about 32 hours on the engine so far. The pump off a 516 is actually a P-series bosch. It is bigger than the little A-pump. To fit a P-pump on the 426 you need to, looking from the front, cut off the lower right mounting ear so it clears the engine block. I have don't this on one of my other engines for mockup.

Ok lets look at the Ambac pump at a wear standpoint. First the ambac turns 1 to 1 with crank speed, now the A-pump turns half cran speed. So it should wear out half as fast. Now Fuel plunger, Ambac has one, and A-pump has 6. So really the Ambac wears out 6 times as fast. But most of the wear items all depend on how you change oil and filters. Keeping clean oil and fuel helps a lot. Now Starting, all I can say about that is that it starts better than the other two 8000's we have with the ambac pumps. Now Governor, I never knew how "lazy" the governor on the ambac was until I got this tractor together. All I can say is holy ! This tractor is some much more responsive in the field compared to the other two.

I guess I would have to call myself a believer in the in line pump being better than an ambac 100, even though I have not had any first hand experience to back it up : just reading testimonials. However, I now have my 8070 getting worked on by a guy who bleeds IH red, and when I told him about my thoughts of putting an in line on it, he asked me why did the ambac 100 work good on the IH's if it doesn't work good on allis's? I really didn't know how to answer that. Any one have any thoughts on this? Darrel

darrel in ND wrote: I guess I would have to call myself a believer in the in line pump being better than an ambac 100, even though I have not had any first hand experience to back it up : just reading testimonials. However, I now have my 8070 getting worked on by a guy who bleeds IH red, and when I told him about my thoughts of putting an in line on it, he asked me why did the ambac 100 work good on the IH's if it doesn't work good on allis's? I really didn't know how to answer that. Any one have any thoughts on this? Darrel

And why does the IH start good but AC doesn't?

DrAllis wrote: Any 8000 series (Am-Bach)starts better than any 7000 series (DM-4), and that is pretty much due to the injection pump. An IH starts better yet because it's 17 to 1 compression instead of 16 to 1 compression.

I have to disagree there. Both my 7060 and 7580 will out start my 8050. 7060 pump was done last winter (leak, nothing else wrong with it but overhauled the whole pump anyway) and the pump and injectors were done on my 8050 two years ago because it was (and still is) a gutless wonder at low RPM. So both pumps are good. My IH Hydro 70 as a Ambac 100 pump and it's a poor starter also, probably the worst I own. I've been thinking about either putting an inline pump on the 8050 or even going back to a Roosa Master DM4 pump if I could do it cheap because honestly I feel the switch to the Bosch 100 pump was a downgrade.

Well i can tell ya for a fact that our 220 that had a DM4631 from a 7080 that was rebuilt with a brand new engine would start 100% better than the new engine in our 8030 with a rebuilt pump and engine. New injectors in both, New everything. And yes throttle full forward in the 8030. This ambac was also rebuilt by Fair Valley Performance in Sauk city Wisconsin.

One reason they went to the ambac maybe that they would start better and smoke less, but main reason would more than likey be COST! That would be my thinking.

Kevin in WA wrote: What they should have done is use the A series inline on all 426 engines from 1973 on, as well as a number of other engine updates we have all talked about before.

I agree completely!

DrAllis wrote: And you see, there's always someone who disagrees. Once again, the reason A-C went to AmBach was to reduce smoke and start better when cold. That's a fact. Comparing engines that have differing hours of use on them isn't fair for starting ease. Also, the AmBach pump REQUIRES the hand throttle be wide open for the best starting and immediately cut back upon fire-up. Many Operators don't do that.

My 7060 has 3000 more hours on it than my 8050 and yet still starts much easier. 7580 has about 250 hours more than the 8050 also, so I guess hours aren't the issue here. I also read the decal on the dash right above the key in the 8050 instructing to start at full throttle and at first fire return to idle. So that's not the issue either. Same brand batteries, good cables on all three so that can't be it. Leaves me believing that a Rossa Master DM4 equipped 426 will start better cold than an Ambac 100 pump equipped 426.

Better cold starting and less smoke may have been what Allis told people as to why they changed pumps but I suspect Peterson has the real answer: cost, because my personal experiance with my own tractors tells me there is no advantage to me, the operator, by having an Ambac 100 pump over a DM4

I can't see how an M100 would be cheaper to buy than a DM-4.