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Joined: 02 Jun 2019
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Allis 301
    Posted: 22 Jun 2019 at 10:37am
Switched to the correct topic, Dr Allis did you have to use a gear reduction starter as it has a fairly high compression ratio and where would be a good place to get the right cam?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2019 at 1:10pm
I had this posted in the farm equipment forum which was incorrect
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bsallis180 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2019 at 2:24pm
I have been hunting for one also. With no luck but... a late seres 6080 starter works and I have not done it yet but a magnum starter off a 8.3 cummins if you rotate it counter clockwise one set of bolts it should work. But we have been running Lucas starters with no problems just get it gone over every two years.

As far as a cam. Going to need to give Doc some more info on the motor and class to know what you need.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jun 2019 at 6:00pm
This engine project is a Allis G 262.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2019 at 7:13am
A healthy factory stock OEM D-19 gas starter worked just fine for me, so I don't know why it wouldn't for you. You need a big battery, probably 880 CCA's and good sized battery cables that are clean. As far as the camshaft goes, you aren't going to "buy" one ready to go for an AC G-262 engine. You'll have to have yours reground to a different spec. That "grind spec" is determined by what RPM's you intend to run and to a degree the size of the carburetor and how much air the carb/manifold/cylinder head will flow. It's almost July 1st and the pulling season is usually over by Labor Day. Sounds to me like this will be a Winter project.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2019 at 8:09pm
Whats the best way to figure out the carb. /manifold cyl. head flow and yes this will be a winter project.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2019 at 10:33pm
The best way is to know your competition and the rules you will be expected to compete under. What RPM's will you be allowed?? What weight classes?? Does it have to remain stock OEM or can it be modified and to what degree?? It seems to me that all new pullers have grand ideas of wanting to be the champion and really have no idea how to get there and until you know what you are up against, you will surely be disappointed with the results.  A G-262 with very high compression, a "175" cam grind and a 190XT Bendix carb with a larger venturi will make more than 100 HP at 24-2500 RPM. So, is that ENOUGH ??  Well, if you are running against a 560 Farmall with a 301 engine that has been made into 450 cubes and a huge aircraft updraft carb running 4500 RPM's, you will get your hind end kicked all over the place.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2019 at 10:49pm
I have been tractor pulling 12+ years so I have a little bit of an idea how it works.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2019 at 6:03am
OK. So what are your rules and what is your competition ??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2019 at 11:05pm
All the stuff you mentioned is fine where I pull,except we can go to 3000 rpm this would be in the 4500lb class
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2019 at 11:12pm
And yes 100+ hp should be alright.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jul 2019 at 7:38pm
How much gap from top of piston to head on a G262 before there will be damage, would head studs be a good idea ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jul 2019 at 8:18pm
A distance of .350" including the head gasket would figure out to be 13.42 to 1 compression ratio and that is if the valves were flush with the head. Head studs would be fine but we never needed them, so do what you want.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jul 2019 at 9:31pm
Thanks Dr Allis, would you have any recommendations where to get the cam work done?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jul 2019 at 11:04pm
We used the AC 175 gas camshaft grind, which increased valve lift on both valves. Are there better cam grinds out there?? Probably. You will be limited to a degree by the high compression-ness of this engine with thin flat topped pistons, so cutting any valve reliefs into them would not be advised. Again, the RPM range you intend to operate it in has a lot to do with what cam grind works the best. Our engine always ran 3000 RPM or more and occasionally saw 4500 RPM. But, it was also capable of running pretty well at 2400 to 2500 RPM if the rules of the day dictated that. The size of the carb throat and intake manifolds ability to flow air/fuel mixture also plays into the cam lift/grind/timing. We used a 190 XT Bendix carb and later on went to the Deere 7700 combine carb.  If you intend on using the Power Director clutch like an IH "TA", this would open the doors to possibly a different grind versus "let her lug to the end". Use of the Power Director clutch can be enhanced by changing internal gears under the fuel tank to make the speed change 20% instead of the D-19's terrible 35% change.  Berry Cam from Lester Prairie, Minnesota is who I used 20+ yrs ago, but in the last yr I know of at least one cam grind they managed to screw up for a puller on this website.  You have to decide how you intend to operate this engine and what rules (RPM) you have to contend with. Also, don't forget I had to use the thicker diesel head gasket to help get the compression distance that was needed. I'm thinking that gasket was .090" thick ?? I gotta get to bed. Tractor Pull tomorrow at 11 am.

Edited by DrAllis - 03 Jul 2019 at 11:06pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jul 2019 at 9:09pm
How did your A-C do at the tractor pull Dr Allis,I am thinking you must have a A-C tractor.What kind of tractor or tractors you have for pulling ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DougG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jul 2019 at 10:08am
Dr has some good stuff and is involved with some nice 180,s and 190,s , Id luv to hear some stories on the twin spinners !
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jul 2019 at 8:01pm
Sounds like he runs nice tractors.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jul 2019 at 3:48pm
Some one offered me a used soild copper head gasket from a G 262,would that be something I should use or should I get a new one ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bsallis180 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jul 2019 at 6:10pm
I don’t see the need for the use of a copper head gasket and the use of fire rings less this build is going to be a turbo motor
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jul 2019 at 6:41pm
This will not be a turbo motor, with the compression being 13-14 to 1 a regular head gasket will be sufficient ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tbran Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jul 2019 at 11:56pm
My 2 cents, with that compression one is about what the diesel was - and you can search and find volumes here on the issues with D262 head/gasket/head bolt/sleeve stand out -need for studs and on and on.
When told "it's not the money,it's the principle", remember, it's always the money..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jul 2019 at 7:21pm
Ok,will do some searching. Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bsallis180 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jul 2019 at 5:29am
I wouldn’t underestimate a good flat surface and the clamping force of a 9/16 bots on a naturally aspirated motor.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jul 2019 at 8:17am
Every two revolutions of a diesel engine, there is a full compression squeeze of the air because it is an open hole thru the intake manifold. Makes no difference on the RPM or load. A gas engine is only at full compression pressure when the throttle plate in the carb is 100% open, so when not under any load, the compression pressure is very low. I told you we never used anything special and never had ANY trouble. Just a diesel head gasket (painted with copper coat)and OEM head bolts and retorqued after running down the track a couple of times when stone old. You go ahead and do whatever you want.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jul 2019 at 8:31pm
I know it is along time when you had your G262 Dr Allis,but do you remember what kind of spark plugs you where using?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jul 2019 at 8:48pm
AC Delco 42XL or 42XLS or 43XL or 43XLS.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2019 at 10:31pm
Dr Allis,we have started on the G262 project we installed 235 chevy pistons hoping we could use the used copper head but after some measuring we have .255" from top of piston to top of head gasket. What would the compression ratio be with that ,I am thinking I will need a thicker gasket .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Oct 2019 at 2:17pm
My math from a previous post said what the compression would be at .350" including the head gasket.  Your current dimension would be a lot higher than 13.42 and that was with zero valve protrusion.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fullpull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Oct 2019 at 7:09pm
Ok thanks Dr Allis,I will order a gasket to get to .350
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